So, who else out there is on the college-shopping circuit? I'm applying to five schools this year.

Peabody: Sent a tape in on December 1. Still waiting for results.

Indiana University: Auditioned on January 14 and was accepted, presumably to study with Bruce Bransby.

Boston University: Friday, February 17. I don't know a lot about this school, but I've heard really great things. I'm hoping to get into Ed Barker's studio.

Curtis Institute of Music: Saturday, February 25. Yeah, I know...

Rice University: Yet to be scheduled. I sent a DVD a long time ago, and I'm supposed to hear back some time soon as to whether I get to go to the live audition.

Sounds great. I'm applying to three schools.

I have MSM on March 5th...hopefull into Grossman's studio

Then I have Juilliard on March 6th...hope to continue with my teacher, Mr. Levinson

and

Lynn University. Shigeru Ishikawa is the faculty and he is a great player and a student of Levinson. The conservatory is rather new and up and coming but great things are coming out of there.

Good luck with your auditions. Sounds like you have things under control.

Well i'm not auditioning for a college (i will next year) but i'm auditioning for a scholorship on feb the 27th that pays for governers school and/or music summer camps all over the country. I'll know what i'm playing tomorrow evening.

I just found out I was accepted and awarded a very generous scholarship to Berklee College of Music last week. Apperently everyone was right when they said they had a good amount of money for Bass Players. I am being considered for full tuition, and hopefully that will lock things in so I can go there for sure next year. Wish me luck. And Good luck to everyone on their auditions.
Also, if anyone has a Berklee Audition coming up, PM me, I'd be happy to help you out, or give suggestions! :smug:

So Paul,
What's your first pick anyhow? My classical teacher went to Rice. I know its a good school, but nothing else really. I'm interested in what you are looking for in college. I'm assuming your a classical major, and wouldn't be interested in pursing jazz.

Here's my dates:

February 10th - Eastman
February 19th - New England Conservatory
February 24th - Curtis
March 6th - Manhattan School of Music
March 7th - Juilliard & Mannes

Curtis would be my first choice, although Rice would be just as great. Really, anything in a city would be fine by me at this point.

Hey guys, when in Philly do check out "Tequillas" on 16th and locust just2 blocks from Curtis. The best authentic mexican cuisine on the east coast....

Other than that good luck at Curtis and be prepared for lots of stair climbing with your axe.

G

I was going to apply to only Juilliard but my parent's won't let me. :-/

So I have
CCM 2/28
Juilliard 6/6

and I still have to make a tape for Indiana.

I am green with envy at you people.

I have this impossible fantasy of quitting my crappy day job and going back to university to study for a degree in music performance/composition at one of the prestigious arts universities here. It would be an incredible experience to be amongst musicians again and being part of the thriving melting pot of upcoming and inspired talents.

After I graduated from high school many years ago I spent a couple of years studying and developing my chops at a music college as a pianist before going to university to study for a completely unrelated degree. It was an unforgettable experience that has come back to haunt me in recent years. But with a mortgage and other responsibilities I just can't quit my day job to go back to study in that capacity again. Besides, if I went back for a music degree, I'd want to do it as a bassist and my chops are definitely not up to scratch on this instrument.

Good luck with all your auditions.


*edited - taking my impossible fantasy up the next level to more impossible heights includes studying at Berklee or Juilliard.

I just auditioned for UCLA over the weekend (as a transfer). Did well. Chris Hanulik gave me good vibes and pretty much told me that they wanted me in the dept, now I just have to find out if my meager 3.4 GPA will get me through with the main admission office (My ineptitude at caring about my GE could very well be my downfall.) You know, it's really unnerving playing cello suite material for a panel that has a cello teacher on it, cuz you just KNOW they're tearing apart every single thing about every single note. That's why I love obscure bass music, because if you mess up a little, the only person who will know is the bassist on the panel, and they probably won't care.

Anyone else here audition for UCLA in the fall? anybody?

The only reason I'm applying to all those schools is because I'd like to have some backups for the New York schools. Otherwise I would have only applied to Manhattan and Juilliard. Had I known Mensch was about to pass away I wouldn't have applied to Mannes.

I have been offered from Berklee college of music in boston (not a full ride though) i only have 3,000 per year but i hope to make it a full ride by next year. I probably wont go there but I want it to be a possibility to fall back on

Curtis would be my first choice, although Rice would be just as great. Really, anything in a city would be fine by me at this point.

Interesting to read this comment.

Oddly enough, I never lived or studied in a city that had a major orchestra - until I won my job. A "city" is not necessary unless you're "'jazz-giggin'".

First-person accounts of Rice University say 'it was a brilliant place to be'; great students who are very focused, great teachers who are even more focused, great orchestras with a brilliant conductor.

Curtis would also be an ideal setting.

IU is also obviously a very productive place to study.

I personally wish I'd been far enough along to go to any of those places for an undergrad, but I had not even had a bass lesson when I left high school!
I did IU for grad school, with Bruce Bransby, and it was the perfect fit. I even turned down far bigger scholarships at big universities, because it was clear that IU had the teachers, atmosphere, students and facilities to be The Right Place For Me.

I think my above post didn't really explain what I'm thinking very well. I'd really like to go to any of those schools. I'm hesitant to live in Bloomington for four years, but I'm sure it'd be worth it. I really, really liked working with Bransby this last summer in Aspen.

... I'd really like to go to any of those schools. I'm hesitant to live in Bloomington for four years, but I'm sure it'd be worth it.

It's absolutely worthwhile.

What you have to realize, is that every city, college, teacher, etc. is going to have it's good and it bad. There are things about bloomington and IU that I love, and there I things about Bloomington and IU that I absolutely can't stand. I know the same would go for Rice. Curtis is a fairly ideal situation, low class work, great teacher, gigging in town to make money, great players galore, it's tough to find bad in curtis, but there is some if you look hard enough I bet. Als I am sayin is, I would pick college based on the teacher and forget the rest, at least for undergrad. When you're older and strapped down by a lot more things grad school might be a compromise, but study with the best you can in your undergrad. Know what I'm saying? What do you all think about this?

Great advice. For undergrad, I would go for the teacher who will get me to my peak in a school atmosphere that will inspire me to get there. The city situation is great for gigging and networking, but undergrad, I believe, is all about getting chops and musical sensibilities in order. Lots of schools will do this.

IU is unusual because of its mammoth enrollment. 45+ bass majors and 1600 music majors last time I checked. One thing no one ever mentions about IU is that it is a GREAT place to meet hordes of other musicians and bass players to exchange ideas and hang out with. (And those informal social ties that you make in the undergrad can often become indispensable professional contacts 10-20 years later).

And on the undergrad side of gigging...I would not advise taking every gig you can (unless you are paying your way to a big price tag school).

In any of those areas contractors know that they can get very cheap, very talented kids to play their gigs. Take some so that you can get your orchestra chops set, but during undergrad, your time is best spent locked in a room practicing. I think you will find that the guys who are gigging the most in undergrad are not always the ones who go on to killer grad schools or significant orchestras.

imho :)

B. Johnson,

Which gig pays you $75 a service? because if your including gas and compensation for use of car into the total "per" service price, you are making it sound much better then it is.
If not, my bad, it just sounds like your including extra money into the service fee.

I understand where Ben is coming from, he's just saying that your best bet is to practice instead of gig in undergrad (generally)..... it's a loose statement to say these people that do are not going to move on.

