I know, stupid title for this thread and I also have read enough that I probably won't understand several of the responses but it is a question that comes up in my mind sometimes and the song we are about to put into our set illustrates it very well so I am going to ask.

Ok the song is Time of the Season doesn't matter if you don't know it for illustration purposes.

This is the TAB (yes I know tab bad) that I got to get an idea of the notes and after playing it for a while acoustically since I don't have my amp here at home I just thought it sounded too tinny so I started playing it like in the second example. Still just E B D but what’s the difference? I guess what I am asking is why is the first tab right and the second one wrong, or is it.


G|----------------------------------|----------------------------------|
D|-2-----------2---------------0---|-2-----------2---------------0----|
A|-------------------------2--------|-------------------------2--------|
E|----------------------------------|----------------------------------|





G|----------------------------------|----------------------------------|
D|----------------------------------|----------------------------------|
A|-7----------7----------------5----|-7----------7----------------5----|
E|------------------------7---------|-------------------------7--------|

They are identical, same exact notes in the same octave, different tonal qualities dpending on where you play it but same notes.

As you pointed out, both tabs are the same E B D. They're both "right". Do you play with a pick? That would make it sound tinny. I can't remember the song off the top of my head, but play it however you want to get the tone you need.

:bassist:

I prefer not to use open strings, so I would play it the second way.

For some reason these replies leave me with the same feeling as being told there is no Santa Claus.

For some reason these replies leave me with the same feeling as being told there is no Santa Claus.


If you've only just realised that you can play the same notes, at different places on the neck...well, you have a long way to go!! ;)

But every journey starts somewhere.....:)

FWIW-
I play it like #2(& I do mean #2!).
The record, IIRC, sounds like example 2.

As far as playing same notes/different position-
Someone here once asked about "Badge"...they played the opening figure across THREE strings; the TAB showed the figure being played ONLY on the "E" & "A" strings. If you really listen closely, you will hear Bruce playing only on the "E" & "A" strings.
(In my youth, I also played it across 3 strings; seemed to read somewhere[Mel Bay?] that 'staying in position was important'. It is to a degree).

Also, any/every Latin/Reggae book suggests sticking t the "fatter' strings to catch the timbre/vibe of the exercise/line/figure.

If you've only just realised that you can play the same notes, at different places on the neck...well, you have a long way to go!! ;)

But every journey starts somewhere.....:)


No but I thought that each song SHOULD only be played in one position.

On the one hand it's like learning you have the freedom to fly.
On the other hand it's like finding yourself way up in the air with nothing to hold onto.

I don't read notation; OK well I can figure out what note is what and understand that quarter, half notes ect ect have different ways of writing the little squiggly things, it would just take me time to figure it out and I would need a chart of the notes for reference. I was under the impression that real musical notation would tell you where to play it on the neck.
Since I wouldn’t know if the notation was telling me where to play by reading it I was going under the assumption that nobody would write a song where you had to strike two fast notes, say eighth notes, 6 frets apart. If a tab asked me to do that I would just assume it was wrong as so many tabs are and just find the most convenient same note within a reasonable distance and play that instead.
90% of the songs I play with my band are Rock and Blues covers so I play in the G C A D block with some Bs and Fs thrown in for the most part. I hardly ever go above a B on the E string except maybe to play harmonics on the intro to Man of The World, by the way if anybody could tell me where the harmonic of B is I would appreciate it.
When it came to this particular song either of the two positions are easy enough logistically to play I just felt from knowing the song that the second one sounded better. Even the break (? Don’t know if that what it is called) works well in either position so I was confused as to whether it could be played either way.

I was under the impression that real musical notation would tell you where to play it on the neck.
.

