I have a blues gig coming up.... I have never played the blues... [Archive]

powderfinger

03-03-2009, 04:45 PM

Andrew Jones

03-03-2009, 04:59 PM

Did you disclose this to your friend? Your lack of experience playing blues?.

How much time to prepare?

The main areas a inexperienced blues guy will show his thing is.

1) there are terms for styles and grooves so if they "talk" up the song in these terms instead of calling a tune that will be played like the recording........

2) the Last 2 bars is the most neglected part of a green players vocab. There are a number of basic harmonic cliche's that happen there
you need to know them!

3) Slow Blues! this will show a lack of expierince also see #2!

Aj

dmusic148

03-03-2009, 05:11 PM

To the OP: don't think too much about walking lines. Walking constantly is bad. Play the root a lot, pedal it when guitar drama happens-it helps bring up the energy when done at the right times.
Listen very carefully to the changes, especially the last two bars as stated by Andrew, because a lot of tunes have particular chord choices at the end which must be played. If there's a keyboard player get the changes from him. Listen, listen, listen.
Fat tone is important.
And whatever you do, don't rush the feel, it kills it. Lay back.
Have fun.

Matt Dean

03-03-2009, 05:25 PM

I'd buy a variety of blues records and play along as much as you can... practice! Good blues bass is not simple... and only boring if you're playing boring bass lines. The real important thing is that the bass has to make it swing... and you know the saying. Good luck!

jumbosilverette

03-03-2009, 05:41 PM

subscribed

Kenny Allyn

03-03-2009, 06:06 PM

To the OP, it's all a feel thing if you can play that alt country thing you are way ahead of the game, lay back behind the beat and groove, then every so often nail a hard ONE just to let them know your there.

;) ... Seriously get them to tell you what kinda stuff they play and listen to a few records, you should be fine

butchblack

03-03-2009, 06:07 PM

There are a few common rhythms that comprise a large part of blues. Flat tire (tha thump, tha thump), march, swing, boogie-woogie. If you have a sense of them and are comfortable with progressions you'll be ok. Listen to the drums to get the beat and the rest of the band to get the feel. Don't over play. Simple strong lines work much better then a lot of noodling.

Most important

Have Fun

Eric Perry

03-03-2009, 06:08 PM

I-IV-V

/thread :ninja:

Phalex

03-03-2009, 06:16 PM

Don't over play. Simple strong lines work much better then a lot of noodling.

Most important

Have Fun

+1!!!

Lay back and stay behind the beat. Play each note like you own it.

And most important, lock in with the drummer, and give the guitar, and harp players a platform big enough to perform Hamlet on.

It's not about looking good, it's all about making the soloists look good.

Toronto Bassist

03-03-2009, 07:12 PM

If you have a decent amount of time to prepare, you might want to learn as many blues "standards" as you can...hideaway, crosscut saw, born under a bad sign, key to the highway, hoochie coochie man, the thrill is gone, etc.

BigOldHarry

03-03-2009, 07:19 PM

It all depends on the type of blues... I'd at least find out if it is the VERY straight, slower blues that some folks (myself included) find painfully dull... or is it more uptempo swamp blues, jump blues, hot blues - etc - - That stuff *can* give you a workout if the band is rockin' - -

no matter what type of blues, be ready to turn your tone back - ringing bass just doesn't fit into this type of music. And sync up tight with the drummer, listen for his kick drum - that will help you out.

powderfinger

03-03-2009, 08:43 PM

tom e smith

03-03-2009, 11:24 PM

The trick to playing the blues well is to break up with your girlfriend right before you go on.

5StringBlues

03-03-2009, 11:51 PM

You must have never seen Albert Collins live before.

Bluejay

03-04-2009, 12:26 AM

Stumbo

03-04-2009, 01:08 AM

Does your friend have some recordings of his band? A set list? In addition, maybe he can loan you some of his blues recordings or learning material?