My symphony Director said that he was brought down only 100 miles and all of his expenses were paid in full + he earned 500$ for his services. He said he had a total of 6 notes in the whole peice. 6notes

B. Johnson

so if thats the case, why did you say that $75 a service is just ok??? (you don't have to cover yourself to not seem cocky now by saying there is only a few services per concert that only occur around once a month within this community orch) and you do know thats pretty close to professional pay? i believe indy symphony is around $110 per service, and thats a higher end orchestra in the states...

also how can you disagree with one of ben's logics of not subbing while your in undergrad unless your tuition is high, because that is exactly what you are doing- i know your tuition cause i was at IU. So the whole point of you explaining how much you make to everyone was??

and mcnaire, who cares??

this thread seems to be turning into who's c#%k is bigger or someone knows someone else that has a big......

http://www.carlalbert.edu/student_affairs/calendar/aprilmovie.gif


While the popcorn's still hot, this might be a good chance to remind everyone to please fill in your profiles.

I'm hesitant to live in Bloomington for four years, but I'm sure it'd be worth it. I really, really liked working with Bransby this last summer in Aspen.

To offer an utterly biased opinion from someone born and raised and schooled as an undergrad here: Bloomington is a great place to live and learn music.

To offer a slightly better-informed opinion from someone who's lived elsewhere and gone to school at the New England Conservatory and worked at Juilliard: the big city scene is also pretty sweet, but I think as an undergrad the small town/big music school thing has a lot to offer. Some people are champing at the bit to get out of hicksville when they're 18, which I can totally dig, but four years of easy livin' and low-stress are pretty conducive to learning. Leastways, they were for me.

PS I realize I didn't address the "c#%k size" question, so sorry. Ruler on top, or bottom?

Someone said they had there audition at Eastman today. I wish I would have seen this sooner, it'd be nice to say hello. I hope you enjoy your experience, its a fun place. PM or e-mail me if you want any more info about the school. I'm really enjoying my study.

Sorry if this was slightly off topic, but I'm not sure what the topic is anymore.

Hey, yes I did have my Eastman audition today. It went over very well, though I could have played my Bottesini better. VanDemark said I was "decidingly acceptable for Eastman" and praised my playing, saying that it was clear I took my playing seriously.

Next up, NEC on February 19th.

I've never posted anything on a forum before but I figured I could offer some advice based off of my experiences.

I'm in my junior year at Rice, and I must say that gigging is something that you should do, but something with which you should book yourself solid...as an undergrad. The hours and type of work you do as a grad student is completely different. You need time to practice and get your stuff straight, but days are VERY long, and there's time to gig and to have lots of fun college experiences. Regarding the conservatory vs. university or the city vs. boonies bloom-town (that means "not a city," nothing else): I have gone through many different mindsets about whether I was a happy as I could be. For example, before I arrived here for my first year, I was excited to be going to a university and that I was going to study great music in addition to getting a well-rounded education (Rice is a VERY academically iniclined school, and even we music majors are required to take a bunch of classes with SMART kids, so it can be hard to keep good grades). However, there were many times when I thought that these non music classes were distracting my musical development, and i wished that i could be at a conservatory. For a few months I'd feel one way, then I'd feel the other. Eventually, I reached the point that I am at now, and I couldn't be happier. It's called my "F**k it phase." Let me explain. It does NOT involve me dropping all of my classes and just shedding. I DO study for classses and make good grades, I DO practice a lot, and efficiently. I AM under some stress at times with my university loads, but I do NOT let it bother me. By living with this open minded-ness, I now enjoy all of these classes (philosophy, art history, linguistics, and others) that I'm required to take, and I find my university experience very enriching, and my music is better than ever.
The main point of all of this is that is doens't matter whether you go to the city or the country. The most important thing is the music and your teacher. Make sure you study with someone that you like and respect. Be sure that you love what you're doing. And have an open mind about things that you are required to do. Luckily, almost all of the bass players in the world are cool cats, so making friends won't be an issue. So practice, play scales, play gigs, study (if you need to), and always be positive.
Peace,
Charlie
PS. if anyone is gonne be at this school soon, ask around for me and I'll be happy to show you around.

PS. if anyone is gonne be at this school soon, ask around for me and I'll be happy to show you around.
Hey Charlie. I sent a DVD to Rice back in December, but I haven't heard back from them yet. If I end up going, I'll let you know.

Do you know Scott Dixon? He's the one that talked me into applying to Rice.

In fact, Scotty and I are about to hit up some margaritas in a few minutes. tex-mex food and drinks are slammin' here.
Charlie

Charlie Nilles,

Eric Fischer from BUTI...long time, man.

i think your missing my point. I also agree that gigging is good in undergrad, i think it's usually better for the players who do not need as much time in the practice room (ben j) - which is a pretty rare exception...... cause trust me, once your out of the university, the atmosphere of fellow bassists helping you/ competing with, its tougher, because you have to figure out how to achieve these similar practicing methods but without 40 other players around you

(not sure what your point was about jeff cause he's definately not in undergrad, and that's what we are discussing right now)

by the way, do you know who is playing on the NBC bass right now? i need to get in contact with the player

My big audition is for Juilliard Jazz (freshman undergrad) on Feb. 28th.

Yikes!!

ya don't worry (arguing- it's a boredom thing for me)

ya i gave back the nbc bass right before school started (august 2005). It is an old german, with extention...the bass-bar is weak, so the belly is getting lower.... it was a monster of a loud bass. (it was actually donated to IU from grodner and he played it way back in the day in the NBC orchestra...hence the name..

the reason why i was asking cause im coming back to IU (in a few days) to compare an instrument (with hurst) that i might buy from cincinnati with the nbc.... no big deal though

by the way, who are the master/ doctorate students now? meredith is still there right?

(voice of Homer Simpson) mmmmmmmmm...... margheritas

(voice of Homer Simpson) mmmmmmmmm...... margheritas

The Best.

Eric!!! Ling time indeed! How's it going?

So, who else out there is on the college-shopping circuit? I'm applying to five schools this year.

Peabody: Sent a tape in on December 1. Still waiting for results.

Indiana University: Auditioned on January 14 and was accepted, presumably to study with Bruce Bransby.

Boston University: Friday, February 17. I don't know a lot about this school, but I've heard really great things. I'm hoping to get into Ed Barker's studio.

Curtis Institute of Music: Saturday, February 25. Yeah, I know...

Rice University: Yet to be scheduled. I sent a DVD a long time ago, and I'm supposed to hear back some time soon as to whether I get to go to the live audition.


Congrats on Indiana, hopefully you'll get more great results. Out of curiosity what pieces did you audition with? :)

First two movements of Koussevitzky, Gigue from the third Bach cello suite, Mozart 40, Beethoven 5.

I took the Boston University audition this last Friday. I think I did really well.

After my audition I met up with a couple students there. According to them, there could be as many as seven openings this year (out of a total of 10 bass students) at BU. This is good news for me and anyone else who auditioned there.

I've also been invited to audition at Rice. That'll be on March 4th. Curtis is this Saturday.

um,

I auditioned at Butler like a month ago, and David liked my playing. And it's my first choice school, and I got accepted.

Happiness abounds.

I also have a Juilliard audition in TWO WEEKS.

:help:

good luck shmelbee! I've heard from others that you better have your scales and etudes ready to go or Levinson will be PISSED. I know a guy that Levinson kicked out of the audition because he didn't have those prepared. just something to keep in mind...

Juilliard requires one major and one minor scale out of a list that has three choices for each.

As I previously mentioned, I'm auditioning for Juilliard Jazz next week...has anyone done so in previous years? If so, what can I expect?

Thanks.

I'm audition for Juilliard this year and Mr. Levinson is my teacher. They require one major or minor scale (either e, f, or g or E, F, or G) and arpeggios. Also be sure to play what they tell you, like don't go into the audition and play Koussevitsky concerto because they want a baroque sonata.

Yes, Mr. Levinson does kick kids out of auditions for not having the right things prepared, as do the other teachers. They are very clear and specific on what they want and if you dont have the right things prepared they dont want to hear you.

