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VIEW FULL LIVE VERSION : Scriabin's Mystic Chord
Aaron 10-05-2004, 01:54 PM I googled it and all I really found was that it is a fifthless C13#11 voiced in fourths, being derived from lydian dominant. Is that all there really is to it? Was it revolutionary for it's time? Can super-locrian in 6ths be known as Aaron's super chord?
Was it just the idea of voicing chords in 4ths rather than thirds, seconds, etc.? And lydian dominant worked well for that?
Shoka42 10-05-2004, 02:20 PM Ok.. Lydian dominant, I get, fifthless I get, but what is C13#11?
Aaron 10-05-2004, 03:24 PM Ok.. Lydian dominant, I get, fifthless I get, but what is C13#11?
C13#11 is a C dominant 7 chord with tension tones (color tones) 9, 11 (#11 in this case), and 13. when most people see C13, they ignore the 9th and 11th, though. It would be spelled (as a stack of thirds) C E G Bb D F# A - the tones being 1, 3, 5, b7, 9, #11, 13. Apparantly Scriabin put that chord (minus the fifth) as a stack of fourths. So it would be spelled - C F# Bb E A D - 1 #4 b7 3 (in an upper octave, though, so a 10) 13 9 (but in an upper octave - so if there was an interval called a 17th.)
As far as 7th chords/13th chords/etc. go, I had a prof make a good analogy. A C7 is like chicken, you can spice it up a little bit and throw in some tension tones (9th, 13th, etc.) but you still have chicken, but it is just chicken with pepper or chicken curry. Any dominant chord with a b9,#9, #11, b11, b13, or #13 can be notated as x7alt (for altered.) That pretty much says it's a dominant with some exotic spices.
dlloyd 10-06-2004, 03:48 AM I googled it and all I really found was that it is a fifthless C13#11 voiced in fourths, being derived from lydian dominant. Is that all there really is to it? Was it revolutionary for it's time? Can super-locrian in 6ths be known as Aaron's super chord?
Was it just the idea of voicing chords in 4ths rather than thirds, seconds, etc.? And lydian dominant worked well for that?
What's mystic about it?
Bruce Lindfield 10-06-2004, 04:38 AM There's a lot more to Scriabin's mystic vision and his final piece was supposed to be some kind of multi-media extravaganza involving all kinds of stuff besides music, aimed at expanding consciousness etc etc. ...:hmm:
But all we have now is the music.
Shoka42 10-06-2004, 11:33 AM C13#11 is a C dominant 7 chord with tension tones (color tones) 9, 11 (#11 in this case), and 13. when most people see C13, they ignore the 9th and 11th, though. It would be spelled (as a stack of thirds) C E G Bb D F# A - the tones being 1, 3, 5, b7, 9, #11, 13. Apparantly Scriabin put that chord (minus the fifth) as a stack of fourths. So it would be spelled - C F# Bb E A D - 1 #4 b7 3 (in an upper octave, though, so a 10) 13 9 (but in an upper octave - so if there was an interval called a 17th.)
As far as 7th chords/13th chords/etc. go, I had a prof make a good analogy. A C7 is like chicken, you can spice it up a little bit and throw in some tension tones (9th, 13th, etc.) but you still have chicken, but it is just chicken with pepper or chicken curry. Any dominant chord with a b9,#9, #11, b11, b13, or #13 can be notated as x7alt (for altered.) That pretty much says it's a dominant with some exotic spices.
So if I get this right, it's just a dominant C7 chord, with a few other notes thrown in?
Aaron 10-06-2004, 01:01 PM What's mystic about it?
That's what i'm wondering.
Aaron 10-06-2004, 01:18 PM So if I get this right, it's just a dominant C7 chord, with a few other notes thrown in?
Pretty much, but scriabin had something else going on that i'm trying to figure out. Most western music follows tertian harmony which means that our harmonies are based off of stacks of thirds, scriabin's mystic chord is a stack of fourths.
Any recommended scriabin listenings?
Bruce Lindfield 10-06-2004, 02:00 PM Pretty much, but scriabin had something else going on that i'm trying to figure out. Most western music follows tertian harmony which means that our harmonies are based off of stacks of thirds, scriabin's mystic chord is a stack of fourths.
Any recommended scriabin listenings?
There's a good double CD set with all his 3 Symphones and the Poeme de l'Extase - at mid price on Decca, conducted by Vladimir Ashkenazy - very good introduction! :)
Shoka42 10-06-2004, 03:27 PM Searched for this guy on Google, here's his website:
http://www.scriabinsociety.com/
Quite interesting, and it has all his works listed I think... i'm gonna have to check this guy out!
Good luck figuring it out Aaron!
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