Here's some TB links that may help you out:

http://www.talkbass.com/forum/showthread.php?t=517439 First blues "open mic." jam 1 of 3
http://www.talkbass.com/forum/showthread.php?t=469825 2 of 3
http://www.talkbass.com/forum/showthread.php?t=517730 3 of 3

A good CD to give a listen to is the Allman Brothers Band "Live at the Fillmore East"

http://www.talkbass.com/forum/showthread.php?t=506931 Slow blues
http://www.talkbass.com/forum/showthread.php?t=522409 Influential blues musicians (mostly) pre-1959
http://www.music.vt.edu/musicdictionary/appendix/blues/Bluesprogression.html Blues Progressions explained with samples

http://www.amazon.com/Blues-Bass-Jon-Liebman/dp/0793586682 "Blues Bass" by TB member Jonster (John Liebman)
http://www.talkbass.com/forum/showthread.php?t=502819 Blues books
http://www.amazon.com/Razor-Sharp-Blues-Guitar-Turnarounds-Music/dp/B000PHU7J2 "101 Razor-Sharp Blues Turnarounds by Larry McCabe
http://www.amazon.com/Complete-Rhythm-Guitar-Guide-Blues/dp/1574241389/ref=pd_sim_b_1 "Complete Rhythm Guitar Guide for Blues Bands" by Larry McCabe
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blues History

doktorfeelgood

03-04-2009, 01:23 AM

I was asked today to sit in on bass with a local, established blues band for an upcoming blues festival. Their bassist is going to be out of town, and they are booked ahead of time, and I am friends with a member of the band, so he asked me.

Ive never played with a blues band. Ive played in some bands that did rockabilly, country, and rock. My area of experise is playing "country rock", which I consider Gram Parsons, The Byrds, and lots of stuff like that. I do lots of walking bass, but never the blues...

I am familiar with the I IV V and will have no trouble with progressions. I am just thinking my walking lines will be too boring and predictable. Any of you guys got any advice or tips?

Get your friend in the band to give you a copy of their songs on a cd and work on them religiously 'till the show. That way you'll have a little head-start. But like some of the other posters have mentioned, listen to the drummer and rhythm guitar player and DO NOT rush the beat. You'll have some fun and then want to be in the band full-time...lol
Best Of Luck and keep us posted as to how the show went.
Peace )-(:cool:

jimc

03-04-2009, 02:35 AM

If you find playing the blues is boring then the way that you're playing it is boring.

I'll take one well placed note over a hundred out of pocket widdles any day of the week.

bigfatbass

03-04-2009, 03:21 AM

Your run of the mill ANY kind of band is boring. How does that matter to the OP? Your post was an obvious troll, and far more out of line than anything you'll receive in return.

In exactly what way was your blatant troll post NOT insulting?

Dude, you list a power strip in your previously owned gear. IF all you have to back up your argument is "I think blues is boring" then you have nothing constructive to offer this thread. Why did you post in the first place, if not mere trolling in order to receive the reaction you are currently receiving?

This all will most likely cost me an infraction, and maybe even a vacation, but I'll accept it with no regrets. I'm tired of people with no knowledge, and even less respect/tact piping up where the only purpose of their "input" is to be a contrary dooshbag.

You asked for exactly what you got.:spit::scowl:

Jefenator

03-04-2009, 03:49 AM

Got time to get your heart broken before the festival? That would help. (For real... but maybe not worth it if you're just subbing.) :D

I got plenty of respect for the genre. I've been freelancing for 10 years and I just got my butt kicked big-time on a blues recording project. Some people may not be able to discern which tracks got laid down by local boy and which were done by a big name in LA. But I sure as heck can. :rolleyes:

AFAIC there's 3 major factors involved: feel, feel and feel.

Fergie Fulton

03-04-2009, 03:55 AM

My personal experience is that your run of the mill blues bands are boring. YMMV. No need for insults. No trolling here. You are way out of line.

From your seond post i see this is no "misunderstanding" you are indeed trolling.
I would say that your original comment of "from your experience" sums up your attitude and understanding of blues. Many believe blues is one of the most basic concepts in music because it is about feeling not ability. So i would say if you cannot understand a basic concept you must be as stupid and ignorant as you sound.
I too will take whatever comes to me as i'll back bigfatbass to the wall on this one.

