Ok... Im not all that great at bass. But im decent. Im in a Emo/Metal band and i just want to know, what would be a good speed for the bass? And at a concert where how would you set up with two guitarists a bassist/singer and a drummer?

Emo/Metal? :eyebrow:

1.what would be a good speed for the bass?

Same SPEED as everyone else.

2.And at a concert where how would you set up with two guitarists a bassist/singer and a drummer?

To the left of the drummer.

Set up in your garage and practice. not to be a jerk but if you got to ask a question like that your not ready to play in a concert setting......unless this emo/metal stuff you play is just a bunch of headbanging depression type stuff. As far as the speed to play? Again set up in your garage and practice. :bassist:

Seriously Do not sour the Metal name with Emo Please... It is Screamo better known as Refuse. But yea As far as speed goes i think you mean Do you play note for note the guitars or be more rythmic with the drums... Try both out and see what you like best... Note for note Guitar be like Playing bass to slayer.... where as feeling it would be like Opeth's Damnation album. Anyhow gluck and drop the HAwthorne heights taking back sunday crap and buy Slayers-Reign In Blood and Nevermore's THis godless endeavor. good way to get into real metal.



Aaron D.

1.what would be a good speed for the bass?

Same SPEED as everyone else.

2.And at a concert where how would you set up with two guitarists a bassist/singer and a drummer?

To the left of the drummer.

+1.

Always good to be playing at the same "speed" as the rest of your band IMHO. :smug: :smug:

Emo/Metal? :eyebrow:

Emo makes me sick.

Okay, now people, this guy came and asked you about his setup, and you start bashing the type of music he plays :s? *** ?

As you can see, it's better not to feel compelled to give your music a label....especially not something trendy like "Emo". Just call it heavy rock or something, then ask your questions.

Can you explain your question about "speed" a bit?

If you're talking about picking as fast as your guitar players pick (if they're double picking at high speed), you may not be able to keep up if you're using fingers, so you can half the finger picking. Or, you could write different basslines and play them the way you want.

Okay, now people, this guy came and asked you about his setup, and you start bashing the type of music he plays :s? *** ?



dude your sig speaks for yourself lol

Well...the right bass is the bass that please you. I know that the Fender Precision is quite popular among Emo bands, but play whatever fits YOU the best.

the words emo and metal should NEVER be used in the same sentence. :scowl:

Ok i recently joined a metal band having never played metal before. At first i found it pretty quick as a finger player, especially as the songs are much faster live than on CD.
However after a few weeks i began to find things much easier and founf my fingerstyle had become much tighter and more accurate as a happy by product. Feel free to dive over to www.myspace.com/balanceofsilence to hear some stuff, although i hasten to add its the old bass player playing on there NOT me!!, but i found it a great introduction to playing metal and maybe you will find the songs helpful to learn.
Good Luck!

dude your sig speaks for yourself lol

Holy crap I forgot all about that, wait wait wait, I'm not making fun of music though... And it wasnt me who said that...

:hiding:

i just got self-owned

At the gig, take a small 25W practice amp to save on weight, and when the show starts, turn it off. Seriously. Just act as if you are playing with exaggerated picking motions and jump around a lot. If you feel that you must turn the amp on, then make sure you pick way up on the fretboard and make sure your playing has absolutely no definetion. Crank the bass knob on the EQ and turn the treble and middle all the way down. Make sure the tone knob on the bass is all the way down too.

In an age where it's more about fashion than music, you MUST make sure the music doesn't get any better than the actual fashion show happening off the stage. You are just there for looks. Hopefully you notified all your friends on myspace so you get a large crowd.

Sorry for the long rant or if that offends anyone, but I really needed to get that out of my system.

Seriously Do not sour the Metal name with Emo Please... It is Screamo better known as Refuse. But yea As far as speed goes i think you mean Do you play note for note the guitars or be more rythmic with the drums... Try both out and see what you like best... Note for note Guitar be like Playing bass to slayer.... where as feeling it would be like Opeth's Damnation album. Anyhow gluck and drop the HAwthorne heights taking back sunday crap and buy Slayers-Reign In Blood and Nevermore's THis godless endeavor. good way to get into real metal.



Aaron D.