Anyway everybody is having all their auditions already and I didnt even have one yet. Two weeks until my first one, which is Juilliard.

Something worth noting:

For those auditioning for Juilliard, no matter who you intend to study with at the Big J you have to be approved by all the bass faculty. Not just the one you want to work with. So do take the scale and arpeggio thing seriously. Levinson does. It would be a shame if you worked really hard getting your concerto ready and you weren't admitted because you blew off scales and arpeggios. Simple little things like that offer insight into your basic musical and technical knowledge and your work ethic.

Originally Posted by PaulCannon

Peabody: Sent a tape in on December 1. Still waiting for results.

Peabody doesn't mail out any decisions until April 1st.

But just so you know the status of your tape: I just had my audition at Peabody, and while I was there, I couldn't help but take a peak at one of the guide's list for the bass players auditioning. I saw your name on the list as one of the taped auditions.

My guess is that they didn't even look at any of the taped auditions yet. They probably wanted to hear all of the bass applicants in one day so they could sort out the players more easily.

Anyway, I just finished all of college auditions. I'm just going to relax the rest of my senior year, or maybe I'll decide to start doing my homework for school again.

Best of luck to all of you who are still auditioning!

Well I wasnt talking about just Levinson, I was talking about all the bass teachers in general. You are right though if you blow off scales and arpeggios you have no shot of getting in because if you don't think something like scales and arpeggios are important then they feel you are not at the professional level necessary for Juilliard. Also, please do not prepare a concerto for the NYC schools. Too many friends of mine have been kicked out of auditions for doing that and not a baroque sonata. Finally, the teachers do not know who you want to study with until after the auditions are complete and the selections made, therefore impressing who you want to study does no justice for you because you need to impress all 4 faculty members.

Best of luck to everybody with their auditions!

Well I wasnt talking about just Levinson, I was talking about all the bass teachers in general. You are right though if you blow off scales and arpeggios you have no shot of getting in because if you don't think something like scales and arpeggios are important then they feel you are not at the professional level necessary for Juilliard. Also, please do not prepare a concerto for the NYC schools. Too many friends of mine have been kicked out of auditions for doing that and not a baroque sonata. Finally, the teachers do not know who you want to study with until after the auditions are complete and the selections made, therefore impressing who you want to study does no justice for you because you need to impress all 4 faculty members.

Best of luck to everybody with their auditions!

No Concerto?
When I auditioned I did a concerto, baroque sonata, a movement of solo Bach. Have the requirements changed?

Yea they must have

Those are the requirments for masters degree now. Undergraduate needs just a baroque sonata, etude, scales and arpeggios, and an orchestra excerpt.

Ive just been assuming everybody is going into Undergrad in this forum.

Well I wasnt talking about just Levinson, I was talking about all the bass teachers in general. You are right though if you blow off scales and arpeggios you have no shot of getting in because if you don't think something like scales and arpeggios are important then they feel you are not at the professional level necessary for Juilliard. Also, please do not prepare a concerto for the NYC schools. Too many friends of mine have been kicked out of auditions for doing that and not a baroque sonata. Finally, the teachers do not know who you want to study with until after the auditions are complete and the selections made, therefore impressing who you want to study does no justice for you because you need to impress all 4 faculty members.

Best of luck to everybody with their auditions!

So by four you mean that Laszlo will be at the auditions next week?

I assume that he would be. There has been talk for awhile around Juilliard about him coming and if he isn't then just three.

That's interesting. I wonder if he'll be there so soon after getting the job. I like how Juilliard mailed everyone the news in a letter. It's really nice that they took the time to let everyone know.

On a sort of related note, does anyone know if Mannes been looking into getting another faculty member?

I don't know about Mannes. I'll ask around.

I would imagine after looking around for so long for a new teacher and completely demolishing Mr. Mensch's old studio that the best Juilliard can do is have Laszlo at the auditions. Then again who knows what they are going to do.

Did I miss something about Al being on the Julliard faculty?

Did I miss something about Al being on the Julliard faculty?
Yes (http://www.talkbass.com/forum/showthread.php?t=230336).

I'm also out on the "audition" circuit this year. So far I know I've been accepted to Indiana, Michigan State, CCM, and Oberlin. Now all I have to do is decide where to go...:hmm:

completely demolishing Mr. Mensch's old studio

what do you mean??

He's probably talking about how Juilliard basically just divided Mr. Mensch's studio among the remaining faculty members...

I'm also out on the "audition" circuit this year. So far I know I've been accepted to Indiana, Michigan State, CCM, and Oberlin. Now all I have to do is decide where to go...:hmm:
I'm not sure if you want my advice, but among those schools I would highly recommend Indiana. They're had a really great track record recently with getting graduates jobs. Do you know which teacher you'd have?

Well here is the scoop for the inquiring.

Al Laszlo is the new appointment at Juilliard to take Mr. Mensch's place. Also, I don't think demolish was a good word at the time.

After Mr. Mensch's passing it hit a lot of the students hard. Some of his students (from what I understand) quit but most of them went off into other studios and (also from what I heard) a few were taking lessons with Kurt Muroki for the time being.

Now demolish wasn't a good word but it was chaos around the Bass Department, and I feel that the least Juilliard can do is after this year (which was hard on a lot of kids) is have Mr. Laszlo come out for the auditions.

If I'm wrong please correct me. There has to be some people out there who know better than me. I'm running strictly off of a hearsay from a couple of Mensch's old students.

I'm also out on the "audition" circuit this year. So far I know I've been accepted to Indiana, Michigan State, CCM, and Oberlin. Now all I have to do is decide where to go...:hmm:

Lauren! I didn't know you posted here. It's Paul.

I'm not sure if you want my advice, but among those schools I would highly recommend Indiana. They're had a really great track record recently with getting graduates jobs. Do you know which teacher you'd have?

I didn't know you posted here either! :hyper:

I would be with Mr. Hurst. I'm hoping I get enough scholarship money to go to some of these top schools. I hate waiting for the letters though. I just want to know where I'm going already! :)

Phew. Curtis audition was today. I hope everyone who turned out for it did themselves justice.

Paul did you meet a bassist auditioning for Curtis named Callum Macleod? He's like 20, very slim and has a shaved head. He's from UofT in Toronto.

Paul, it seems like you have really researched your options for schools. What is your order of choices of schools and what teacher are planning on studying with at each school? I'm looking at schools for next year, and I just can't really make up my mind about where or who I want to study with.

Paul did you meet a bassist auditioning for Curtis named Callum Macleod? He's like 20, very slim and has a shaved head. He's from UofT in Toronto.
No. I haven't seen that many bassists around here, actually. I try not to meet new people right before auditions -- it can be really nerve wracking.

Paul, it seems like you have really researched your options for schools. What is your order of choices of schools and what teacher are planning on studying with at each school? I'm looking at schools for next year, and I just can't really make up my mind about where or who I want to study with.
I only had one school that I considered a "fallback," and that was Peabody. I applied to Indiana to study with Bruce Bransby. I had studied with him at Aspen and really liked him. From what I hear Boston University isn't particularly great as a general undergraduate school, but Ed Barker is an amazing teacher. Hal Robinson at Curtis and Paul Ellison at Rice are both insanely good teachers. If I had to rank them, I'd probably put Curtis above Rice and those two above BU and IU.

If you really want to figure this out, talk to current and past students from those schools and try to get lessons from the teachers at those schools.

Thanks for the advice paul. I'm sure glad someone out there knows what they are talking about, it seems like you just really have it together and you know about everything there is to know about schools. Congrats on getting into indiana, it's to bad that Bruce Bransby and IU were on the bottom of your list, would have been nice to find out you got into one of your top choices first, but I'm sure you'll get in!

how did everything go for everybody? auditions should be wrapped up...let us know when you get word, should be around april 1st, right?

i had my juilliard audition stuff memorized, and it's good because i forgot my sheet's at the hotel. I played alright except for one spot in my etude, i lost my place. I got back, though, and played alright. I didnt mess up note-wise or technique wise or anything like that.

and i rocked butler....for the most part.