As to the OP i think you will find you do have the skills to handle the blues if your previous experience is to be considered. Remember to listen and be aware of whats going on around you and you will learn that a lot of what you know aready is based in the blues, you may just not have realised it.

jonster

03-04-2009, 10:54 AM

Stumbo,

Thanks again for recommending my Blues Bass book. I hope I can be of help.

Jon Liebman
www.JonLiebman.com

cowsgomoo

03-04-2009, 11:27 AM

I was asked today to sit in on bass with a local, established blues band for an upcoming blues festival. Their bassist is going to be out of town, and they are booked ahead of time, and I am friends with a member of the band, so he asked me.

Ive never played with a blues band. Ive played in some bands that did rockabilly, country, and rock. My area of experise is playing "country rock", which I consider Gram Parsons, The Byrds, and lots of stuff like that. I do lots of walking bass, but never the blues...

I am familiar with the I IV V and will have no trouble with progressions. I am just thinking my walking lines will be too boring and predictable. Any of you guys got any advice or tips?

my advice would be to remember your role, and play with that in mind... no-one will mind if your lines are predictable - this is a style of music with a lot of tradition in it - no-one expects you to be an innovator - they want to hear traditional bass playing... just support the singer and support the soloists with taste and understatement

I don't necessarily subscribe to the 'less is more' philosophy.. sometimes MORE is more, but in this case I'd be looking to sit solid, tight, unobtrusive and yep, maybe a bit predictable

oh, and I wouldn't spend much time thinking about what to play... what the other guys in the band are doing will dictate that... enhance what they do

Les Izmor

03-04-2009, 11:43 AM

You can probably go on YouTube and find many of the songs the band will play. Spend an hour with the blues. You'll get it!
Here, Dig a little on Albert King...'Blues Power',
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h5dpp2iCRwM
Then there's always Albert Collins...'Frosty'
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VqqgqrbFdwM
How about the ever popular Stevie Ray Vaughan...'Texas Flood'
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YDBIbJKjAZQ
How about a little B.B. King...'The Thrill Is Gone'.
Now That's the BLUES!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xtUNoPx3EPQ&feature=related
Blues Brothers - 'Sweet Home Chicago'.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GmiFZH98_Lw
Muddy Waters - 'Hoochie Coochie Man' (1970),
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uO4A6xx65WU&feature=related
One More...Otis Rush, Eric Clapton & Luther Allison - 'Everyday I Have The Blues',
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qXzFPcpzB2Y
'Bad Love'----Luther Allison
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I31Ffcj9VlY&feature=related
Luther Allison, 'Livin' In The House Of The Blues',
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LWqPbYTE154&feature=related
You'll see by these examples, if you're good, you can play however you want; but, you got to groove!
The Blues......Dig it!!!

Dang, that first vid of Albert King doing Blues Power is pure blues, great link Bluejay!

Les Izmor

03-04-2009, 11:45 AM

bluewine

03-04-2009, 11:48 AM

[QUOTE=Bluejay;7066902]You can probably go on YouTube and find many of the songs the band will play. Spend an hour with the blues. You'll get it!

Thats the way to do it, YouTube.
blue

jnewmark

03-04-2009, 11:56 AM

I-IV-V

/thread :ninja:

Oh if it were only that simple. Probably the hardest progression to play all night long and still keep the bottom interesting for all the other players to feed off. I once asked Fuzz Jones ( Muddy Waters long time bassist ), what the secret was , and he said, " Stick out, but fit in. "

