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VIEW FULL LIVE VERSION : 3 New Watson Basses - watch their construction
Watson Guitars 07-05-2008, 12:51 AM I am ready to start a new batch three new bass guitars, one 6 string and two five strings. One will be headless, one fretless and one will be a top-of-the line deluxe version with the best woods available to me. I am planning to document their build histories here on TalkBass and if there's enough interest from TalkBass members I will detail the progress of each over the coming 3-4 months in this thread.
Let me know what you think. Alex
gkbass13 07-05-2008, 12:53 AM sounds awesome, alex. looking forward to seeing the developement of your new instruments.
-grady
Nomad98 07-05-2008, 07:55 AM Count me in on this one... would love to see the build progress.
Nomad98
eleonn 07-05-2008, 12:03 PM I am interested already!!
Watson Guitars 07-05-2008, 02:25 PM OK - I'll get things started on these in the next couple of days so keep an eye on this thread!
Eric618 07-05-2008, 02:33 PM Count me in too!
CTbass&birdsong 07-05-2008, 02:34 PM Subscribed..:D
Darkstrike 07-05-2008, 02:43 PM I'ma watchin'!
eleonn 07-05-2008, 02:54 PM OK - I'll get things started on these in the next couple of days so keep an eye on this thread!
Should I have to get the pop corn and coke ready? :p
envika 07-05-2008, 10:40 PM Should I have to get the pop corn and coke ready? :p
Coke? Nah,if you're planning on staying up for three days, speed might be your thing.
callmeMrThumbs 07-06-2008, 02:11 AM I am very interested! I enjoyed seeing a Watson instrument in the latest issue of Bass Player. Very nice work! I look forward to seeing these builds documented.
-Josh
jordan_frerichs 07-06-2008, 04:36 AM Coke? Nah,if you're planning on staying up for three days, speed might be your thing.
when i work late/all night(stupid hand tools:scowl:) i just crank up the radio, and get a pack of coke
bassmanhamilton 07-06-2008, 06:15 AM Subscribed!
Looking forward to watching this!
capnsandwich 07-06-2008, 06:19 AM Subscribed. I love these threads.:hyper:
eleonn 07-06-2008, 09:36 AM when i work late/all night(stupid hand tools:scowl:) i just crank up the radio, and get a pack of coke
I prefer Inca Kola rather than Coke but none would know what is Inca Kola. I guess that cola (peruvian BTW) can be found in the States under other name once the producer was bought by Coke because they couldn't win in the market share.
tbone0813 07-06-2008, 09:43 AM I'm in :hyper:
Watson Guitars 07-06-2008, 08:37 PM Hi all - I was in the shop today selecting woods for these projects. On the left I have a single cut 5 string bass using Black & White Ebony on the top, Spalted maple on the back, and a neck-through of Maple and Ebony stringers and a Birdseye Maple fingerboard. The center bass is also a single-cut 5-string, short-scale, curly Koa top, Mahogany back and Iroko (maybe)/Maple neck-thru. I had the Koa top from another older project. The one on the right will be a 5-string double cut headless bass with a curly myrtle top and a really nice cedar back. Other details still to be decided... we're still in the formative stage here.
http://www.watsonguitars.net/images/talkbass/3_basses_1.jpg
Worshiper 07-07-2008, 07:07 AM I really like the koa... can't wait to see how this one turns out...
Watson Guitars 07-07-2008, 10:50 PM OK here's today's progress. I spend a good amount of time this afternoon sawing up a large block of Black & White Ebony (from Laos - very rare) into plates that will become the top and back of one of the basses. Nice wood, very dramatic stuff - should look awesome on the finished instrument.
http://www.watsonguitars.net/images/talkbass/021_topback.jpg
Watson Guitars 07-07-2008, 10:53 PM I also spent additional time on the bandsaw sawing up Iroko wood for the center core section of the short scale 5-string single-cut with the Koa top.
http://www.watsonguitars.net/images/talkbass/019_woods.jpg
Dave Muscato 07-07-2008, 10:57 PM Pretty cool, Alex - looking forward to seeing more!
pilotjones 07-07-2008, 11:50 PM Man, that Laotian ebony is hot.
capnsandwich 07-08-2008, 02:31 AM Man, that Laotian ebony is hot.
Yeah it is!
Eric618 07-08-2008, 07:12 AM OK here's today's progress. I spend a good amount of time this afternoon sawing up a large block of Black & White Ebony (from Laos - very rare) into plates that will become the top and back of one of the basses. Nice wood, very dramatic stuff - should look awesome on the finished instrument.
http://www.watsonguitars.net/images/talkbass/021_topback.jpgYEOW!!!! :hyper:
phoenix742 07-08-2008, 07:28 AM That ebony is awesome. subscribed.
eleonn 07-08-2008, 09:43 AM http://www.watsonguitars.net/images/talkbass/021_topback.jpg
Hummmmm looks to palemoon ebony. I like so much palemoon ebony. Almost no wood look that good to me. :cool:
Which one will be the top?
