I usually just arpeggiate each note in the G-Major scale a few times starting at about a 120 tempo using quarter notes, and slowly working up to around 180.

That has improved my speed quite a bit, but what other things could I be doing?

Well that's a good start, now do that with every scale.


One thing I used to do, simple chromatic scale, one finger per fret, up to the 12th fret. then back down.

the best way to gain speed is to start slowly.

then one day, you will be like me, and playing **** like this :p :rolleyes:

Ahh, just love to fret wank, dontchu!!! :spit:

:D

Keep working slowly with a metronome and just build up the speed.

Do what W says. :p

Anyone can play fast, it takes a good musician to play slow.

Originally posted by jazzbo
Anyone can play fast, it takes a good musician to play slow.

Originally posted by jazzbo
Anyone can play fast, it takes a good musician to play slow.

that's exactly why I suck.

Originally posted by jazzbo
Anyone can play fast, it takes a good musician to play slow.

yup. I sure as hell have more trouble playing slow.

Originally posted by jazzbo
Anyone can play fast, it takes a good musician to play slow.

But speed is always good thing to have along with you.

Originally posted by jazzbo
Anyone can play fast, it takes a good musician to play slow.

I mostly agree. I've heard as many tasteless boring slow bass players as I've heard boring tasteless fast bass players.

Speed, in and of itself, is meaningless. But, speed in context is another story. It's not better, or worse, to play slow or fast, if it works.

That said, practicing for speed is a waste of time. The same scales, patterns, modes, etc you practice slowly, you can use to build up faster, and faster. And, you get the added bonus of learning music theory. Simply play them slowly with a metronome, and increase the tempo, and practice until you can play them faster. If you are deliberate in your attack, and technique, the form is the same fast/slow/midtempo.

It's all about muscle memory and stamina. I mean, playing a major arpeggio is nice to develop speed. But, at the end of the day, all you can really play fast is a major arpeggio--which is fine as long as you only play happy songs. :D

That said, I find that what I thought was appropriate when I was 20 is vastly different from what I think is appropriate now. I can play just as fast, if not faster, when needed as I could when I was younger, but I now see different options that allow for more openness, and interaction with my bandmates. Space can be your friend, let it. ;)

As important as learning how to play fast is, it's more important to remember that just because you can do something, doesn't mean you always should.

I've said it before and will say it again - speed is a byproduct of good technique, NOT an end to pursued by itself.

I'm gonna have to disagree with you somewhat there JB - IMO anyone can play fast OR slow, but it takes a good musician to play good music, regardless of tempo.

" Time and time again,successful bassist's find they can do entire gigs and never play a solo or find a place for the latest Les Claypool lick.The secret is to play the RIGHT thing-the RIGHT music,and to be rock solid.The real truth is nobody's going to be impressed by your funky,triple stopped,two handed version of "Giant Steps".
Bruce Elkington

I think what jazzbo meant might have been more along the lines of it takes a good musician to show restraint and play things slowly when he could easy fire up the fretboard. I could be wrong.


I myself have the opposite problem. I can play slow, but can rip out those 1/16 note styles like Rocco can. Well not as smoothly anyways.

Originally posted by thrash_jazz
I'm gonna have to disagree with you somewhat there JB - IMO anyone can play fast OR slow, but it takes a good musician to play good music, regardless of tempo.

Well yes, but I was hoping that that point was inferred.

This thread has kind of gotten off topic..I wonder if Money is satisfied with the relevant answers he DID get?

(he did ask for warm-ups to help speed, not the issues of musicicality behind playing fast)

Originally posted by Wrong Robot
This thread has kind of gotten off topic..I wonder if Money is satisfied with the relevant answers he DID get?

(he did ask for warm-ups to help speed, not the issues of musicicality behind playing fast)

They are unequivocably related.It's the "cart before the horse syndrome"...I'll debate that with anybody,anytime...:)

Yeah, but, it's like. What if you get someone that is 100% uninterested in anything other than playing green day songs with a pick on a bass strung below their knees?

and they couldn't care less about anything else, and you try and preach to them...but they couldn't be bothered, and they just want to know one particular thing about their specific interest, and no one gives them the input they want, because everyone is too busy talking about how much better musicians they are?

what then?

Try harder...
(and it's not about who's "better")
or get them a subscription to BP...those areas are adequately covered there...dude...;)

Well...to someone else, who doesn't care what JB and others might be talking about, what is the point in them debating it? and hijcaking the thread, and giving the original poster no insight into their problem?

Other than trying to derail that person for wanting what they want?

that's what I'm trying to say.

We all start somewhere with the Bass Guitar...and I see a lot of guys here who started in the "wrong" place and trying to help some others who are starting in the "wrong" place now...I don't see it as egotistical or hi-jacking,but perhaps passing on some experience...whether it's absorbed or not...who knows?The goal is to pass on musical information and realities that have been learned...one such reality in 99.9% of professional musical situations you will encounter as a bassist;nobody cares how fast you can play.

Yeah, and I agree with you very much. So don't take me wrong when I'm saying this stuff, I just kind of get tired of stuff like "what's the best way to use a pick" and the responses are 9/10 "why use a pick?" or "real bassists don't use picks" or "picks aren't good"

then that person may get frustrated with the site and not wish to post here again.

It's like, sometimes you are just looking for a simple answer to a more or less simple question, the musicianship behind their inquiry should be irrelevant.

Originally posted by Wrong Robot
Yeah, and I agree with you very much. So don't take me wrong when I'm saying this stuff, I just kind of get tired of stuff like "what's the best way to use a pick" and the responses are 9/10 "why use a pick?" or "real bassists don't use picks" or "picks aren't good"

then that person may get frustrated with the site and not wish to post here again.