basswave

03-04-2009, 12:00 PM

You can probably go on YouTube and find many of the songs the band will play. Spend an hour with the blues. You'll get it!
Here, Dig a little on Albert King...'Blues Power',
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h5dpp2iCRwM
Then there's always Albert Collins...'Frosty'
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VqqgqrbFdwM
How about the ever popular Stevie Ray Vaughan...'Texas Flood'
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YDBIbJKjAZQ
How about a little B.B. King...'The Thrill Is Gone'.
Now That's the BLUES!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xtUNoPx3EPQ&feature=related
Blues Brothers - 'Sweet Home Chicago'.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GmiFZH98_Lw
Muddy Waters - 'Hoochie Coochie Man' (1970),
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uO4A6xx65WU&feature=related
One More...Otis Rush, Eric Clapton & Luther Allison - 'Everyday I Have The Blues',
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qXzFPcpzB2Y
'Bad Love'----Luther Allison
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I31Ffcj9VlY&feature=related
Luther Allison, 'Livin' In The House Of The Blues',
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LWqPbYTE154&feature=related
You'll see by these examples, if you're good, you can play however you want; but, you got to groove!
The Blues......Dig it!!!

Holy Blue Tube :eek::eek::eek:

Thats some serious blues going on...

I have to admit...I could never ever stand playing blues so some other 6 string guy could mentally masturbate.

I do dig what SVR does and how double trouble kind of rolls around what He is going...

Good example of it in a more funkier cover of Superstition.
Stevie Ray Vaughan - Superstition
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xX-GJ46kiCo&feature=related

If they want you and it depends on how much room they are giving you the groove the F out here like Tommy does and haved fun.

EBodious

03-04-2009, 12:05 PM

i think that blues bass can be a huge complex undertaking filled with nuance and style; it is as big as you make it.

however, if you are subbing (real soon) for one gig, then i think you need to put all thoughts of "boring" out of your mind. i think the best strategy would be to keep it real simple, and lock in the groove. you will impress the hell out of the band if you can come in off the street with just rock solid groove. there are a a few common lines that will get you thru most of the gig. don't worry about over using them. you are a sub, keep it tite and simple (even if you are often just hitting the root).

i agree that one of the keys is to focus on the turn-arounds. i joined a blues band 2 years ago, the first challenges were keeping straight the beginnings, ends, and turn-arounds.

also, do you have a bass with flats? keep it warm and fat up there!

Jefenator

03-04-2009, 12:28 PM

IME I-IV-V is as tough as anything to do well. :p And that's just the tip of the iceberg of what you'll find under the greater "Blues" umbrella.

I recently did an Early Blues revue that really opened my eyes. Checked out some Ma Rainey, Bessie Smith, Ethel Waters, Alberta Hunter + others. I'm not sure we did one single straight-ahead I-IV-V tune. They sure did some ornate arrangements & progressions in the '30s - we would have probably done more justice trying to cover Return To Forever. :p

Eric Perry

03-04-2009, 01:08 PM

Oh if it were only that simple. Probably the hardest progression to play all night long and still keep the bottom interesting for all the other players to feed off. I once asked Fuzz Jones ( Muddy Waters long time bassist ), what the secret was , and he said, " Stick out, but fit in. "That was just tongue-in-cheek, hence forth the :ninja:

EBodious

03-04-2009, 01:14 PM

oh, and another great resource:

go to your local library and check out albert king's cd, born under a bad sign

duck dunn will show you how to keep it simple and full of feel.

crayzee

03-04-2009, 01:44 PM

While I've never done more than play the blues just for kicks, might be worthwhile to listen to some good ol' John Lee Hooker. Some great tunes done by a late great.

Phalex

03-04-2009, 02:22 PM

While I've never done more than play the blues just for kicks, might be worthwhile to listen to some good ol' John Lee Hooker. Some great tunes done by a late great.

John Lee Hooker could play a tune consisting of no other key than E for four minutes and still keep it interesting. That, my friends is a master of the Blues!