Watson Guitars 07-08-2008, 02:14 PM Good question eleonn, I haven't decided yet - have to look at them for a while!! Suggestions?
basse 07-08-2008, 02:18 PM Consider me subscribed!
FunkyFlashFive 07-08-2008, 02:52 PM I would vote for the right one as the top.
Nomad98 07-08-2008, 04:37 PM I would go with the right one also... (if I was lucky enough to be making the decision).
Awesome pieces of wood!
capnsandwich 07-08-2008, 08:06 PM Good question eleonn, I haven't decided yet - have to look at them for a while!! Suggestions?
I'd say flip a coin. They're both gorgeous pieces of wood.
Watson Guitars 07-08-2008, 08:07 PM Here we can see the rough cut tops for the headless (019) and the short scale single cut (020). The headless will have a curly myrtle top, probably sunburst when it's done, the single cut top is flamed Koa.
http://www.watsonguitars.net/images/talkbass/019_020_tops.jpg
Watson Guitars 07-08-2008, 08:44 PM Here are a few neck laminate blanks I cut today, I have to cut several more for these multi-lam necks. each one is basically a cross-section of the neck-through instrument. The neck/body core of both neck-through basses will have 7 laminations, each separated by double contrasting veneer. Same for the headless, the only difference there bing that it will have a bolt-on neck.
http://www.watsonguitars.net/images/talkbass/neck_blanks.jpg
eleonn 07-08-2008, 10:00 PM Id go for the right one but if the client likes tops with a less "complicated" look Id go for the left one.
pilotjones 07-08-2008, 11:04 PM What does the one on the left look like bookmatched on the other side, and what is the body shape?
eleonn 07-08-2008, 11:17 PM Pilot... those set would make the duck shaped bass looks insane!!! :D
johnny b 07-09-2008, 05:56 PM Count me in on your progress! I love to see things develope before my eyes! Very exciting!
Watson Guitars 07-10-2008, 12:35 AM Hi folks - today I cut more neck laminates on the bandsaw and also cut out body halves for the headless out of a really nice piece of local cedar that I have been keeping in the shop for just such a project. The headless bass will be incredibly light.
http://www.watsonguitars.net/images/talkbass/updates_0709.jpg
Psychicpet 07-10-2008, 12:57 AM lookin' good!
*subscribed :)
Larry Davis 07-10-2008, 10:30 AM Alex, I just read you use CNC in your shop. That's really the way to go for small shop increased production. How 'bout some techincial information to go along with this "ooh and awe" thread?
What parts do you CNC...bodies? necks? cavity routes? inlays? How about some photos of the actual shop work on these instruments? Many of us are always curious of shop techniques and equipment :D
What about finishes? How will you be finishing these instruments?
Watson Guitars 07-10-2008, 12:33 PM Larry! Imagine meeting you here. Hope all is well with you...
Yes - those are all good points. I appreciate hearing suggestions as they alert me to things I probably wouldn't have otherwise thought of.
I will address machinery, tooling and finishing as I continue with this thread. I have some machining coming up pretty soon using an Ornamental Mill. The actual CNC work is still a few days away but I'll make sure it's well documented and illustrated.
SDB Guitars 07-10-2008, 01:32 PM Subscribed!
smakbass 07-10-2008, 01:40 PM The matching p/u covers on that bass reviewed in bass player are sick..
Larry Davis 07-10-2008, 05:06 PM Larry! Imagine meeting you here. Hope all is well with you...
Yes - those are all good points. I appreciate hearing suggestions as they alert me to things I probably wouldn't have otherwise thought of.
I will address machinery, tooling and finishing as I continue with this thread. I have some machining coming up pretty soon using an Ornamental Mill. The actual CNC work is still a few days away but I'll make sure it's well documented and illustrated.
Alex, I've been on this forum for six years. Imagine meeting you here!! :D
CNC can really benefit customers more than they know in regards to quality work and production schedules. I think we're way past the old debate of CNC vs. handmade. It's now more about haves vs. have nots. There are several good builders ready to take the plunge..so to speak.
wilser 07-10-2008, 05:23 PM Alex, I've been on this forum for six years. Imagine meeting you here!! :D
CNC can really benefit customers more than they know in regards to quality work and production schedules. I think we're way past the old debate of CNC vs. handmade. It's now more about haves vs. have nots. There are several good builders ready to take the plunge..so to speak.
great points Larry! if I can have the machine do the bulk of the work for me, then why the heck not?!?!? more consistency all around, plus the CNC won't leave a 'finished' surface and there is plenty of work still left after the machine is done with the piece. I am one of those HAVE NOTs but if I had the space, dammit I would HAVE.