Before you start bashing on bands or genres, please get your information straight. Bands like Hawthorne Heights and Taking Back Sunday have been wrongly identified as being screamo bands, while the real genre of screamo has been around for quite some time, starting with bands like Saetia (1997), and Reversal of Man (1997), and sounds like nothing of that of the previous bands stated. I'm not trying to start fights, but please do your research before posting. I don't even like Hawthorne Heights or Taking Back Sunday, but I just think to criticize someone based on their preference of music is rediculous.

For one thats not what i meant. I mean some songs are going to be emo, some are going to be metal. Two- Im not in it for looks. Im in it for music.

If you're talking about picking as fast as your guitar players pick (if they're double picking at high speed), you may not be able to keep up if you're using fingers, so you can half the finger picking. Or, you could write different basslines and play them the way you want.

+1 :ninja:

For one thats not what i meant. I mean some songs are going to be emo, some are going to be metal. Two- Im not in it for looks. Im in it for music.

Hmmm, new_2_bass, this is the wrong forum for your questions, try Misc. Forum. You can try the search as well, I'm sure you'll find some usefull info that way. :)

the words emo and metal should NEVER be used in the same sentence. :scowl:

He's playing a mix of emo and metal.
See, it wasn't that hard. Grow up dude.

Misc?

Misc = Miscellaneous

Here : http://www.talkbass.com/forum/forumdisplay.php?f=30

Oh.... I feel dumb now.

i've beaten the crap out of an EMO last week and whoever start saying that im ridiculous, you seriously should not play bass because whoever play bass, must run away of emo

I think that if a moderator comes and restrict me from saying that, it would be very wrong because they would be hypocrites. I can assure that every skilled bass player HATES emo

Why do you assume that every "skilled" bass player is a closed minded music listener?

Your opinion is your own and you are entitled to it, just try not to force it on others.

i've beaten the crap out of an EMO last week and whoever start saying that im ridiculous, you seriously should not play bass because whoever play bass, must run away of emo

You don't seem to be a native english-speaker, so I'll let your grammar slide.

But that's still the dumbest thing I've heard in a while.

I think that if a moderator comes and restrict me from saying that, it would be very wrong because they would be hypocrites. I can assure that every skilled bass player HATES emo

lawlz, u r weird, m8.

Seriously, I hate how anytime someone even mentions the word "emo", a thread just turns in to a bash-fest. The threadstarter didn't make this thread for you to come in here and make everyone think you're cool for bashing it. Leave it alone if you don't have any real contribution to the topic.

And now to answer the threadstarter's questions: I'm not sure what you mean by speed of the bass, but as far as sertting up, the norm for bass + 2 guitars is one guitar on one side, and a guitar and bass on the other. Which side of the drummer you're on is up to you. Some people like to be near the high hat cause it helps them keep time.

I think that if a moderator comes and restrict me from saying that, it would be very wrong because they would be hypocrites. I can assure that every skilled bass player HATES emo

Stop generalizing. You're dead wrong.

Threadstarter dude, keep up with the same speed as the rest of the band(namely the drummer), and ALWAYS set up on either side of him/her. Best of luck to you, and welcome to TB(sorry you had to get slammed).

i've beaten the crap out of an EMO last week and whoever start saying that im ridiculous, you seriously should not play bass because whoever play bass, must run away of emo

I congratulate the man that told you paint thinner made a good cocktail. Keep on truckin', Hoss.

I can assure that every skilled bass player HATES emo

my apologies for this BUT, Your an idiot.

Hating something has what to do with bass skill?

Maybe this topic would have been alot more descriptive if the person who started the thread named some influences??? what kinda stuff are you playing, stuff like unearth? or megadeth.

I play in a metalcore band (unearth, Norma Jean, etc) And i play all the guitar parts with the guitars mainly so that breakdowns run together better. And just becuase your playing a genre with vocals that are barely understandable doesnt mean that the bass should be.

this is my setup when playing live

Guitar 1 Bass Drums Guitar 2

Vocals




what most bands do tho is everyone will just wonder around on stage and find out what they like and there amps will be situated like this

Guitar Bass Drums Bass Guitar

Vocals


Take lab of god for example, that is their live setup from the past....10 years or so?

change it up switch sides find your comfort zone.

I thought emo and metal were polar opposites?

