How do you handle turning pages while sight reading? Some of the songs we do at Church are 7 pages long, and require multiple forward & backward page flips. I usually just create a chord chart for the song, but I feel like I am cheating myself in learning to sightread. Any advice?

I personally like just using a second music stand. :p I know that's the easy way out of it, but really, it sucks having things more than 4 pages long, especially with back and forth action going on.

I will try to get three pages on a stand and try to minimize page flips. Sometimes if not enough time to flip pages I will grab second stand if room to fit it. As for turns you have to anticipate them and feel out a point you grab the page. If the chart was done by a good copist then they will lay things out to make turns easier. But page turns are just something you practice when rehearsing the tune.

I would say if you don't have to read any notes making your own chord chart isn't a bad idea. The the less distractions the more you can focus on the music. I would just say be sure to put measure numbers and rehearsal letters on your chord chart so in case they refer to them.

How do you handle turning pages while sight reading? Some of the songs we do at Church are 7 pages long, and require multiple forward & backward page flips. I usually just create a chord chart for the song, but I feel like I am cheating myself in learning to sightread. Any advice?

I try to minimize the number of pages I need to read from if I can. In some situations I can re-copy the bass part to make page turning easy which results in me turning the page because I've memorized 4 bars or the bar I'm on has a whole note, repeat part, etc. In situations where you don't have the luxury of re-copying then if you can get two stands or a wide stand do that and tape the pages together so that it's one continuous wide score.

Put your music in a binder with plastic sheets, you can turn them quickly and violently, and if you leave a page slightly askew you can turn it with your headstock.

Because I do sightread, it's not important to me - at all - to practice more sightreading. Indeed, it's the opposite - I need to get to where the song is entirely in my head, and the steps to that involve just writing out the bars (without their repetitions) with codas and notations so that I can get bunches of pages on one or two pages.

The plastic binder method is what I use when I have to sightread - like you have to do in church - and you need to sometimes turn just before or just after where it actually goes off the page. When I used to perform in a jazz band, we photocopied, reduced slightly and taped, religiously, to get things to fit on four pages across a stand. Seeing it all there gives one much more confidence, that's for sure. The photocopy/taping method is great because it eliminates the confusion of back and forthness.

You could get an assistant and have them turn the pages while they learn music. Some kid should love that job. :)

A decent and somewhat affordable cheat that I've found is to go to a local used computer store (I went to the goodwill computer store) and get the cheapest laptop you can find. Mine ran me about $50 and it's just a beat up old Pentium II, but I got a spare battery on eBay for like $12 and I scan all my sheet music into PDF form, that way I can just throw the laptop up during a gig, and go to the next or previous page with a single keystroke. It's nice also because I can store a lot more music than I could if I were carrying sheets. I'm still trying to figure out a way to have some sort of foot controller to work for it.

when I have to read piano/vocal/chordcharts that are 5 bars a page when accompanying choirs and what not I will often just boost my volume and play with just my left hand. I get a good enough tone for sight reading purposes and I keep up with the well rehearsed group and get the job done. It's not ideal but by the 3rd time through I remember when the styles and main parts of the song are. It's also taught me to analyz parts of a song (AABA etc.) on the fly so the next time through I can get more and more detailed with at least memorizing how it goes if not specific parts

Put your music in a binder with plastic sheets, you can turn them quickly

Works for me too.

How do you handle turning pages while sight reading? Some of the songs we do at Church are 7 pages long, and require multiple forward & backward page flips. I usually just create a chord chart for the song, but I feel like I am cheating myself in learning to sightread. Any advice?

Can you give us an idea of what you're playing? Does the bass line need to be followed note-for-note? Are these pop tunes or carefully crafted arrangements?

I would avoid a 7 page score for one song. There has to be a lot of repetition in there. I'm sure you could boil it down with repeat signs.

When I have to do a page turn; if needed, I will try to keep the left hand going while the right hand turn the page in a flash. I hammer on with my left hand to keep the notes going. That might sound bad in some contexts (and if you can't control it). I play a P-Bass with flats on it so I don't sound clanky when doing such a thing (which is rarely anyhow).

I hope this helps. Let us know a little more about the tunes you're playing.

Joe

I wish I could read music so I could have the same problem and answers. I just happen to memorize all the songs as I hear them. It's kind of frustrating, though, when I show up to a job and someone hands me a chart.... BTW, love that laptop idea!

Can you give us an idea of what you're playing? Does the bass line need to be followed note-for-note? Are these pop tunes or carefully crafted arrangements?

I would avoid a 7 page score for one song. There has to be a lot of repetition in there. I'm sure you could boil it down with repeat signs.