SDB Guitars 07-10-2008, 06:22 PM I have the space, it's ponying up the thousands (sometimes tens of thousands) of dollars for the machine, the software, the setup, and the learning curve.
Okay, let's be honest. It's mostly the money factor, at least in *my* case... ;)
Watson Guitars 07-10-2008, 07:12 PM I have to add too that the CNC technology is handy for repeated features, control cavities, inlay and stuff like that. I still find that there's no substitute for hand shaping necks and body profiles. I still do all that stuff the old fashioned way...
Watson Guitars 07-10-2008, 07:22 PM I have two K2 CNC Machines. one is 39"x24", the other is 50"x50" which is the largest size that I could find and still get the accuracy of ballscrew positioning. I also have a laser engraver now which i hope will open up opportunities for fancy inlay stuff...
http://www.watsonguitars.net/images/talkbass/WG_CNCs.jpg
scottyd 07-10-2008, 07:37 PM :eek:Wow what a nice setup you have there! The thought of letting a machine handle jobs like pup and control cavity routes sounds really nice. I doubt I'll ever go down that road though. My pickup winder is about as technical as I want to go. UNLESS......:hmm: They make a CNC finish sander, if there was a CNC finish sander readily available I would remortgage my house!! :p:D
Rudyboy98 07-11-2008, 12:07 AM Looks cool!
SUBSCRIBED!
R...
Watson Guitars 07-15-2008, 12:53 AM I have been stuck doing non-guitar work for a couple of days hence no updates worth reporting. One thing I did do was spend some time on the computer verifying dimensions of the headless bass on a 1:1 scale using a vector drawing program. This allows me to confirm some of the basic calculations such as how wide the neck will be, tapers and angles, so that I can cut my raw material with confidence. In the later stages the same detailed drawings allow me to make sure some of the finer details will come together like bridge and pickup placement, geometry of the neck/body joint etc. etc. I subscribe to the measure twice, cut once philosophy, especially based on the cost of hardwoods these days!!
By the way - I have to go to San Francisco over the next 5 days so there will be a short interruption in service. I'll post again as soon as I return and do some more work on these basses.
http://www.watsonguitars.net/images/talkbass/ai_scaledwg.jpg
eleonn 07-15-2008, 11:00 AM Alex which software do you use for such calculations?
capnsandwich 07-15-2008, 03:22 PM I have two K2 CNC Machines. one is 39"x24", the other is 50"x50" which is the largest size that I could find and still get the accuracy of ballscrew positioning. I also have a laser engraver now which i hope will open up opportunities for fancy inlay stuff...
http://www.watsonguitars.net/images/talkbass/WG_CNCs.jpg
Nice looking shop you have there, clean and high-tech. You must build some great stuff!
Watson Guitars 07-20-2008, 11:17 PM OK - I'm back from San Francisco - I'll start posting on the building progress again.
Eleonn - I use Illustrator for most of the drawing stuff, for me it's quick and easy because I am used to it. I also use Illustrator to create a lot of the vector artwork for the programming of the CNC machines.
For the laser, since it only reads Corel Draw files, I now have to learn that program too.
PilbaraBass 07-21-2008, 02:15 AM OK - I'm back from San Francisco - I'll start posting on the building progress again.
Eleonn - I use Illustrator for most of the drawing stuff, for me it's quick and easy because I am used to it. I also use Illustrator to create a lot of the vector artwork for the programming of the CNC machines.
For the laser, since it only reads Corel Draw files, I now have to learn that program too.
can't you convert the format?
Phil Mailloux 07-21-2008, 06:59 AM I see you're using Mach3. Are you using LazyCAM to generate the G-code?
I'm sure it can open any DXF or DWG you might want to make besides just CorelDRAW files. You usually can save to DWG with most software like Illustrator and CorelDRAW.
SBassman 07-21-2008, 07:19 AM Great thread. Subscribed.
Watson Guitars 07-21-2008, 01:02 PM yeah quite often I save an AI file as an EPS in Illustrator CS (not CS2 or CS3) and Corel will happily open that. If you're on the laser and just want to edit something it's way quicker to just do it in Corel.
Watson Guitars 07-23-2008, 07:04 PM Alright - I admit it - I didn't get a huge amount of work done today. As can be seen in this photo - I sawed up all the pieces of wood which will become tapered laminates in the headless bass. I did this for all three basses so I now have rough cut material for all the body and neck components. Next up I will put these strips on the ornamental mill so that I can cut them into their pre-calculated tapers.
http://www.watsonguitars.net/images/talkbass/020_1.jpg
SDB Guitars 07-23-2008, 07:34 PM I'm on the edge of my seat, here... :)
Watson Guitars 07-26-2008, 02:33 PM I got the first of the three sets of laminates up on the ornamental mill. The ones in this photo are the five center laminates for the bolt-on neck. I will also cut a corresponding set of laminates for the body section to match. The nice thing about the ornamental mill is that the cutter rides on a fixed horizontal surface but the work is secured on a 'floating' table below which I can set and secure at any angle I want.