My auditions went well. Juilliard went the best out of all of them. Now I get to enter the wonderful month of strenuous waiting!!!

how did everything go for everybody? auditions should be wrapped up...let us know when you get word, should be around april 1st, right?

My New England Conservatory audition didn't go over too well. I'm not really sure what happened, but I kept messing up all over the place in Bottesini and got really nervous (thus screwing me up more). I don't really think I'll be accepted which doesn't bother me because it's my second to last choice for schools.

Curtis was a nice experience. I played pretty well and Edgar Meyer and Hal Robinson were extremely nice to me and said they enjoyed my playing. I had to wait around for 2 hours after they called me up to the practice room and after I warmed up for abour an hour I just didn't want to warm up anymore and I started to get cold before the audition which began at 8. I won't be accepted but I'm kind of glad I got to do it just to play in front of the two.

Montclair was a breeze. It's my safety school and there's no chance I'll be rejected.

The New York three went over very well and I'm happy with how I played for all of them. My teacher, Linda McKnight said I played very well during my Manhattan audition (which is genuine because she didn't say some nice things to the other pre-college kids) and later in the day Orin O'Brien told her (not knowing that I'm her student) that she thought that I sounded really good.

The next day at Juilliard she came up to me in the hallway and shook my hand and thanked me for my playing and told me I'll feel at home at Juilliard so I felt really good coming into the audition. I thought I played well at Juilliard but I heard a lot of good people throughout the day warming up and auditioning so who knows if I'll get in. Mannes was pretty much flawless which is unfortunate for me because I wanted to study with Homer Mensch if I went there and he's since passed away so there's not much for me there.

I'll let you know how everything went when I hear back from all the schools. I didn't have any bad auditions, so I'm feeling good about my prospects.

So far I've gotten into New England Conservatory, Mannes, and Montclair and got rejected from Curtis (what a suprise :smug:). New England was a suprise for me because, like I mentioned before, my audition was pretty bad. I got into Donald Palma's studio so I'm feeling good about hearing back from my remaining schools. I'm hoping that they'll get back to me in a day or two because the wait is killing me.

congratulations kraid!
Why was NEC your second to last choice school?
I understand about the wait, it must be agony!

Thanks! It's a bad musical reason, but I really like New York City as a location. It's close to my home and my girlfriend who has one more year of high school and wants to go to school in NYC. NEC is a great school and I don't have it lower on my list because of the quality of the school or the teachers, it's just that I think I would just be happier in the city. I really would like to study with Donald Palma so I'm not sure where I'll end up.

I'm on the jazz end of things...
So far I've gotten into Manhattan (full ride!!!:) ) which is where I'm going for sure, Miami, Berklee, and Columbia Univ.
Still waiting on word from Juilliard, even though I guess it doesn't matter at this point.

Congrats on everyone's acceptances thus far!

Manhatten uh Billy?
Sounds pretty sweet. I'm pretty sure I'll be heading up to Berklee next year.
Good Luck to everyone else.

Alright, I've heard from everyone but Peabody at this point. Peabody was a safety in the first place, so their reply won't affect my decision.

I was accepted to Indiana University, Boston University, and Rice University. I was rejected from Curtis. I haven't received all the financial information yet, but at the moment I'm almost certainly going to attend Rice.

I got into Manhattan Shool of Music today! I'm in such a good mood. Right now it looks like I'll be going there next year. I just need to hear back from Juilliard and Eastman now.

Paul, congrats on Rice.

Indiana - Never sent in my tape. (lazy)
CCM - accepted.
Juilliard - accepted.

Four more years of Levinson, woot!

Congratulations to everybody.

Congrats to all who have auditioned.

I've got an audition for the masters programme in the sibelius academy (http://www.siba.fi/eng/) on March 17th. Already feeling quite nervous - I haven't had to audition in quite a while, and this is the only place i'm auditioning for. Lasse Lagercrantz is the bass teacher there and i've been taking lessons with him for about a year. I've got alot riding on the audition (if i don't get in i'll be kinda deported!). I'm hoping to play the audition material (kouss.1+2 from memory and cerny study 12) for a few friends pretty soon.

I have a stinking orchestra week (mahler 5 and sibelius 'en saga') finishing on the 12th - only 5 days from the end of that to the audition. STRESS.:help:

My auditions went well. Juilliard went the best out of all of them. Now I get to enter the wonderful month of strenuous waiting!!!

I had heard that Shigeru was going to be going to Europe or Japan and may be leaving? Did he mention any of this to you at your audition?

I've got an audition for the masters programme in the sibelius academy (http://www.siba.fi/eng/) on March 17th.
April 17, you mean?

No he didn't, but I have heard it. I have a very good place to go next year but aren't saying anything until I nail out all the details.

I got waitlisted at Juilliard, and whether I get into Lynn or not I'm not gonna go if Shigeru leaves. But as of right now I'm working out something with a teacher who invited me to go somewhere.

More updates to come.

I got into DePaul and Northwestern, and I'm waiting on Peabody (I should get the letter tomorrow or Tuesday).

It's really close between Northwestern and Peabody for me.

I tried to find colleges that had both top notch Music and Engineering Schools, since I'm something of a math/science wiz, and I can't give up my music studies.

Northwestern has both, and DaXun and I took to each other really well. Plus it's under an hour from where I live, so I could home whenever I want. Being right by Chicago doesn't hurt either. Electrical Engineering and Bass Performance won't have a lot courses overlapping, so getting two completely separate degrees will be really tough (especially from Northwestern).

Peabody on the other hand, has an Audio Engineering degree which incorporates a Bachelor's in performance. Audio Engineering is really the only type of engineering I want to study in college, so the program is a perfect fit for me. But then again, it's in Baltimore where I'd only be coming home 2-3 times a year.

Whatever, I need to see what kind of letter I get from Peabody in the next few days.

For those who are interested, the two bassists who won Curtis this year are Nathan Vedal and Derek Zadinsky. They both study with my teacher, Jordan Anderson.

Actually I meant May 17th. Ooops:hmm:

Hi guys,

I got into both USC (Denis Trembly) and Yale University (Don Palma). Any thoughts on either of these schools?

Thanks!

I got into DePaul and Northwestern, and I'm waiting on Peabody (I should get the letter tomorrow or Tuesday).

It's really close between Northwestern and Peabody for me.

I tried to find colleges that had both top notch Music and Engineering Schools, since I'm something of a math/science wiz, and I can't give up my music studies.

Northwestern has both, and DaXun and I took to each other really well. Plus it's under an hour from where I live, so I could home whenever I want. Being right by Chicago doesn't hurt either. Electrical Engineering and Bass Performance won't have a lot courses overlapping, so getting two completely separate degrees will be really tough (especially from Northwestern).

Peabody on the other hand, has an Audio Engineering degree which incorporates a Bachelor's in performance. Audio Engineering is really the only type of engineering I want to study in college, so the program is a perfect fit for me. But then again, it's in Baltimore where I'd only be coming home 2-3 times a year.

Whatever, I need to see what kind of letter I get from Peabody in the next few days.

I can see why you would want to combine your engineering and music interests at a school like Peabody of Johns Hopkins Univ. Keep in mind that no matter how brilliant and motivated you may be, Peabody is STILL a very traditional conservatory. And whether they mean to or not, they look at multi-disciplinary types like yourself with suspicion. At the same time Peabody/Hopkins has put out a number of fantastic musicians who are equally adept at an unrelated field. Peabody makes it possible, but the traditional conservatory culture does not necessarily foster it. Peabody is a great school, but NU is more receptive to musicians with dual career interests even though their curriculum would make it more difficult.