Emo: Waaahhh

Metal: RAWWR!!!

i've beaten the crap out of an EMO last week and whoever start saying that im ridiculous, you seriously should not play bass because whoever play bass, must run away of emo



I can just picture a bunch of Emo kids walking around Rio De Janero along the beach with thong clad Brazillian women and some topless girls with you kickin the crap outta them!!!!! :) :smug: :eek: :rolleyes: :p :D Hey are you really better than Jaco and Wooten or is that just a fantasy. :bassist:

I think what he is refering to by emo/metal is maybe Metalcore?
I mean, like Bullet for my Valentine, Killswitch Engaged, etc... I mean, I dont like the poppy emo music either, but I do like the edgier side to it. I find it pretty idiotic to not like something JUST for the reason its trendy? People should stop worrying about trying so hard to be different and just be themselves...Like what they want to without guilt. I mean, some of it is actually good music, despite what people say...Ehem. Anyways...

I would say that you should play the same tempo as the rest of the band, and it seems pretty typical of modern "emo" bassists to pump out 8th note roots, and being a singer, people will cut you some slack for not being the best bassist.
Really, take sometime and listen to the song... A slow emo ballad wouldnt really call for quadrupilets, now would it?
Um, as far as setup goes, Id say do something along these lines-

You in the middle, with your bass amp either angled behind the drummer, or by the rhythm guitarist....Or if you have two cabs, put one of each on both sides.
Have the guitarists on both sides of the drummer, to even out the sounds.

Ok for the dick thats being retarded. I guess i wouldnt understand, because im not a "skilled bass player". **** you. I don't care if you hate emo people. You might like to beat people up just because how they look or act, but i think your a dumbass.

Ok for the dick thats being retarded. I guess i wouldnt understand, because im not a "skilled bass player". **** you. I don't care if you hate emo people. You might like to beat people up just because how they look or act, but i think your a dumbass.

DING DING DING DING!!!! LETS GET READY TO RUMBLE!!!!!!!!!!! :hyper: :hyper: :hyper: :hyper:
Hey does TB have A Steel Cage forum for threads that start getting heated???? Cause this one is getting hot!!!!! :eek:

Meh. Don't feed the trolls and they'll stop coming back.

Meh. Don't feed the trolls and they'll stop coming back.
yhea your right...forget the steel cage! :cool:

but the cage is just sitting in my bassment getting rusty and I never get to use it. PLEASE can I bring out the cage PLEASE?

At the gig, take a small 25W practice amp to save on weight, and when the show starts, turn it off. Seriously. Just act as if you are playing with exaggerated picking motions and jump around a lot. If you feel that you must turn the amp on, then make sure you pick way up on the fretboard and make sure your playing has absolutely no definetion. Crank the bass knob on the EQ and turn the treble and middle all the way down. Make sure the tone knob on the bass is all the way down too.

In an age where it's more about fashion than music, you MUST make sure the music doesn't get any better than the actual fashion show happening off the stage. You are just there for looks. Hopefully you notified all your friends on myspace so you get a large crowd.

Sorry for the long rant or if that offends anyone, but I really needed to get that out of my system.

How is cranking the bass eq going to matter if he already turned off his '25W practice amp'?

all of these responses are bogus. I don't like emo, I hate the word, the genre, the pants, the haircuts. But this kid is only asking a question and you're giving him crap.

As far as speed goes, I would say 8th notes or 16th's. I play in what I CONSIDER a metal band because to me that's what shredding guitars and fast basslines are all about.

When I say play fast, you have to play in time. If the signature is 4/4 make sure you're only playing 4 beats per measure and chord change.

How is cranking the bass eq going to matter if he already turned off his '25W practice amp'?


Kickin'Fruit, Winner of Innanetz Sarcasm Recognition 2006.

Kickin'Fruit, Winner of Innanetz Sarcasm Recognition 2006.

oh wait. haha I missed the "if you feel you must turn the amp on" part. Hmm lame anyway.

Hmm lame anyway.


Being a rant, it shouldn't bee TOO funny, but the funniest part is the truth backing it.


P.S. I hate working Saturdays.

I'm old and cranky, and not even sure what Emo is, although I know metal when I hear it. Style of music doesn't matter. Play with the drummer, play with the guitarist, do your own thing entirely, the important thing is that it compliments the song, and knowing how to do that requires expirimentation on your part. Don't get stuck in a box doing what you think an Emo/Metal player should play. Play what sounds and feels good to you.