http://www.watsonguitars.net/images/talkbass/020_2.jpg
Watson Guitars 07-26-2008, 02:34 PM here's a shot of the end result of cutting the neck laminates. I calculate the accumulated taper of all the lams together to match the natural taper of the neck. This is also continued through the body as if the bass was a neck-through. It's a little bit extra work but the end result is worth it. Obviously there's a good amount of maple to trim off the two outer edges in order get to the finished size. I do that later after everything is glued up.
http://www.watsonguitars.net/images/talkbass/020_3.jpg
Watson Guitars 08-01-2008, 12:12 AM Well even though I haven't updated for a few days I have been busy. Here's a photo of the three ebony stringers for the 5-string single-cut which have been tapered on the ornamental mill. I run the matching maple stringers through the same process so that I have a complete set of tapered stringers (in this case 5 of them). Now it's time to go to the vacuum press and apply some decorative veneers.
http://www.watsonguitars.net/images/talkbass/ebony_omill.jpg
PasdaBeer 08-01-2008, 04:11 AM i want one of those ornamental mills......
super cool
Rudyboy98 08-01-2008, 09:47 AM Nice truck BTW (having a logo like that advertising your guitars has got to be the best!
Watson Guitars 08-01-2008, 12:11 PM Rudy - estoy asombrado que no sabia que tu vives en Orange County! Acabo de ver tu MySpace. Yeah I dropped some vinyl on the truck a couple of years ago - best $250 I ever spent and it still looks slick!
Yes the O-Mill has many uses - it's primarily designed to create spiral columns and other fancy work for woodworkers...
http://legacywoodworking.com/gallery.cfm
eleonn 08-01-2008, 12:44 PM Alex yo que pensaba que Wilser era el único constructor que hablaba español... pero veo que tu también lo hablas. ¿De donde eres? A veces es más fácil para mi preguntar ciertas cosas en español así que creo que desde ahora te torturaré también a ti!!! ;)
Watson Guitars 08-01-2008, 04:34 PM Soy de Escocia dude. "Piper Down!!!" Ok back to English (or Scottish in my case") but you can ask me in Spanish any time!
wilser 08-01-2008, 04:42 PM caramba! un escoces viviendo en california ...claro que tiene que hablar espanol! especialmente si vive en cualquier sitio al sur de los angeles! :D
These CNCs are making me thirsty ...I mean, jealous!
alfredpunkjazz 08-01-2008, 04:45 PM Increíble trabajo.
:eek:
Rudyboy98 08-01-2008, 08:30 PM Rudy - estoy asombrado que no sabia que tu vives en Orange County! Acabo de ver tu MySpace. Yeah I dropped some vinyl on the truck a couple of years ago - best $250 I ever spent and it still looks slick!
Yes the O-Mill has many uses - it's primarily designed to create spiral columns and other fancy work for woodworkers...
http://legacywoodworking.com/gallery.cfm
Gracias por tus comentarios!
Si, vivo en el area de Anaheim, mas cerca de Knott's Berry Farm. Me tendrás que invitar a ver tus guitarras y bajos! You're from Scotland?! Your Spanish is pretty good! How'd you learn? A Latina wife?
How long have you been building? Have any pics of your finished work?? :D
Watson Guitars 08-01-2008, 09:06 PM Hi Rudy - I have a gazillion pics of finished work on my site. Just hit the link below.
So I take the laminates which I milled on the o-mill and transfer them to the vacuum press where I glue a light veneer on both sides of the dark laminate strips and a dark veneer onto both sides of the light laminate strips. The vacuum press is another must-have tool by the way.
Mi esposa es Mexicana/Apache pero ella no domina en Espanol, yo me enseno la idioma hace unos anos porque tenia muchos amigos hispanicos que no hablaban ingles. Mi espanol todavia es fatal :-(
http://www.watsonguitars.net/images/talkbass/021_1.jpg
gkbass13 08-01-2008, 09:27 PM everything looks awesome! I really dig your work, Alex.
gkbass13 08-01-2008, 09:27 PM really nice writeup in bass player as well.
Watson Guitars 08-01-2008, 09:40 PM Many thanks GK
Watson Guitars 08-01-2008, 09:42 PM So this is what the veneer looks like when it's stuck onto a tapered laminate. I clean it up on a spindle sander (another must-have) and these will go back in the vaccuum press for a second veneer on the other side...
http://www.watsonguitars.net/images/talkbass/020_4.jpg
Rudyboy98 08-02-2008, 04:07 PM Very nice website you have there Alex!