Blueszilla

03-04-2009, 02:56 PM

I agree with most of what's been put forth here. As a blues bassist for the majority of my gigging life, I would emphasize what has been lightly mentioned, playing the blues well is not nearly as easy as it might appear. Yes, progressions aren't typically that tough, and it's not a speedfest (not all the time), but nailing a slow rhythm oriented line, can make the difference in what your audience hears and feels. Playing a shuffle with a ton of feel is a lifelong quest, don't be fooled into thinking it can be done by everyone. You have to listen to the other players with more then your ears, if that makes sense, you gotta feel them, you have to merge with them into one. Often it's about what you don't play, than what you do. More so than just about any other genre, note placement, duration, and quality take on a huge importance. along with your drummer, you are creating a foundation for the soloist to be truly inspired. How hard is replaced by how well. The better you are at creating that velvet background, the better, IME, a soloist will be able to reach those places beyond what they've done before. When it's done right, it's almost a religious experience, goosebumps and all. My own personal goal is trying to recreate that vibe every time. It can be better than any drug, woman, or earthly pleasure you can imagine. Getting there transcends any chops, gear, or training you may have, and I can't get enough of it. You may experience that in any kind of music, I suppose, but blues is where it's at for me, and, I suspect, for many.

If someone finds the process 'boring', I feel sorry for them, because in my opinion, they have missed the point entirely. From a bass playing perspective, I give it up TOTALLY, and because I do, I get it back in spades.

YMMV.

Pacman

03-04-2009, 03:01 PM

Guys - if there's a blatant troll post, and it disappears, the reason is a Mod probably tossed it out. Did you notice all the quotes left that out too?

Don't feed the trolls - just report the posts.

EBodious

03-04-2009, 03:57 PM

doktorfeelgood

03-04-2009, 10:25 PM

jonster

03-05-2009, 10:25 AM

Thanks for the recommending my Blues Bass book. There's now a better (i.e., cheaper!) place than amazon.

Jon Liebman
www.JonLiebman.com

jnewmark

03-05-2009, 06:09 PM

jnewmark

03-05-2009, 06:11 PM

oh, and another great resource:

go to your local library and check out albert king's cd, born under a bad sign

duck dunn will show you how to keep it simple and full of feel.

And while you're at it, you will discover where SRV got his groove.

dexter71

03-05-2009, 07:55 PM

To whoever asked if the guy who asked me to do the gig knew about my inexperience, yes he did. I told him. Plus, he plays in another band with me.... so...

Im going to rehearse with them a few times, so Im not worried about the progressions... anything I dont get by ear, Ill ask the others in the band... no biggie.

I guess my concern was the "style" itself.... I reckon Im better off listening to some of the suggested tracks posted above.

I can tell you the style of blues these guys do is similiar to stuff like Delbert McClinton... if that helps... I guess I can always listen to some Delbert. And I guess it doesnt hurt their former bassist is their current rythm guitarist!!

Well.. as a suggestion.. you could check out these guys:
- John Mayall (specially the albums Jazz Blues Fusion and Blue For You),
- Derek and the Dominos,
- Stevie Ray Vaughan and Double Trouble,
- Canned Heat,
- Cream,
- Howlin' Wolf,
- everything from Jack Bruce (he is a great bass player to have as a reference when playing blues),
- Jimi Hendrix,
- Blind Faith,
- Keb Mo,

well.. the list goes on.. but you got the picture..

Just groove with it and you will be fine. Feel the music and put up a good vibe, it can't go wrong :)

Good luck out there man! :bassist:

Cheers

EBodious

03-05-2009, 10:31 PM

Mesa

03-06-2009, 12:27 PM

You could spend a very long time (read:forever) listening to blues and garnering ideas from the many great players. I suggest anyone who's serious about the blues do so.

In the short term, and in the interest of preparing yourself, there's a great book in the Mel Bay series produced by the School of the Blues and authored by Frank De Rose and David Barrett

http://www.amazon.com/Mel-Bay-Blues-Bass-Method/dp/0786675314

This is a great introduction to the many patterns you'll find in blues music. Armed with this instruction, if someone calls for a particular pattern ("ascending box, Muddy Shuffle, tramp, etc, etc), you'll know what they mean.

The additional book of full play-along trax is also great for practice.

As was mentioned before, if you've played country/roots/rock music, you know enough already to get started. The rest you'll pick up by feel and listening.