As far as setup, in my experience, you're better off setting up on stage like you're set up at rehearsal. If you're used to rehearsing next to the singer, you may be thrown off if you stand next to a guitarist and drummer on stage. I would recommend rehearsing next to the drummer, though. And be prepared to change your stage setup. Some clubs are so small that you can't sneeze without clubbing the singer and an audience member with your headstock. Others are so large that you can hear an echo trying to talk to the rest of the rhythym section. Either one is different from your garage/rehearsal studio/living room/barn/whatever, and might throw you off if you're not prepared.

In other words, play what sounds good and be flexible. Have fun.

Finaly. Something that makes sence.

I'm NOT trying to join the bashing, but this came to mind.
This is entirely a joke, no offense to metal or emo implied.

Emo Vs. Metal (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zi9V1QbQj74)

If you are talking about Metalcore/Hardcore then I'm in the same ballpark. I recently joined a Nintendocore band (I'll explain later) since they were looking for a bassist and I've been having to adapt to a completely new style of playing. What I've found out is that you really need to realize half the time the bass won't be playing an important role so you don't want to get too complex with it (odds are if your drummer/guitarists are as loud as mine then you probably shouldn't worry too much about your tone etc.). What I do is I always analyse the song into it's different parts and realize what works best for different parts.

For the intro I just play whatever the guitars are playing (sometimes on some songs I actually bring in the intro... other times the guitar does and I come in with the drums). After the intro and in the verse I generally go in and play along with the drums putting in some fills here and there. The breakdown is the part where I generally like to have fun... write some cool little groovy riffs to play during that and then the crowd will definetly remember you. I usually go and look at bands like Black Sabbath and Metallica (Cliff Burton can be an unbelivable source of inspiration) to find the types of riffs I'm looking for.


(Nintendocore is a mix of Hardcore/Metalcore with more upbeat lyrics and really cheesy almost video game like guitar riffs and synthesisers set to classic video game sounds EX: HORSE the Band)

Well, on that note I think Im Sonycore....Im for a more adult audience, Im allways trying to make revolutionary delivery devices that you dont ever find effective and Im expensive! Heheheheh.. (Starts crying in the realization of his own nerdom, and because he just talked about himself in the 2nd person within parenthensis online, only adding to his evergrowing nerdiness...)

Well, on that note I think Im Sonycore....Im for a more adult audience, Im allways trying to make revolutionary delivery devices that you dont ever find effective and Im expensive! Heheheheh.. (Starts crying in the realization of his own nerdom, and because he just talked about himself in the 2nd person within parenthensis online, only adding to his evergrowing nerdiness...)
It's okay man... you're only talking in third person.
(Nintendocore is a mix of Hardcore/Metalcore with more upbeat lyrics and really cheesy almost video game like guitar riffs and synthesisers set to classic video game sounds EX: HORSE the Band)
I just want to tell you how cool you are.

Wow... You lost me.

Am I the only one who plays bass and still can stomach songs with simple bass/no bass at all? I love the new Eels record which doesn't have a single complex/prominent bass line but the music is still great. Yes, that's possible. :eek:

I'd love to join a Nintendocore band, by the way. o_O

is that even possible???? i know that all the metal heads at my school hate the emo kids...and the emo kids would probably hate the metalheads back, but theyre too busy doing other things...which i wont name so i dont offend.

They won't be offended. They're too busy doing other things.

Emo makes me sick.

+100000 Gives me the runs.


That information was probably unnecessary now that I think about it.

my band gets stuck having to play shows with emo bands quite regularly and i still dont know what emo is, all i know is everyone that plays it sucks.

Thats nice man. Its america. You have your own right to say whatever the hell you want. I really don't care though.

Nah.

Give me ostrich every time. :) :)

New 2 Bass, welcome to TB. This thread is absolutely disappointing. Don't pay attention to any of the musical conservatives that are giving you sh**. Play whatever you want.

I used to play in a band that was often classified as emo; we thought of it as hardcore laced with metal, with melodic vocals. Labels are not very interesting though; just play the music that comes out of the collaboration with your bandmates and continue to be constructively critical of each other's contributions.