BTW-Is Cedar a feasible wood for a bass?...I kinda thought that the use might be limited to classical guitars. But, then again, what do I know? :D
I guess I shouldn't "judge a bass by its wood" w/o having more knowledge... :bassist:
Watson Guitars 08-02-2008, 04:51 PM I think the cedar has a lot of potential. Since I'm only using the cedar for the backs of the upper and lower bouts we're not really trading off much. The cedar I am using is nice stuff, very colorful grain and quite close-grained and dense for this species. Remember also, that the basses I build have very rigid laminated hardwood cores so that's where most of the tone/sustain comes from. The cedar is really lightweight, and for a headless bass I will not be risking neck-heaviness either. I think it will look awesome and the bass will be bright and punchy due to the materials in the core and the fact that it is a bolt-on.
Watson Guitars 08-09-2008, 01:23 AM Here's a shot of the rough cut laminates which will become the core section of the Koa topped bass..
http://www.watsonguitars.net/images/talkbass/019_3_lg.jpg
PilbaraBass 08-09-2008, 02:08 AM you started this thread one month ago...aren't you done yet??? :scowl:
;)
Nice...I can't wait to see some body shots....
SBassman 08-09-2008, 03:24 AM These CNCs are making me thirsty ...
:D
http://audiofiles1.jerryseinfeld.nl/george1.jpg
jongor 08-09-2008, 05:49 AM I recently made a body out of a spanish cedar core sandwiched by walnut, it's nice and light, and because I used an oil/wax finish it's very aromatic, but the bass has no punch to the tone, no mids, very open sounding.
So I think your method of providing a solid hardwood core is a good one.
Watson Guitars 08-09-2008, 11:51 AM Pilbara - blimey mate I wish I could finish three of these basses in a month - unfortunately I'm also working on two guitars, one special project bass and finishing up a 4-string. When I'm not doing that I'm working on the house or updating my website. :-)
You'll just have to keep reading to the bitter end I'll be happy if they are all ready for NAMM in January!!!!
PasdaBeer 08-09-2008, 01:55 PM Yes the O-Mill has many uses - it's primarily designed to create spiral columns and other fancy work for woodworkers...
http://legacywoodworking.com/gallery.cfm
i bet! i kinda made a "ghetto mill" with some FD fir and plexglass.
it works great for some stuff, but not the same : (
Watson Guitars 08-15-2008, 02:52 AM I'm busy gluing like crazy right now. This is going on for all 3 basses mentioned in this thread. I usually leave the clamped assemblies overnight so that the glued joints have really cured well. Plus I only have so many clamps so all this takes a little time!
http://www.watsonguitars.net/images/talkbass/019_4.jpg
PasdaBeer 08-15-2008, 06:12 AM man, i wanna check out your shop. I wish i had a 1/8the room you have : P
Watson Guitars 08-15-2008, 06:25 PM we were lucky with the shop. We bought a 2000 sq ft house with a full basement and 3-car garage. The entire footprint of the house is workshop, part of it being a main workshop where all the tools are (and all the dust) then a 25 x 25 ft clean room and a 15 x 15 ft laser room. Plus tons of storage. And I still need more space - what's up with that?
BenitoBassolini 08-15-2008, 08:26 PM we were lucky with the shop. We bought a 2000 sq ft house with a full basement and 3-car garage. The entire footprint of the house is workshop, part of it being a main workshop where all the tools are (and all the dust) then a 25 x 25 ft clean room and a 15 x 15 ft laser room. Plus tons of storage. And I still need more space - what's up with that?
The house didn't have a shop outback?
photoshopgeek 08-16-2008, 04:33 PM Hey Alex,
Love everything I've seen so far! Awesome work.
One question. Would you mind explaining why you use the method you do for your headstocks? I was always under the impression that cutting it out like that was inferior to using the scarf joint because the grain is no longer going strait against the tension.
Please don't take this as criticism. I honestly don't know. I am about to put together my first neck, and with the tools I have available to me, your method would be much easier for me. I just don't want to get it all together and have the headstock break on me five years down the road. Btw, I'm going to be using curly maple, purpleheart, and walnut laminates for my neck.
Thanks,
Ryan
Watson Guitars 08-17-2008, 07:06 PM I would agree that if the neck is a single piece of wood and the head is at an angle, there would be a weakness at the thinnest point. In a case like that, a scarfed joint for the neck is probably stronger and shock resistant. I can get away using continuous pieces of wood thanks to the multiple laminates which compliment each other strength-wise. If you use the right glues, you'll find that upon impact the wood grain usually fails long before any of the glued joints. I also carve out a support at the back of each neck where the head and neck meet (see photo) which further strengthens the assembly. hard to see in the photo - it's kind of a tapered lump behind the headstock where it would otherwise be at its thinnest point. Id have to say my necks are pretty strong in that area.
http://www.watsonguitars.net/images/talkbass/011_1.jpg
photoshopgeek 08-17-2008, 07:38 PM My plan is to have seven total laminates.