Joe

The songs are modern Praise & Worship songs from all the popular publishers like Word, and Hillsong. I don't have to, and usually don't play the bass line as it is written for sake of not repeating what the pianist is already playing. I do need to keep up with the notes, and the chords are usually written above the lines so that helps, but I still need to follow along with the rhythm which requires all the page flips following the repeats, D.S.', CODA's, etc. Here is an example of what we play off of.

The songs are modern Praise & Worship songs from all the popular publishers like Word, and Hillsong. I don't have to, and usually don't play the bass line as it is written for sake of not repeating what the pianist is already playing. I do need to keep up with the notes, and the chords are usually written above the lines so that helps, but I still need to follow along with the rhythm which requires all the page flips following the repeats, D.S.', CODA's, etc. Here is an example of what we play off of.

That's just an example of a lazy bandleader forcing a bassist to read off a piano arrangement. I guess if its church it might be more informal, and you could definitely give the leader a bit of leeway, but in a more professional situation, I would refuse to deal with that sort of stuff. You're being forced to work harder because a bandleader didn't want to write out a proper bass chart.

Based on the sample you shared, I'd say writing out your own chord charts is just fine. Get it all on one page.

That's just an example of a lazy bandleader forcing a bassist to read off a piano arrangement. I guess if its church it might be more informal, and you could definitely give the leader a bit of leeway, but in a more professional situation, I would refuse to deal with that sort of stuff. You're being forced to work harder because a bandleader didn't want to write out a proper bass chart.

It definitely is informal, and the congregation is small. The new worship leader took over when the last one left. The new guy is just there to lead the songs. He really doesn't have any experience in arranging. All this is fine with me. I'm there to serve. I am interested in becoming a better player in all areas, and this is one that I need a little help in.

Read those chords!

The songs are modern Praise & Worship songs from all the popular publishers like Word, and Hillsong. I don't have to, and usually don't play the bass line as it is written for sake of not repeating what the pianist is already playing. I do need to keep up with the notes, and the chords are usually written above the lines so that helps, but I still need to follow along with the rhythm which requires all the page flips following the repeats, D.S.', CODA's, etc. Here is an example of what we play off of.


I would hit the copy machine. Next I would get a pair of scissors and some clear tape.

The result would be some good, easy to use, lead sheets.

LOL I have that exact song written out as a bass chart for myself... heck with that piano only version. And yes, that specific song is repetitive.

To answer your question, I just make charts for myself. Sometimes the rhythm guitarist wants a copy as well as the drummer. I do my best to get them on one sheet, and use the 'repeat chorus two times' type stuff to eliminate dead weight. If the verse is the exact same arrangment, sometimes I'll just put "second verse, same as first" and so on.

That way I can focus on my supporting role for the band and not lose my place on page three of a seven page series of piano sheet music. It is distracting when the bass drops out or plays the wrong note when I turn a page :-D

The binder/sheet protector idea is great, but for long charts - and those with repeats, D.S. symbols, etc - it has its own weaknesses. On the longer ones I try to manage the folds so there's as minimal movement as possible. But, sometimes, like when you're handed a real Dagwood of a chart on the gig, you just go with it. I always try to scan for navigation, and quickly memorize the last bar/first bar of any necessary page turns.

LOL I have that exact song written out as a bass chart for myself... heck with that piano only version. And yes, that specific song is repetitive. :-D

Can you post an example of the bass chart that you use?

2 music stands and scotch tape. Or write out your own condensed chart.

Can you post an example of the bass chart that you use?

There are free notation programs available, if I were you I would get a hold of one of them and copy the bass part only. You'll pick up some valuable skills for creating charts and you'll make your job a little easier on the gig.

That's just an example of a lazy bandleader forcing a bassist to read off a piano arrangement. I guess if its church it might be more informal, and you could definitely give the leader a bit of leeway, but in a more professional situation, I would refuse to deal with that sort of stuff. You're being forced to work harder because a bandleader didn't want to write out a proper bass chart.

Wow, this is such a broad statement and way off base! Why would the band leader need to re-write a bass-specific chart if the one he's got has chord changes, and the piano part will imply all the important rhythms? Especially when you take into account how few praise and worship leaders can do this at all, not to menion writing a "good" bass part.

Also senor OP, I don't think you said you were instructed to play the bass-clef notes as written, but I deinitely wouldn't. In the example you posted, it's clearly not a bass part.

I would second the "left-hand-tap" method mentioned by several others, as well as looking for places where you can grab open strings with the right hand to turn the page with the left.

I've done a ton of theater and church gigs with heavy reading, and the page-turn is something my hands and eyes learned to do after a while. It's sometimes really impressive to watch myself get through the tune. If you stick with it, I'm sure you'll get it down pretty quickly. I personally love reading long complicated tunes, because it's like solving a puzzle in time-trying to hit the right notes and hits, and nailing the style, while still pushing passion and energy through the part. I would much rather flip seven pages than re-write something.