Well, logically that makes no sense, as the whole point is that musical notation isn't instrument-specific; so you can easily play a written piece on piano, guitar or bass - or marimba or whatever you want!! ;)

The good thing about this is that it makes you think about music - not where you are putting your hands/fingers - so you get used to relating note production to a sound and not a mechanical act! :)

As to harmonics - you can play any note anywhere, as an artficial harmonic - just make sure you are stopping the string (creating a node) roughly twelve frets above where you are fretting any B on the fingerboard, for example!! ;)

I think a lot of my problem is I don't really know what the different terms mean so it is difficult to explain situations like this.
On Harmonics question; do all notes have harmonics at 12 frets? I find the harmonic of B on the E or A string are just thuds as opposed to on the G string where It rings true.


thanks for the help by the way.
I am hoping somebody out there will barter for some lessons soon.

http://www.talkbass.com/forum/showthread.php?t=126886

I think a lot of my problem is I don't really know what the different terms mean so it is difficult to explain situations like this.
On Harmonics question; do all notes have harmonics at 12 frets? I find the harmonic of B on the E or A string are just thuds as opposed to on the G string where It rings true.


thanks for the help by the way.
I am hoping somebody out there will barter for some lessons soon.

http://www.talkbass.com/forum/showthread.php?t=126886

The natural harmonics on a string depend on the notes in the triad of that string, so on the E string, you have the harmonic on the 5th fret with is E, the fourth which is G#, and one the third which is B, E G# and B being the notes in the E major triad. The same is true for the other strings, A is A,C#, and E, D is D, F# and A, and G is G, B, and D. The B harmonic is also located on the fourth fret of the G string , in a different octave the the e string, which you already seem to have figured out

I prefer not to use open strings, so I would play it the second way.

Open strings are your friends!!!

i don't like open strings because you can't "shape" the tone as easily as you can on fingured notes.

i used to date a violinist and she showed me a cool trick to fake vibrato on an open string.

just vibrato the octave without playing it!
neat effect!!!

Open strings are your friends!!!

...said Mr. Jamerson!


Glad to see you're still uprightin' it, 'Bo.

Some grooves require OPEN strings.
My first-ever bass book(Mel Bay) said "Do not use open strings".
I took that to heart for a long time, too.
No mas.

...said Mr. Jamerson!


Glad to see you're still uprightin' it, 'Bo.

Some grooves require OPEN strings.
My first-ever bass book(Mel Bay) said "Do not use open strings".
I took that to heart for a long time, too.
No mas.

I think it all depends and there are no rules. So , I remember when I was playing bass in the 80s, using a pick(!), bright stainless steel roundwounds, effects - then open strings jumped out at you like a sore thumb - nobody needed to tell you to avoid them - it was just common sense.

But now when I'm playing an EUB with big thick DB strings and struggling to pull across the strings with as much finger as I can - then open strings sound great and are an enormous help - in shifting positions quickly and checking intonation, for example.

They are a great help for learning to sight read music as well - so you have four notes that you can always find easily on the stave and then work around them.

Of course if you want to play a melody that requires expression or a groove that requires a deeper, more rounded tone, like a Tumbao - then play higher up the neck and avoid open strings - that's what 5-strings are made for!! ;)

I only avoid open strings cause it's harder to stop them. On the other hand a they do provide a place to fiddle with my tone or voluum knobs or scratch my...um... nose.

by the way if anybody could tell me where the harmonic of B is I would appreciate it.
.

Well the easiest answer, is above the 12th fret on the B string!! ;)

It is Rock and Roll, sometimes you can't get the right sound without playing sloppy. There are a lot of bass players that plucked with a thumb and fretted with one or two fingers.

Well the easiest answer, is above the 12th fret on the B string!! ;)

I'll just get me one of them ther washtub basses and put that B string on it for emergencies. Do they make fretted washtubs haha.?

I think I will stick with the 16th fret on the G string for that particular song, it sounds right.
Thanks for all the info


The natural harmonics on a string depend on the notes in the triad of that string, so on the E string, you have the harmonic on the 5th fret with is E, the fourth which is G#, and one the third which is B, E G# and B being the notes in the E major triad. The same is true for the other strings, A is A,C#, and E, D is D, F# and A, and G is G, B, and D. The B harmonic is also located on the fourth fret of the G string , in a different octave the the e string, which you already seem to have figured out


I have no idea what this means, I lost you after the word "the".

isn't the 5th fret on the E string an A?

...said Mr. Jamerson!


Glad to see you're still uprightin' it, 'Bo.