(In other words, at Peabody, don't be surprised if you find yourself seated at the back of the bass section for not being a "pure" bass player.)

ali yazdanfar was a physics major at hopkins, and studied with paul johnson on the side through peabody. he has since made music his career, playing in the national symphony...so it can be done, it's just a whole lot of work (he is also an EXTREMELY talented musician).

Well, It actually won't matter now, since I didn't get into Peabody (which was kind of surprising, I guess they didn't like my playing). I'm not that disappointed though, because the way I see it, it just makes my decision to go Northwestern much easier. My parents are relieved that I'm staying in the are, so that's always a good thing, and I'm actually going to know quite a few people who are going there.

All in all it looks like NU would have been the best place to go even if I did get into Peabody, so I'm genuinely excited to be going there.

I can see why you would want to combine your engineering and music interests at a school like Peabody of Johns Hopkins Univ. Keep in mind that no matter how brilliant and motivated you may be, Peabody is STILL a very traditional conservatory. And whether they mean to or not, they look at multi-disciplinary types like yourself with suspicion. At the same time Peabody/Hopkins has put out a number of fantastic musicians who are equally adept at an unrelated field. Peabody makes it possible, but the traditional conservatory culture does not necessarily foster it. Peabody is a great school, but NU is more receptive to musicians with dual career interests even though their curriculum would make it more difficult.

(In other words, at Peabody, don't be surprised if you find yourself seated at the back of the bass section for not being a "pure" bass player.)

I go to Peabody right now and I don't really agree with this statement. The bass department here is very accepting. The section is made up of mostly classical performance majors but if you are in the section you will be placed according to your ability as a bass player. I know Paul Johsnon is very accepting of different areas of interests with his students. I think it was last year, before I was at Peabody, that one of his students was getting into experimentary improvisatory music and PJ was getting really into it. Experimentary improvisatory music is pretty out there too.
Peabody has a community that I have been very happy with and feel like most musicians would be able to thrive in this environment

Hi guys,

I got into both USC (Denis Trembly) and Yale University (Don Palma). Any thoughts on either of these schools?

Thanks!


I don't know much about the schools but I do know a little bit about the teachers. I've been told that Dennis Trembly is the person to study with if you are going to the West Coast and I know a guy that studies with Don Palma at NEC and he is a great player. I don't think you can go wrong at either place.

i hear this cory palmer guy knows a thing or two about avant-garde stools. it's just what i hear.

i second the advice that you can't go wrong with either school (usc or yale). i dont have any experience with don palma, but have heard great things about him. dennis trembly is a great player, and he comes highly recommended from some friends who study with him. he also wears this amazing tuxedo t-shirt when he plays...

one more thing about usc. dennis trembly isnt the only teacher there...you also have david moore, nico abondolo, and john clayton. while you would be studying with trembly, you would surely learn from the other teachers as well and they are all outstanding at what they do. from everything i have heard, it seems like a great place to be.

Final Results for me:

Peabody: Accepted. Received something like $6,500 in loans and work study.

Indiana University: Accepted. Received approximately $2,000 in loans and a $12,000 merit scholarship.

Boston University: Accepted. Received approximately $2,000 in loans and a $18,000 merit scholarship.

Curtis Institute of Music: Rejected.

Rice University: Accepted. I haven't heard everything yet from their financial offices, but I know I received a merit scholarship for $8,000.

Looks like I'll be in Houston for the next four years.

By the way, I don't mean to sound like a braggart or anything. Just thought people who want to audition at these schools in the future might be interested in what other people have received, financially.

By the way, I don't mean to sound like a braggart.....

More beans? :D

Man, I love that movie. I can't decide whether that or History of the World is better.

ok i feel stupid..... what movie is that from? i think i have seen it

ok i feel stupid..... what movie is that from? i think i have seen itBlazing Saddles.

yaya i remember now

Hey Paul way to go ! to bad about Curtis. ya can't winem all.
What do you think you will do with your studies. Soloist or orchestra or combo ?

G

Here's my semi-final results:

Accepted: Manhattan School of Music, Mannes, Eastman, New England Conservatory, and Montclair.

Waitlisted: Juilliard

Rejected: Curtis

For merit based scholarships Mannes gave me $9500, NEC gave me $7600, and Montclair gave me $1300. I haven't heard back from Eastman about money. For loans, Manhattan gave me $44,000.

I'll be crossing my fingers about getting off the waiting list at Juilliard.

Butler University, baby!

$9,000 Academic/Fine arts Scholarship
$11,000 Music Scholarship

I have yet to receive my Government aid and other loans, but I'm definitely going to love it there. I'll have a real teacher for once...

I'm hearing about like $44,000 in loans and grants?! These schools must be extremely expensive to attend. Can't you get a similiar education at a cheaper institution? I personally don't know what I would do if I came out of University with over $60,000 in debt.

perhaps you could get a job using your education and pay your loans off?...

just my 2 cents, yo

well, its what i plan to do. i hope:rolleyes:

When you're looking at your financial package that is offered, try to see if the grant money is for the entire four years. Many schools will give you great money to get you in and then the next year they're giving it to the next incoming student, leaving you without it.

Read the fine print.

And congrats to all who were accepted to the school(s) of their choice.

I'm hearing about like $44,000 in loans and grants?! These schools must be extremely expensive to attend. Can't you get a similiar education at a cheaper institution? I personally don't know what I would do if I came out of University with over $60,000 in debt.

Well, I think to answer that question someone would have to go through both experiences to figure out if the education would be equal or not. I can't think of too many schools that I would want to attend that are cheap that have equal teachers compared to the big conservatories. Also keep in mind that housing costs are high for the schools in NYC. I mean in my opinion the price is worth it for both the training and the experience, even if I'm going to be in debt, but I'm hoping to get a job from the education.

For those interested in money issues, Eastman gave me over $16,000 in merit-based scholarships. They've been the most generous for me so far, if anyone wants to keep that mind for future auditions. I'm going to have to turn it down for Manhattan and the possibility of getting off of Juilliard's waiting list which is a bummer :hmm:

Hi guys,

I got into both USC (Denis Trembly) and Yale University (Don Palma). Any thoughts on either of these schools?

Thanks!

Dennis is the coolest! I studied with him and I'm really glad I did. Plus LA has lots of professional opportunities(gigs, and stuff) while you study which is pretty cool. But it's a million dollars, so demand a huge scholarship!

-Beebo!

Kraid, I actually found the opposite to be true. Of the five schools I applied to, the cheapest ones were the best. Curtis has no tuition, and Rice claims to cover 100% of financial needs while also having one of the lowest tuitions for a private university in the country.

My least favorite school, Peabody, had the highest tuition and offered the least financial aid.

Kraid, I actually found the opposite to be true. Of the five schools I applied to, the cheapest ones were the best. Curtis has no tuition, and Rice claims to cover 100% of financial needs while also having one of the lowest tuitions for a private university in the country.

My least favorite school, Peabody, had the highest tuition and offered the least financial aid.

I probably should have said could attend! Curtis is out of my reach as my audition showed. I'm also talking about places that I applied to and had in mind some cheaper universities to compare to conservatories, but you're definitely right.

If you are really considering all of these schools you might want to pick the one that has the better job placement rate so far......As I have seen only about two guys have come out of MSM in the past 4 years and they were Dan K. and Scott Pingel. Yes they got big jobs but they were both a lot older when they attended MSM. Both had already done their undergrads and Dan even did his masters at Yale before he went to MSM. Anyways just a thought.....