Maple-Walnut-Maple-Purpleheart-Maple-Walnut-Maple
So with those laminates and a good volute, you think it would be ok to use your method? It would make it alot easier for one, and I also like the idea of there not even being a hint of a joint. btw, I'm using titebond I. That's what I used for the body and I've had good luck with it in other projects.
Btw, that is a beautiful headstock.
Ryan
photoshopgeek 08-17-2008, 07:48 PM Wow, I just looked up the bass you used as an example. Love it!
This pic is my favorite! (Don't worry, I hosted it somewhere else.)
http://www.mediafire.com/imgbnc.php/3e887ebcfbd023e17e665c3f97ac6b8c2g.jpg (http://www.mediafire.com/imageview.php?quickkey=zhoku1ztvjo&thumb=5)
Watson Guitars 08-17-2008, 10:49 PM no problem PS Geek
Rudyboy98 08-19-2008, 12:34 AM This is looking sweeeettt!!!
Where in the world is a *drooling* icon when you need one??
:}
R...
Watson Guitars 08-22-2008, 12:11 AM Alrighty then - I have all three basses up to approximately the same point. They all have the 'core' laminates glued together - a tedious and time-consuming job but well worth the results in the end. These center core pieces are still rough but next up I will be putting them up on the CNC routers so that I can establishing some datum surfaces, cut the headstock angles, truss rod slots and carbon fiber slots in the next few days - stay tuned.
http://www.watsonguitars.net/images/talkbass/021_2.jpg
PasdaBeer 08-22-2008, 02:44 AM secks
Watson Guitars 08-27-2008, 12:05 AM More pics coming soon - I'm cutting slots for carbon fiber reinforcing rods and the truss rods....
Watson Guitars 08-29-2008, 02:07 AM All 3 basses are up on the CNCs right now getting machined down to size and having the truss rod slots and the slots for the Carbon Fiber rods cut. This photo shows the headless bolt-on bass.
http://www.watsonguitars.net/images/talkbass/020_5.jpg
PilbaraBass 08-29-2008, 03:26 AM Nice work, but Wishnevsky can make them a lot faster ;) :D
Seriously...very nice...
just curious...
but do you see a whole lot of difference on a lam neck like that between those with and without carbon rods???
I can understand a big benefit on a single-piece neck, but don't the lam necks offer a huge inherent stability already???
Watson Guitars 08-29-2008, 12:12 PM I only build about 12 a year right now...I use the carbon fiber mainly to battle regional changes in humidity. I build in a pretty dry environment and if I ship a guitar or bass to say, Florida, or South America, the increase in humidity affects the neck (as it will any neck made of wood). In my experience high humidity causes the necks (at least mine) to move a tiny bit backward as if you had tightened the truss rod 1/8 of a turn. Easily rectified by a single tiny truss rod adjustment in the opposing direction but I am convinced that without the added stability of the carbon fiber, this movement, albeit minor, would still be larger. My necks are just about as stable as any wooden neck could be and still be responsive to the truss rod. I'd be interested to hear what other builders experience with humidity extremes. Without the CF rods I think it would be much more extreme - but I started that way so have not built any necks without them!
I have spoken to bass players who took their high end basses (not mine) to other countries where the humidity was very high. They said their instruments were unplayable and had to be reset both there and back home. I'm sure results vary, but I figure the added stability is worth the extra work.
eleonn 08-29-2008, 12:41 PM I have spoken to bass players who took their high end basses (not mine) to other countries where the humidity was very high. They said their instruments were unplayable and had to be reset both there and back home. I'm sure results vary, but I figure the added stability is worth the extra work.
100% true. When my LTD came from US to Perú (where we breath water not air the whole year) I had to tweak every single piece of it... even the ones that are not supposed to move at all :D
Rudyboy98 08-29-2008, 08:06 PM Wow...I've never tweaked my own basses..too chicken to do it...I take my basses to a great guy that has a shop nearby. Costs an arm and a leg..but it's worth every bit of it.
:D
PilbaraBass 08-29-2008, 10:55 PM interesting...my carvin AC40 has a thin profile mahogany neck with 2 CF rods...it's quite unstable as I tweak it 2-4 times a year (depending much upon how much I use it and move it)...
fortunately the trussrod is very good and the tweak only takes 2 minutes to accomplish.
hoytbasses 08-31-2008, 07:09 AM outstanding work, Alex:
I did finally notice a tool in your arsenal that I DO own: a 6x48 sander with the 10" disc sander.:hmm:...... Man , Do I feel like a Neanderthal!
I did upgrade to a mill/drill machine in my school shop. with that I can make really accurate aluminum or polycarbonate router jigs and that addition has greatly added to the reproducability and accuracy of my builds.