Some grooves require OPEN strings.
My first-ever bass book(Mel Bay) said "Do not use open strings".
I took that to heart for a long time, too.
No mas.

The electric hasn't been taken out of the gig bag for over six weeks. Just haven't used it. Only upright.

I just don't understand how people can't use the open strings. Man, they are truly your friends. The best. Position shifts, climbing the neck, they're good for so much.

I just don't understand how people can't use the open strings. Man, they are truly your friends. The best. Position shifts, climbing the neck, they're good for so much.

One reason I didn't use to use them much was because I was afraid of the tone getting muddy. If I played an open on one string and then moved down a string, it would sound awful if I didn't mute.

I have no idea what this means, I lost you after the word "the".

isn't the 5th fret on the E string an A?
He is talking about making harmonics on an open string. The easiest one is at the 12th fret. IT sounds the same pitch as if fretted because it divides the string length in half, just like the fretted note there does.

A false harmonic is when you fret a note with your left hand, count 12 frets up from that note, and play a harmonic with your right hand both plucking the note and 'stopping' the string. Stopping is holding your finger against the string lightly to make that harmonic chime.

Now, what he was talking about was making true harmonics. Since you mentioned that you found the 16th fret on G to be the clearest B, you are already doing what he was trying to tell you about. If you look for the places around the 5th, 4th, and really about 3 1/2th frets you will find you can play a major chord in only harmonics. That is the triad he was talking about. Practice playing harmonics at those frets. Then practice playing false harmonics that far above a fretted note.

If you know how to play a major scale ( A 'Major' scale is the one you will probably hum, if someone tells you to hum a scale) then you should notice that the notes all have certain amounts of space between them. Go back to Jazzbo's theory post. When it said 'root+t+t+s+t+t+t+octave' or something like that, t is a tone, that's two frets or one whole step. And s is a semitone. That's one fret or a half step. So a major scale is some note to start, go up two frets, up two frets, up one fret...etc.

Once you get used to thinking of those steps as numbers, ie the root is the 'one' of a key, the second note int the major scale of the key is the 'two', the third note in the scale is the 'three'...etc You will notice that if you take the root-third-fifth and play them together, you get a major chord. Those three steps of the scale together are a triad.

I hope this made more sense to you. If it didn't tell me what you don't get and I'll try again.

If you know how to play a major scale ( A 'Major' scale is the one you will probably hum, if someone tells you to hum a scale) then you should notice that the notes all have certain amounts of space between them. Go back to Jazzbo's theory post. When it said 'root+t+t+s+t+t+t+octave' or something like that, t is a tone, that's two frets or one whole step. And s is a semitone. That's one fret or a half step. So a major scale is some note to start, go up two frets, up two frets, up one fret...etc.

Once you get used to thinking of those steps as numbers, ie the root is the 'one' of a key, the second note int the major scale of the key is the 'two', the third note in the scale is the 'three'...etc You will notice that if you take the root-third-fifth and play them together, you get a major chord. Those three steps of the scale together are a triad.

I hope this made more sense to you. If it didn't tell me what you don't get and I'll try again.

First off YEAAAaaaa English!!!

Ok I have been reading lots of stuff on here trying to get a grasp of chords. The scale I can pretty much play anywhere on the neck for a good while now, that’s how I discovered Joy to the World, anyhow the chords still have me stumped.
Now take as an example major G chord, bear with me I am not even sure I am using the right name, root =C, 3rd = B, and 5th then is what D? If I am fretting the G on the E string wouldn't it be redundant to fret the B and the D on the A string at the same time? Or am I missing something obvious? This is why I am looking for a local bass player with the ability to show me stuff in person; I just need the visual/audio to get it I think.

Oh and by "together" you do mean hit the strings at the same time right not in sequence?


BIG EDIT

DUH, OPEN D STRING!

realy should have the bass on my lap when I think about this stuff.

By 'together' I did , in fact mean pay the root, third, and fifth, AT THE SAME TIME. Those three steps of the scale are a major chord, often called a triad.

If you play them in sequence, like 1-3-5-8-5-3-1 it is called an arpeggio. But if you play them as an arpeggio and let them ring out together then that becomes the chord.