If you are really considering all of these schools you might want to pick the one that has the better job placement rate so far......As I have seen only about two guys have come out of MSM in the past 4 years and they were Dan K. and Scott Pingel. Yes they got big jobs but they were both a lot older when they attended MSM. Both had already done their undergrads and Dan even did his masters at Yale before he went to MSM. Anyways just a thought.....

I'd call this bad advice. Or maybe just not well thought-out

consider this...

A school with...say...40 or more bass players during any given year is likely to put a higher number of players in orchestras than a school which has...say...15 (like MSM).

Also, you should consider what "job placement" means. If, by that, you mean the number of players from a school who win full time, tenured positions in professional orchestras, then you should probably consider that there are a very many players who have VERY productive and successful careers doing freelance, studio work, chamber music etc. Furthermore, I know that there are a lot of these players who don't want to bother taking orchestra auditions because they are doing well without having an orchestra job.

It all depends on what your goals are. I want to be in an orchestra, so I'm going to a school that is widely recognized for putting many of its graduates in serious orchestra jobs.

I suppose a percentage figure would be of more use than raw numbers. For example, Curtis has 7 bass students, while Indiana has 40-plus at any given time. While Indiana certainly has put more bassists in orchestras, I think a percentage would show that Curtis has a higher success rate.

I wonder if there is any place that has this kind of data. This forum has a running list of audition winners, but given its selective and ambiguous nature, I don't think it's a good idea to base such important decisions on it. I think I'm less concerned with the schools as much as the teachers. It would be such a useful tool if there was a list of major teachers in the United States that gave some statistics on how successful their students have been. Specifically, how many went on to become professional musicians, and, among those, how many won full time jobs in orchestras. Vaguely Orwellian, I suppose, but I would have found something like that far more useful. For the most part, I think most of us have based our college searches largely on hearsay and anecdotes.

That said, I think the best thing anyone looking for a school can do is have a lesson with every teacher they're interested in studying with. That gives a much better perspective on what to look for than anything else.

Interesting thread. It's funny cause where I am, University of Toronto; it's almost a direct link to the Toronto Symphony. Every bassist in the TSO currently and within the past 20 odd years (except Monohan who was a Curtis student) has been a student at U of T. I don't think I've seen any bassist come out of U of T and get into an orchestra outside of Canada. My question is, if there is such ridicule and scrutiny about the prestige of your school, should it really affect your chances of getting a professional job? Ie. Surely people wouldn't attend schools like mine if they thought that the only chance they would have to get into a major symphony would be through the big league schools like Julliard, Curtis etc? Any feedback appreciated! :)

What I'm trying to say is that the school isn't important, it's the teacher. Joel Quarrington is at UT, right? I'm sure he's an incredible teacher.

There are some schools out there that are HUGE names in music, but the bass department doesn't match up. It has everything to do with the teachers.

To go along with what Paul is saying, there are phenomenal teachers at lesser known schools. You don't hear about those teachers as much because they don't attract as many talented students as schools like Curtis, Rice, IU, etc. Get lessons and go to masterclasses of as many teachers as you possibly can because there might be someone that you really work well with but isn't one of the major teachers that you hear of all the time.

The reason that I decided to study with my teachers are because I got lessons with them and worked very well with them and was very impressed with what they had to say. I studied with Jack Budrow at Interlochen before I went to study with him at MSU and then I auditioned for John Hood's studio because Mr. Budrow recommended him. I had not heard of John before then and I went to get a lesson and knew that I should be studying with him.

What I'm trying to say is that the school isn't important, it's the teacher. Joel Quarrington is at UT, right? I'm sure he's an incredible teacher.

There are some schools out there that are HUGE names in music, but the bass department doesn't match up. It has everything to do with the teachers.

Unfortunetly not, Joel teaches at the Royal Conservatory of Music in Toronto. His 5 students in the faculty all play german bow and tune in fifths like himeself. I believe one of them is still in the process of switching the fifths. U of T is all french bow and fourths.

5ths? Odd...is this for orchestral or for Solo?

. I studied with Jack Budrow at Interlochen before I went to study with him at MSU and then I auditioned for John Hood's studio because Mr. Budrow recommended him. I had not heard of John before then and I went to get a lesson and knew that I should be studying with him.

Hood? Too bad he never really figured out how to use a bow.;) :D ;)

Tell him Allan says hi.

5ths? Odd...is this for orchestral or for Solo?

Joel tunes his bass in fifths for everything. He's perhaps one of the finest bass virtuosi today, he's really a magician.

CDGA.

:bassist: :cool:

He's a witch!

:cool:

Err...warlock I suppose.

He's a witch!

:cool:

Err...warlock I suppose.

Either way, BURN HIM!!

I think the fifths has something to do with his tone being so clear. It really is outstanding. I believe his bass (1611? Maggini) was Warren Benfield's bass. It's kindof small, but it carries to the last seat.

I suppose a percentage figure would be of more use than raw numbers. For example, Curtis has 7 bass students, while Indiana has 40-plus at any given time. While Indiana certainly has put more bassists in orchestras, I think a percentage would show that Curtis has a higher success rate.

I wonder if there is any place that has this kind of data. This forum has a running list of audition winners, but given its selective and ambiguous nature, I don't think it's a good idea to base such important decisions on it. I think I'm less concerned with the schools as much as the teachers....

So what makes the Audition Winners thread ambiguous? It's clearly listing winners of auditions for full time positions (including one-year full-times) in ICSOM orchestras, as well as WHERE the winners came from. Pretty sure it's being clear and as comprehensive as can be.
So whether you go by percentages or bulk numbers, you still get a pretty clear picture of what's going on over-all in the full time audition circuit.
If you're looking for professional orchestral employment, it seems a pretty darn useful starting point.

The list on this forum only lists the auditions that someone on here knows about. I'm sure it doesn't list every single audition for a paying orchestral job, even within the United States. Many of the people on the list are only credited with their previous job, and doesn't mention where they went to school. None of them mention who their teacher was.

It only dates back about nine years. Most teachers have been in the business longer than that. I also think that in those nine years, there would have been more than 67 auditions.

I think the list is a good start. However, there ought to be a more comprehensive list available.

Am I the only one that thinks that you should choose the college that you think you would personally do best in? Although looking at the succes rate after college is an important statistic to look at when applying to schools, I don't think it should at all be the final determinate of where you decide to go.

Let's say you only get into MSM and IU when you audition for colleges. From the data available, IU seems to have a much a better job placement than MSM. But if you hate the idea of a large, extremely competitive music school, and you love everything about MSM, then MSM should be the obvious choice.

Yeah, I'm young and I may not know what I'm talking about, but it makes more sense to me if you base one of the most important decisions of your life on your own chances of success rather than others.

Karl I think the list is amazing and has more then enough info for the readers

paul, you are just an idiot

obviously the list could go past 9 years, but for almost a decade worth of audition winning list, wouldn't you be able to decipher a trend of where is winners are coming from? and why?

It is a great list and we all appreciate it. Paul isn't an idiot (he got in to rice as freshman!) but it should be noted that going to IU doesn't automatically equal a job, as going somewhere other than IU doesn't automatically equal failure in life.
It's great that the IU guys have pride for their school and they should as they clearly have dominated in the past years. Being at a school with 40 or so other bass players and two amazing teachers is obviously a great formula for success, but not the ONLY option.

Am I the only one that thinks that you should choose the college that you think you would personally do best in? Although looking at the succes rate after college is an important statistic to look at when applying to schools, I don't think it should at all be the final determinate of where you decide to go.

Let's say you only get into MSM and IU when you audition for colleges. From the data available, IU seems to have a much a better job placement than MSM. But if you hate the idea of a large, extremely competitive music school, and you love everything about MSM, then MSM should be the obvious choice.