For now, (and until the money truck brings me a delivery) . I can blast through the rough milling of a bass body (p/u routs, neck pocket, control cavity, body outline and initial radiusing ) in about 20 minutes: so , for a guy only building a few instruments per year (while supervising the 60 plus builds of my students) that's pretty efficient. I can glue up a stack of bodies, and then dedicate three routers and a morning to do all the grunt work.......
SOME DAY a CNC machine will do the grunt (and some of th efinesse) work while I drink coffee and play on the computer :help:
great job, Alex
karl
Watson Guitars 09-01-2008, 11:55 PM Many thanks Karl - I looked at your site - you have some great instruments (and my complete respect for your skills).
Just a quickie photo to keep the pot boiling - I'm gluing Carbon Fiber rods into the necks of all three basses involved in this thread. Damn near ran out of small clamps!!
http://www.watsonguitars.net/images/talkbass/gluing_CF.jpg
capnsandwich 09-02-2008, 02:38 AM Many thanks Karl - I looked at your site - you have some great instruments (and my complete respect for your skills).
Just a quickie photo to keep the pot boiling - I'm gluing Carbon Fiber rods into the necks of all three basses involved in this thread. Damn near ran out of small clamps!!
http://www.watsonguitars.net/images/talkbass/gluing_CF.jpg
Now that's a lot of clamps but looking good none the less.
Watson Guitars 09-14-2008, 10:54 PM Oh man - it's been so long since I posted I couldn't find my own thread. Sorry - been outa town and also got a nasty cold so I'm playing catchup now! The attached pic shows 5 string 33" scale neck thru bass 019 with its mahogany body halves attached. I'll post some more pics after this one to bring all 3 up to date.
http://www.watsonguitars.net/images/talkbass/019_9_lg.jpg
gkbass13 09-14-2008, 11:15 PM love the work man, keep it up!!!!
ive been drooling over the 5 string single cut on the luthiers access group webpage lately. awesome stuff!
Chebass88 09-19-2008, 07:33 AM Alex - I just visited your site, and very much appreciate both the quality of your work as well as the dedicated approach to innovation and beauty. I particularly enjoy the tapered neck stringers & the contrasting veneers. Thank you for all the great info in this thread and on your website.
Best,
Ian (Chebass88)
Watson Guitars 09-23-2008, 12:59 AM Small update - just glued the Koa top onto bass #109. I cut out the pickup pieces so that I can use them for pickup covers later on.
http://www.watsonguitars.net/images/08B019/019_11_lg.jpg
eleonn 09-23-2008, 08:21 AM Alex how did you cut the pieces of wood from the pickups cavities without ruin them?
RkdJehova 09-23-2008, 08:54 AM I'm guessing one of two ways. Either a smaller router bit, or he cut them a little large and used a steady hand paired with a jig.
T.O.Bass 09-23-2008, 10:16 AM I have two K2 CNC Machines. one is 39"x24", the other is 50"x50" which is the largest size that I could find and still get the accuracy of ballscrew positioning. I also have a laser engraver now which i hope will open up opportunities for fancy inlay stuff...
http://www.watsonguitars.net/images/talkbass/WG_CNCs.jpg
I keep expecting to see a Bootsy Collins Space Bass.
Watson Guitars 09-23-2008, 03:23 PM Yeah - I'm waiting for Bootsy to place an order! As far as cutting out the pickup blanks goes - I use a 1mm end mill which I use to cut about 1/4 inch deep. Then I flip the top over and use the original cuts on the other side to center on zero again, and I finihs cutting through from the back side. The top plus the veneers is around 3/8" thick.
Watson Guitars 10-05-2008, 02:24 AM OK time for some updates. Sorry it's been a few days (!) since I last posted. Firstly bass 021 is moving along nicely. In the photo below you can see that I sucessfully created and installed a Celtic Knot pattern on the top of the bass. This was quite a bit of work but it came out looking nice. I'll post closeups soon. The pickup covers were then harvested from the top material of the bass before the top was glued on to the body.
The fingerboard will be birdseye maple, although you can't see much detail in the wood from this photo. The black square is the hipshot type-A bridge.
http://www.watsonguitars.net/images/talkbass/021_3.jpg
Here's another shot of the same
http://www.watsonguitars.net/images/talkbass/021_4.jpg
Munjibunga 10-05-2008, 02:46 AM That Celtic knot inlay is simply insane.
Watson Guitars 10-05-2008, 02:54 AM Yep - the inlay was done with pieces .150" (just under 4mm) thick. There are 16 different pieces for every repeat of the pattern, well over 100 in total for the bass. I used 3 different woods, Shedua, Rosewood and Zebrawood.
Rudyboy98 10-05-2008, 02:58 AM Absolutely sick work!
My word! Now you HAVE to post more pics...!!!! Awesome detail on the Celtic knot, how'd you do that!?!?