You can do what you feel comfortable doing, but I wouldn't read the left hand of the piano. I bet you that it's not even close to what the bass player is doing in the recording.

This has worked for me:

Get the lyric sheet with the chords (this is usually 1 or 2 pages). The leader hands these out at our practice session.

Listen to the tune and write the rhythm above or next to the chord. If the chord lasts for 2 beats, write a half-note. If it lasts for 4 beats, write a whole note. Sometimes you'll find a rhythm that is a dotted quarter-note followed by an eighth-note tied to a half-note. Occasionally, you'll find a dotted half-note followed by a quarter note. If you know how long each chord lasts, you should be able to play a very basic line.

Next, listen to the tune again for the style. Is the bass player keeping is simple and playing one or two notes in each measure? Or, it the bass player pumping eighth-notes on the root? Is the bassist playing a nice rhythmic funky groove? Usually, it's one of those: Simple, driving 8's, or groove. You write that next to the section of the lyrics.

Usually there will be choruses that are "up" and "down" so you can build the energy. Just make those notations in the margin. The leader should tell the group when to do this. If not, listen and adjust accordingly.

I play a lot of worship songs that I don't know. I get a handful of new ones each week. I follow this process and I'm good. Everyone is different. I don't have a lot of time to prepare because I play in two other bands.

The only time I dig deeper is when there's a bass part that defines the song or a fill that everyone expects to hear. Then, I transcribe it note for note. If it's long and complex, I'll notate it. If it's short, I'll write out the rhythm and the pitch names in the margin and draw an arrow to the part in the lyrics where it should be played.

Lots of info here, but I hope it helps. Let me know if you want any further clarification.

Peace and Music,
Joe

Here is an example of what I usually do on the multiple page songs.

Here is an example of what I usually do on the multiple page songs.

I just listened to some samples of that tune on iTunes. That sounds like a really simple song with a lot of sustained bass notes. Some of the rhythms in the chorus were like I mentioned: dotted quarter-note followed by an eighth-note tied to a half-note. Lots of root notes.

I wouldn't transcribe any of the bass parts in that song. Provide a nice solid foundation and keep it simple.

Joe

I just listened to some samples of that tune on iTunes. That sounds like a really simple song with a lot of sustained bass notes. Some of the rhythms in the chorus were like I mentioned: dotted quarter-note followed by an eighth-note tied to a half-note. Lots of root notes.

I wouldn't transcribe any of the bass parts in that song. Provide a nice solid foundation and keep it simple.

Joe

I usually never transcribe any of the bass notes. I play off the root, and lock in with the drummer adding an occasional fill or something.

I usually never transcribe any of the bass notes. I play off the root, and lock in with the drummer adding an occasional fill or something.

Cool. I thought I was answering your question. I'm confused... That's nothing new. :p I lost track of your original post. Sorry about that.

I don't think you're cheating yourself out of sight-reading. The type of church gig you have isn't really a sight-reading gig. You can do reading on your own.

At your church, do they ever hand out copies from the hymnal? You know, they want to mix it up and throw in some traditional music. That's a great opportunity to sight read. You can read the bass part, noodle around with the tenor part (still bass clef), and you can even throw a little melody in there on one of the verses (treble clef reading). When I'm standing around waiting for things to get rolling, I try to play the bass and tenor parts at the same time. That's always a nice little challenge.

Peace,
Joe

Hi

A piece of plywood/hardboard/masonite as long as about four pages will sit on any music stand and is easy to carry in the car. Otherwise, you can usually play enough with the left hand while you turn pages with the right.

However if the Musical director expects you to play off scores instead of giving you proper parts, he shouldn't be surprised if you have to stop playing to turn pages.

Pete

Cool. I thought I was answering your question. I'm confused... That's nothing new. :p I lost track of your original post. Sorry about that.

I don't think you're cheating yourself out of sight-reading. The type of church gig you have isn't really a sight-reading gig. You can do reading on your own.

At your church, do they ever hand out copies from the hymnal? You know, they want to mix it up and throw in some traditional music. That's a great opportunity to sight read. You can read the bass part, noodle around with the tenor part (still bass clef), and you can even throw a little melody in there on one of the verses (treble clef reading). When I'm standing around waiting for things to get rolling, I try to play the bass and tenor parts at the same time. That's always a nice little challenge.

Peace,
Joe

We do 2-3 hymns per week which gives me some sightreading practice. I'll probably continue doing what I have been doing in the past. It makes it easier for me to concentrate on the quality of my playing instead of stressing out when I know a page turn is coming. Besides, the census I'm seeing is that what I get from the musical diretor isn't really what the bass guitar should be playing, and I definitely don't want to be playing what the pianist is already playing anyway. Thanks.