Yeah, I'm young and I may not know what I'm talking about, but it makes more sense to me if you base one of the most important decisions of your life on your own chances of success rather than others.

I'm obliged to agree with this and take it one step further to say that programs like IU attract more bassists who are completely and absolutely focused on becoming a bassist in a professional orchestra. They will produce more audition winners, statistically, than a school that also appeals to players interested in other things like teaching and composition or other performance venues. Just a thought..?

paul, you are just an idiot
Excuse me?

I have some legitimate problems with the list, and instead of answering them, you go ahead and call me an idiot. Why don't we discuss this like grown-ups and leave out the insults for a while?

Nine years would probably be plenty of data, but the data is half missing. The first three years only post a handful of audition results. And, as I said, there could be more useful information to it that isn't shown. I'm not saying kpo is lazy. The list is very useful, but it doesn't give a complete picture.

Also, I was under the impression that the list was started with the intent of merely tracking winners of major auditions, not providing detailed information for college applicants. I'm saying that it would be very helpful for some people if such a thing existed.

Am I the only one that thinks that you should choose the college that you think you would personally do best in?No, you're not. I've been trying to say this entire time that the teacher is the most important thing. The importance of the list, in this context, is mainly for people looking for colleges know who to look at.

here we go...

Ugh...let's not go where this seems to be heading. Folks, it's just a message board. Ones and zeros in cyberspace. Let's please keep boxers in a state of unbunchitutde and try to be civil so this thread can stay open, what?

I'm obliged to agree with this and take it one step further to say that programs like IU attract more bassists who are completely and absolutely focused on becoming a bassist in a professional orchestra. They will produce more audition winners, statistically, than a school that also appeals to players interested in other things like teaching and composition or other performance venues. Just a thought..?

This certainly seems to be true, and at IU it has resulted in an alarming drop in the number of bassists in the jazz program. Here, there is no jazz bass teacher, and it has been the tradition that bassists in the jazz program would just study with the classical teachers. This worked very well in the days of talented bassists who weren't focused solely on landing an orchestra job--players like Robert Hurst, Todd Coolman, John Clayton, Edgar Meyer, and Mike Valerio (maybe not so well-known, but he's one of the busiest classical-and-jazz bassists in L.A.). There was plenty of room for bassists of varying goals. But now, the program has really gained prestige, and the two studios are full of extremely talented and motivated bassists gunning for a good orchestra gig and who only got where they are by focusing on one thing--the orchestra/classical bag--with no room left for the undecided all-around bassist. I can't say whether this is a good thing or a bad thing (hey, we've got some serious bass players around here, and it may just push the administration to accept that hiring a dedicated jazz bass teacher is worth the money), but I personally get creeped out a bit by the determined focus of some of the students here. I had no idea what my own adulthood would be like at the age of 17, when I was a freshman trombone/history major...and there are other things about the collegiate experience aside from the career planning that are of very great importance (smelling the roses, falling in love, taking some classes here and there in subjects you've never even imagined just to see what they're all about) that should factor into one's choice of where to go to school.

here we go...

Shouldn't that be "...and awayyy we go?.."

Well , I think most of you are getting way out of line. Not to mention scrutinizing music schools like an actuary figuring out insurance rates.
First of all....WHO CARES.....? OK I would for one.
But really isn't it also true that good students make good teachers.
The main feeling I get here is who is scoring the most points and basically a lot of grandstanding. OK maybe it's teenage hormones.....
That's why I started the discussion of why do you go to school in the first place.
But I do think it is a sad state when young musicians at the start of their careers only can bicker about who's soon to be guru has the best stable of young studs.

My name should be on that list too. But I don't care. It is not important.

I remember when I got in to school I did so because i wanted the best musical environment. Of course job placement was important but I figured i'd take it as it came. Learning the bass takes forever ...
Why are these stat so important to you....

let"s not forget that besides the guys from whatever class that win auditions, there's the guys that win and don't get tenure because they don't know how to do a good job day to day and the countless others that play terrible auditions time after time from the same colleges.
I didn't go to a fancy school, but I worked hard, listened to concerts and recordings and tried to improve a little every day. I was certainly not cocky and maybe that's what saved me. I'm also extremely glad that the internet happened after my school days, because I would have wasted precious PRACTICE TIME in front of my screen.

:eyebrow:
buzz

Hey, I saw everyone else was posting where they were going. I got accepted at Indiana University, Michigan State University, CCM, and Oberlin. I got scholarship everywhere, too. I got $16,000 a year to IU, $17,000 a year to MSU, $8,000 a year to CCM, and $12,000 a year plus $11,200 in grants to Oberlin. I eventually decided on Indiana University although it was a really hard choice :crying:

I feel like browsing through this thread is like watching a bad soap opera.

Here are my final results.

Lynn University - Accepted
CCM - Accepted
Juilliard - Waitlisted

I'm going to CCM next year. I can't wait to study with Mr. Laszlo, and the school is great and hey, I can always study with Levinson at Aspen.

Good for you. Al Laszlo's a good guy. You'll learn a lot from him. All of his students really love him.

Congrats Lauren on IU!!!!

Also Congrats to Sibass89 on CCM!!!

Rest assured Laszlo is the ****!!! You will be welcomed with open arms here, I'm a student at CCM and I honestly wouldn't have it any other way. I look forward to meeting you.

Lata,
Cassidy Morgan

Hey what does CCM stand for? Chicago Conservatory of Music?

Cincinnati College-Conservatory of Music

Nine years would probably be plenty of data, but the data is half missing. The first three years only post a handful of audition results. And, as I said, there could be more useful information to it that isn't shown. I'm not saying kpo is lazy. The list is very useful, but it doesn't give a complete picture.


Paul, I don't think the problems you list are "legitimate".

"Audition Winners" lists EVERY full time ICSOM bass audition that the AFM announced since I started taking auditions. It even includes orchestras like Seattle and New Orleans that don't always announce in the AFM newspaper, and you have to be somehow "in the loop" to hear about them.

It is NOT "selective" in any sense other than the audition must be for a full time ICSOM orchestra. I've even gone out of my way to list "one-year" full time ICSOM jobs when they're "announced". (some orchestras hold "secret" auditions for one-year openings)

If you, Paul, (or anyone!) can find an audition that was missed, then by all means (as the "winners list" thread suggests), point it out on that forum and it'll be added! Good luck, dude. If you think there were more auditions than "67"... well, it's entirely possible I missed one somewhere, but mainly I'd be concerned about Delusions students might be holding about how much work is actually available.

The huge glut of auditions over the past years is not normal, I'm told.

Yes, it's a huge glut to have 10 openings in one year! That's right! Probably over 100 reasonably good college bass players graduating in North America EVERY YEAR, yet you should feel lucky to have more than 4 ICSOM auditions.

We might be in the middle of a "golden age" - many US orchestras went full time in the late 60s to early 80s - before then it was just NY, Cleveland, Chicago, LA, maybe two or three others. The other 50 or so orchestras added tons of personnel in the 70s or so, and those folks are probably all retiring about now. It might be like this for a while, or it might be "over". Either way, get practicing.

Alright, I understand.

If you are really considering all of these schools you might want to pick the one that has the better job placement rate so far......As I have seen only about two guys have come out of MSM in the past 4 years and they were Dan K. and Scott Pingel. Yes they got big jobs but they were both a lot older when they attended MSM. Both had already done their undergrads and Dan even did his masters at Yale before he went to MSM. Anyways just a thought.....

I understand where you're coming from, but, in addition to the points already made, I'd like to point out that it's also that for most schools besides Indiana and Curtis. For example, according to the audition winners list thread, in the last four years Juilliard has only one job winner.

Actually 2 in the last 4 years. Satoshi Okamoto and Zach Cohen. From "the list" about 6 total from Juilliard since 1997. However, there is no doubt that IU and Curtis have had an extraordinary run the past few years.