R...
capnsandwich 10-05-2008, 06:11 AM OK time for some updates. Sorry it's been a few days (!) since I last posted. Firstly bass 021 is moving along nicely. In the photo below you can see that I sucessfully created and installed a Celtic Knot pattern on the top of the bass. This was quite a bit of work but it came out looking nice. I'll post closeups soon. The pickup covers were then harvested from the top material of the bass before the top was glued on to the body.
The fingerboard will be birdseye maple, although you can't see much detail in the wood from this photo. The black square is the hipshot type-A bridge.
http://www.watsonguitars.net/images/talkbass/021_3.jpg
Here's another shot of the same
http://www.watsonguitars.net/images/talkbass/021_4.jpg
I want that bass!!!
Dude, you're talented. That's some great looking wood and that inlay is probably one of the nicest I've ever seen.
Jeronimofesto 10-05-2008, 10:10 AM http://www.watsonguitars.net/images/talkbass/021_4.jpg
I love how subtle the inlay is. Amazing work.
I love how subtle the inlay is. Amazing work.
I do to!
Beautiful bass!
eleonn 10-05-2008, 10:52 AM http://www.watsonguitars.net/images/talkbass/021_3.jpg
http://www.watsonguitars.net/images/talkbass/021_4.jpg
I don't like that bass anymore... the brigde is placed in a wrong way. :spit:
Psychicpet 10-05-2008, 12:14 PM the Celtic knot inlay is incredible!!!
...and I still dig the bass even if the bridge is a south paw ;)
Watson Guitars 10-05-2008, 01:44 PM Good Eye Eleonn. You earn 15 Watson Guitar credits for spotting the dumb mistake!
Watson Guitars 10-05-2008, 01:57 PM Here's the back of the headless bass body (#020). I'm hoping to cut the control cavity and 18v battery cavity today so if I do I'll post more. The Cedar is a really nice combination of colors so I think it will finish well...
http://www.watsonguitars.net/images/talkbass/020_6.jpg
eleonn 10-05-2008, 02:20 PM Good Eye Eleonn. You earn 15 Watson Guitar credits for spotting the dumb mistake!
How many crefits are requiried to get one bass? :hyper:
jordan_frerichs 10-05-2008, 02:43 PM I would agree that if the neck is a single piece of wood and the head is at an angle, there would be a weakness at the thinnest point. In a case like that, a scarfed joint for the neck is probably stronger and shock resistant. I can get away using continuous pieces of wood thanks to the multiple laminates which compliment each other strength-wise. If you use the right glues, you'll find that upon impact the wood grain usually fails long before any of the glued joints. I also carve out a support at the back of each neck where the head and neck meet (see photo) which further strengthens the assembly. hard to see in the photo - it's kind of a tapered lump behind the headstock where it would otherwise be at its thinnest point. Id have to say my necks are pretty strong in that area.
http://www.watsonguitars.net/images/talkbass/011_1.jpg
i have to know the finishing method. that looks amazing. the flamed maple looks more like crystal.
alexei 10-05-2008, 04:27 PM simply awesome! susbcribed!!!
Watson Guitars 10-06-2008, 12:52 AM How many WG credits for a bass? - hmmmm, I think it's a bit like air miles.
The finish on all my basses is Polyester Resin.
eleonn 10-06-2008, 08:45 AM How many WG credits for a bass? - hmmmm, I think it's a bit like air miles.
That many :atoz:... man you have to keep placing those bridges in a wrong way on your pics so I can get my bass :p
Rudyboy98 10-06-2008, 04:30 PM ^+100000 on the above post from me. Does that also apply to spelling mistakes?
I'll start looking for typos!
R...
jordan_frerichs 10-06-2008, 05:40 PM How many WG credits for a bass? - hmmmm, I think it's a bit like air miles.
The finish on all my basses is Polyester Resin.
thanx. will look it up. i am doing a bass with a flamed maple top, that would look exelent with that. how does the finish compliment bloodwood? how does it feel on a neck? i prefere really slick, smmooth feels like satin, or tung
Watson Guitars 10-13-2008, 01:20 AM Here's the current state of the 33" scale 5-string Koa topped bass #019. I am in the process of cutting the fret slots in the fingerboard of this bass so I will have some more informative photos in the next couple of days. Updates on the other two basses coming also.
http://www.watsonguitars.net/images/08B019/019_11_lg.jpg
http://www.watsonguitars.net/images/08B019/019_13_lg.jpg
Worshiper 10-13-2008, 07:48 PM wow I REALLY like the koa bass..
PasdaBeer 10-14-2008, 03:15 AM that black and white ebony is amazing.
Enfield Jake 10-24-2008, 10:26 AM 2 week bump... Any new progress? Inquiring minds want to know...
Basschair 10-27-2008, 09:44 AM Hi Alex,
Sorry to close the thread, but the CUP explains that build threads can be created for single builds (one thread per bass build). If you'd like to continue each of these builds as their own thread, that'd be cool. I'll leave this one closed (rather than deleted) for archiving.
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