I always joke to myself that a great source for bluesy fills is "Albert's Shuffle" on the Bloomfield Super Sessions album. My rule is learn all of the fills that Harvey Brooks uses in this song, and then, when you play out, use no more than one fill once per song. This will keep you from overplaying, and you'll really have to listen for the right spot to add the fill. Keep in mind that many times, that right spot may not come. Just keep your ears open and the foundation strong.
Anyway, I usually get compliments for being solid (a very high compliment for me), and keeping it simple is really a great mantra for the blues.

Fergie Fulton

03-06-2009, 02:32 PM

If your looking for an album to listen to search for "Willie Dixons Blues Dixonary" it is a 5 album box set of the great mans work, and a must for anyone looking for ideas or inspiration about blues bass playing.

doktorfeelgood

03-07-2009, 09:09 PM

yeah, i was also gonna mention john mayall. the "beano" album and "a hard road" are both filled with john mcvie blues excellence.

my band used to do "take it easy" by delbert mcclinton. i really dug it. very country-ish. but, it didn't last long term.

hope you aren't getting too overwhelmed with references!

I kind of cut my teeth on John Mayal's
Bluesbreaker's "Crusade" album with John McVie on bass and Mick Taylor on guitar. I bough it new in 1968 and to this day it's still one of my favorite Blues recordings. The groove on "The Death Of JB Lenoir" is to die for especially when that baritone sax solo cuts in. I'd highly recommend this recording as a place one could get started on modern electric Blues bass playing. )-(

EBodious

03-08-2009, 10:06 PM

i actually don't know that one; i will check it out.

dare i say it, but i sometimes think beano is clapton's best recorded work. and then, i like peter green's stuff on hard road even more than clapton!

so much sacrelidge for one post...

:hiding:

collicsws6z28

03-10-2009, 08:32 PM

Tommy Shannon, Tommy Shannon, Tommy Shannon

WillieJ

03-11-2009, 09:56 AM

What a batch o'great posts. I've been playing 100% blues for better than a year now, and there is just great stuff shared here.

To OP - with all the replies you have, not sure you need more, but from a guy who came to the blues w/years of experience -- but was not dedicated to the genre -- some insights I gleaned stumbling thru my first couple of open mics/jams/rehearsals:

#1 -"Blues" is broad like "jazz." Dixieland compared to fusion is kind of like Chicago-style is to Stevie Ray. So, as folks mentioned, having the songlist and style of the band is primo in terms of focusing your prep time.

#2 - Walkin is great! Similar to what I heard you say, I love to walk. Listen to five BB King CDs, and you'd think you can walk the blues all night. But ... no. Often patterns are best. (see #1). But you must be able to walk to cover a good deal of blues ground. Guys who aren't comfy w/walking are at a big disadvantage. Note--You will need to adapt your walking to the gait of the shuffle rhythm. Careful listening to a few of the originals the band does will help there.

#3 Get specific on song requirements. Lots of songs (when you get a feel for the genre), you can hear "medium shuffle in E," and you're pretty much good to go... get the first beats and walk it, or invent an appropriate pattern to repeat. But someone has to tell you "Thrill is gone" doesn't end with V-VI, but sharp-V - V. Or that Stormy Monday plays games with the III chord, II and flat-V (man that was an embarrassing one first time for me). And quite a few tunes do have specific bass riffs folks expect to hear. You just need to get that - and sounds like your buds will supply.

#4 (ultimately, this is #1) It is all about the pocket. And the 'true blue' feel. Others have said this, too. At first, blues bass sounds so simple: in the background, not much flash, repetitive. But its subtle. Its about foundation. And its like Haiku or a sonnet - simple form, but worthy of a lifetime of exploring.

*** Best news - blues bass is in fact easy to get started in, and only gets harder the more you decide to really do it, and you set your bar ever-higher. For a stand-in gig - take it easy on the pressure, get the 411 on style and any specific song requirements, then lock into your drummer, get in the groove, and have a blast!

lonote

03-11-2009, 11:04 AM