It seems like a thread is needed that gives some stats on the different schools. Such as how many people graduate each year, what kind of careers are they pursuing, who they study under, who they have previously studied under. I know some people will study with multiple teachers at the same time. I guy that I went to Michigan State with studied with a member of the Detroit Symphony while he was studying with Mr. Budrow. There are a lot of facts like that that could give some more insight into the information posted on the "audition winners" thread. I do love the "audition winners" thread though.

It seems like a thread is needed that gives some stats on the different schools. Such as how many people graduate each year, what kind of careers are they pursuing, who they study under, who they have previously studied under.

The only problem with this is that the information on this website is tragically inaccurate. It is natural though, since most of it is second hand information. Many people hear about auditions from friends that took them and then report that information here. Information like this about colleges would most likely cause many prospective bass students to be misled. Perhaps this is one case that should actually be left to college admissions offices.

Agreed. College Admissions offices really should be the ones to maintain and publish accurate lists of their school's "audition winners" (tempered with relevant info like graduation numbers, etc.). But almost none do anything of the sort. Hence KPO's "Audition Winners" fills that void 'til something better comes along.

Agreed. College Admissions offices really should be the ones to maintain and publish accurate lists of their school's "audition winners" (tempered with relevant info like graduation numbers, etc.). But almost none do anything of the sort. Hence KPO's "Audition Winners" fills that void 'til something better comes along.

However, what this is failing to notice is that the number of "audition winners" as listed on this website is not an accurate account of how many players from each school go on to be successful professional musicians.

Well here is my beef with everybody on this website. Good for Indiana and good for Curtis but the fact is there are still plenty of kids from Indiana and from Curtis who don't have jobs. The teacher doesnt make the student the student makes the teacher. Yes, there might a preferred style of the time which is where the teacher comes into play but if you're not good enough you're not gonna be good enough no matter what school you go to or what teacher you study with.

Everybody on this website should look for a place where they grow and they can learn. I've read that KPO went to Indiana for grad and was an education major for undergrad. But that was the best way for him to grow and he has a job.

Anybody still looking into colleges for next year and all the years after that, look for a teacher that you have chemistry with, a teacher that you feel comfortable with, and an environment where you believe you can learn. A great player can go to a great school but hate it and not get anything out of it.

This stuff about the auditions list not being complete because of the way it lists colleges and the auditions is just nonsensical. Everybody should be happy that somebody would actually take the time and post the winners online.

Well here is my beef with everybody on this website. Good for Indiana and good for Curtis but the fact is there are still plenty of kids from Indiana and from Curtis who don't have jobs. The teacher doesnt make the student the student makes the teacher.

Thank you. This has been on my mind for a while. a Great Teacher will not produce students who win jobs unless the students are doing good things too.

The teacher doesnt make the student the student makes the teacher.

I'm not sure about that.
I think it's more like a 2-way street.
More like a 3-way street; student, teacher, college environment.
That's why the the winners list includes the school/gig each winner was coming from.

The only problem with this is that the information on this website is tragically inaccurate. It is natural though, since most of it is second hand information. Many people hear about auditions from friends that took them and then report that information here.

Just for "disclosure's sake", on the "winners" thread, I've taken just under 30 of those listed auditions. For the auditions I didn't attend, I get info. from the Personnel Manger of each orchestra and/or get the scoop from audition finalists or the winners themselves.

Just for "disclosure's sake", on the "winners" thread, I've taken just under 30 of those listed auditions. For the auditions I didn't attend, I get info. from the Personnel Manger of each orchestra and/or get the scoop from audition finalists or the winners themselves.

But you must agree that some threads regarding auditions have been rediculous. There are always different versions of who went to the finals, etc.

My comment was directed less towards the winners thread (which i personally think is pretty cool - however controversial it may be) and more towards this website as a whole.

The Bass Collective. Accepted for the 2 year program and skipped a seimester. Yay.

[[This certainly seems to be true, and at IU it has resulted in an alarming drop in the number of bassists in the jazz program. Here, there is no jazz bass teacher, and it has been the tradition that bassists in the jazz program would just study with the classical teachers.

This was a problem last year when my son was doing the audition and school search thing. But I thought that they had resolved this and found a fulltime jazz professor?

IMO a fine school like IU should get this taken care ASAP.

I auditioned for the Conservatory at Wheaton College, IL in November 05, accepted in December...I'm going in as a Music Composition major with bass as primary instrument, under the tutelage of Ms. Virginia Dixon. My major is subject to change, but I'm hoping to pursue bass.

I got off the waiting list at Juilliard and will be going there next year to study with Orin O'Brien! I can't wait, this is going to be amazing.

Congratulations.

"This certainly seems to be true, and at IU it has resulted in an alarming drop in the number of bassists in the jazz program. Here, there is no jazz bass teacher, and it has been the tradition that bassists in the jazz program would just study with the classical teachers."

This was a problem last year when my son was doing the audition and school search thing. But I thought that they had resolved this and found a fulltime jazz professor?

IMO a fine school like IU should get this taken care ASAP.

For the last school year, IU retained the services of a well-respected Louisville jazz bassist and teacher to teach the jazz bassists a lesson every other week. This turned out to be a temporary solution, and starting this fall the school will have a full-time jazz bass teacher offering weekly lessons and masterclasses to the bassists among the jazz studies majors. I can't say who it is because the official announcement hasn't been made, but hopefully good things will be happening here and jazz bassists will feel excited about coming to IU and learning alongside the excellent drummers who come here to study with Steve Houghton.

[[This turned out to be a temporary solution, and starting this fall the school will have a full-time jazz bass teacher offering weekly lessons and masterclasses to the bassists among the jazz studies majors.

That's good to hear.

[[I can't say who it is because the official announcement hasn't been made, but hopefully good things will be happening here and jazz bassists will feel excited about coming to IU and learning alongside the excellent drummers who come here to study with Steve Houghton.

I know who I would have liked to have seen there. Too late for us but...

Just found out yesterday that I've been accepted to the Sibelius Academy! I'm a happy camper.:D :D :D

Congrats, Conor. That is quite a laudable feat.

I seem to remember that Esko Laine, a member of the Berlin Philharmonic, studied there. Do I recall correctly?

Congrats, Conor. That is quite a laudable feat.

I seem to remember that Esko Laine, a member of the Berlin Philharmonic, studied there. Do I recall correctly?

As far as I know that's correct. Most of the top Finnish classical musicians will have come through the Academy. Teppo Hauta-Aho studied there too.

Hey,

Come to Montclair. We've got a growing program that you'll actually be able to be a part of and make a significant difference in. Our roster is boasting 10 double bassists this semester. Our teacher is excellent and there are tons of opportunities to play. Email me at wallacej3@mail.montclair.edu if you want to chat.

Joe

here's my results:

Curtis: Not Accepted
Peabody: Accepted, $17,500 Scholarship including work-study
MSM: Accepted, No financial info yet
Cleveland Institute: Accepted, $26,000 Scholarship plus work-study
IU: Accepted, No financial info yet

my conductor in my undergrad advised me to stick to the school that the teacher fits and you get the most scholarship. peabody was my first choice since i've taken a lesson with weisner, but i've also taken a lesson with dimoff at cleveland and both are inspiring.

i refuse to be in debt forever, so my practical side says accept cleveland. but hal robinson is coming on board peabody's program again and that's hard to pass up. does anyone know anything about max's students? how about job placement?

thanks

Well done, but why did you post this in the 2006 thread?

Well done, but why did you post this in the 2006 thread?

whoops... sorry guys. is there a 2009 thread?

I guess this one qualifies:

http://www.talkbass.com/forum/showthread.php?t=449797&page=6