My experience of playing this type of music was that although you're in a sonically hectic musical environment, there is a substantial role for the bass to make sure it stays coherent. In my band, the two guitar players played mainly in the mid- and upper registers, often riffing with and against each other. I used a deep, dark bass tone that projected from under their playing. I had a lot of room. The guitars and the vocalist would all be vying for musical space and I made sure I was not getting in their way but supported their efforts.
Keeping it simple is important. But, that said, don't be afraid to make things more interesting when you get a chance. I often found myself sticking to 8th notes, because that was what sounded best and provided a rhythmic drive for the guitars and vocals. Pay close attention to your drummer. You need to lock in with him/her.

It might also help you to learn a little bit about chord theory and how chord progression may be used. In riff heavy music such as hardcore, metal and related genres, guitarists (who, like it or not, dominate a great deal of the music) often play riffs in unison for repeated stretches. The bass notes you play under this riffing will determine what chord the listener hears and the singer responds to. If the guitarists are repeatedly playing a metal riff in a minor E scale, and you plays bars of 8th notes that are E, A, C and then A for instance, you can create a real depth in the song, and make it into very interesting sounding, metallish progression. The guitars create a drone that gives a real drive to the song, and it is you, the bass player, that allows them to do that. Iron Maiden uses this to great effect - check it out.

Good luck!

K thanks for the help.

N2B, I agree with duckyincarnate...don't listen to the non-musical comments...

I would suggest learning to read music and practicing with a metronome, even if you're in a "non-music-reading" kind of band. You won't regret it years down the line.

Look outside your chosen genre for inspiration, and even outside of music itself (visual art, poetry, books etc.)

Things pop out at you when you least expect them to, so don't limit yourself; Matt Rubano (Taking Back Sunday) used to be a session bassist playing more funk- and jazz-style music before joining TBS.

And get a teacher who you can relate to; it'll invaluable!

sean

I had a teacher kind of. Just one of my friends that taught me E's A's things like that. He was teaching me how to slap and stuff but he moved away. And so far i don't know anyone else thats willing to teach me more on bass.

Holy crap I forgot all about that, wait wait wait, I'm not making fun of music though... And it wasnt me who said that...

:hiding:

i just got self-owned

no man, you got pwned - even worse

;)

hey dude, welcome to TB. I'm not sure why everyone is bashing on you but just ignore them. I'm a fan of emo and i've got a few friends who classify themselves as that too so its all good.

From your questions it seems like your probing for some general info here. From past experiences in the stage setup, and from going to a lot of concerts, I would say I usually see the bass player on the Left of the drummer, but i've seen it on the right and even center before, i've played multiple ways but whatever works best for you is the best. I hear better out of my right ear so I always postion myself based on that, so again personal preference, the band leader might also dictate your standing position.

As far as you timing question goes, I was explained by my current band leader a way that might help you understand this. Basically what he said was that I should be playing at half the speed of the guitar player, so if he's playing really really fast, I would still be fast but not as fast as him. I was told this because they were teaching me the place that bass served, being my first real band experience at the time. Basically to sum it up, bass sounds good because the bassist keeps good time. A bass looks and may be easier to play than guitar on some things, but it's the bassist who keeps everyone in shape (with the help of a drummer). If you listen to music, like really listen to it without any other distractions, sometimes you will notice that the really cool and "good" songs are ones where the bassist is just holding down the timing and not getting all fancy. Sure fancy is cool, but not all the time.

As far as trying to learn and stuff, I would suggest checking out musictheory.net for some helpful background info, yeah it may be boring learning theory at first but it pays tons as it helps you advance your playing much faster.

Also another resource for learning that might be helpful would be to take a look at online bass tab sites, such as bassmasta.net, basically tab is a form of notation where it shows the strings and the frets that you should play. It doesn't give you any rythmic information but it gives you the finger placement in an easy to read manner. It is helpful for first steps in learning and its pretty cool to be able to learn familiar songs that others have already converted out to tab notation.

hope this helps and welcome to talkbass,

david.

If it's not wooten, it's crap!







oh wait, wooten is crap.

If it's not wooten, it's crap!







oh wait, wooten is crap.


how constructive :scowl:

now you're no better than those bashing emo...

how constructive :scowl:

now you're no better than those bashing emo...

but just as funny! :D

he may be onto something.. wooten is so good, that maybe he's bad.... to the level of crap