It's like, sometimes you are just looking for a simple answer to a more or less simple question, the musicianship behind their inquiry should be irrelevant.

I disagree...for the sole reason that then we're contributing to the mis-education of many-a-bass players,when with perhaps a slight bit of "prodding" they can avoid some obvious misconceptions about bass and music in general.
If somebody's disagreeing for the sake of disagreeing,you can spot it.:)

I suppose.

but the original question still applies.

I wonder if Mike Money is satisfied with this thread?(and the answers he has recieved)

Originally posted by Wrong Robot
I suppose.

but the original question still applies.

I wonder if Mike Money is satisfied with this thread?(and the answers he has recieved)

maybe it made him think?
(course,I could be kidding myself):bawl:

Originally posted by Wrong Robot
[B the musicianship behind their inquiry should be irrelevant. [/B]

You need to seriously examine that kind of statement if you want to be taken seriously as a musician,regardless of your "chops"....and I say that with all sincerity and no malice.:)

taken out of context, yeah that sounds horrible don't it.

that's why you shouldn't do that :p

In the situation presented...my quote....

I don't believe that at all(my quote that is) but when put into the context of someone who COULDN"T CARE LESS, then why waste your breath(or fingers) on typing about a subject that is irrelevant TO THEM.

I don't consider it a waste.Sometimes it works.
I did'nt quote you of context,on the contrary,I went lightly on you.Take that statement in any context to a professional musician or educator,and see the kind of response/reaction you get.You would immediately be dismissed as an amateur.

but that WASN't the statement...oh well.

that's not what I believe in truth, but in the circumstance I assumed it is true(to an extent)

Seem like I gave off the wrong message, oh well, my bad. please don't misinterpret me, I strongly believe in learning and musical diversity as much as possible, I guess I've just had too much time around players that couldn't care less,me trying to teach them something more, and them not caring(I get this A LOT) just a little bitter I suppose, or something.

Originally posted by Mike Money
I usually just arpeggiate each note in the G-Major scale a few times starting at about a 120 tempo using quarter notes, and slowly working up to around 180.

That has improved my speed quite a bit, but what other things could I be doing?

I have a bit of difficulty myself with speed. I mean, I'm having trouble playing a measure of 16th notes at 88 bpm LOL. It either sounds rushed or I can't keep up with the beat. To help me with that my teacher told me to accent (in my mind) the first note of each beat so that I can hear where the beat starts. I've also learned to start slowly and gradually build up to a faster tempo.

Another factor is finger strength. I believe the more flexible and stronger your fingers are the faster they will move. My teacher just gave me a new finger exercise to do:

- With your index finger placed on E on the D string (2nd fret) hammer-on the string and then pull-off. (Do not use your right hand at all to pluck the string. Your left-hand fingers will do all the work. When you pull-off you pluck the strings with your left-hand fingers.)

- With your index finger placed on B on the A string (2nd fret), again do the same thing. The string is thicker and will be a bit harder to do.

- With your middle finger placed on G on the E string (3rd fret), again, hammer-on and pull-off.

Now here are the hard ones for me--

- With your ring finger placed on Ab on the E string (4th fret) do the same thing.

- Finally with your pinky finger placed on A on the E string (5th fret) hammer-on and pull-off. Doing this exercise has made me realize how underdeveloped the strength in my ring finger and my pinky is.

I work on this about 5 minutes a day.

I also do a finger alternation exercise and chromatic runs as warm-ups.

Hope this helps.

Originally posted by Wrong Robot
It's like, sometimes you are just looking for a simple answer to a more or less simple question, the musicianship behind their inquiry should be irrelevant.

I gave an answer that was 100%, unequivocally, relevant and to the point. Also, this thread never became hijacked, whatsoever. I stand by my answer. I will give that answer each and every time this question is asked. And how is the musicianship behind a bass related question, in the General Instruction forum, of a musician's forum irrelevant??? Mike know has the ability to read through the posts and make an informed decision. I at least threw out an alternative. If Mike decides to take that information and do mind-numbingly boring, non-musical, exercises in a vain attempt to build endurance so that he can better perform on-stage pyrotechnics, without any real thought to the evolution of musical playing, that's a choice he know makes of his own volition. But, I can say that I presented an option for more. Perhaps Mike will be curious about my post and ask me to explain more and more what I mean, and through my experience and background I can provide him with the information he needs to develop his skills as an all around musician, which he can then utilize by being able to learn any Green Day song he ever wants to, almost instantaneously, and play it with the most amazing speed and dexterity you've ever seen. Because, you see, I'm not insulting his approach, but I'm presenting a more streamlined and efficient manner with which to acheive his probably goal. And while he may never actualize that, or even realize my goal, I've done what I can in providing the information. For you see, I've spent a good amount of time studying this information, I've spent a lot of money, time and energy on my instrument and in the field of music, and in the process, I've learned quite a bit, and I decided to share some of that, for free, because the question was asked. Right or wrong, I've provided information which I am confident of, and I did it in a non-insulting way.

So you say it's best for me to spoon feed and coddle, and I say, "Give a man a fish...."

Originally posted by stephanie
Another factor is finger strength. I believe the more flexible and stronger your fingers are the faster they will move.

I believe it comes more down to muscle memory. Ask any DBer. BG is an EXTREMELY easy instrument to play. When individuals simply spend time doing musical things on their instrument, things like speed come naturally. Yes flexibility is important, and I guess, to some degree, strength is too, but I believe that the best way to build those things are to do musical things. Scales, arpeggios, playing songs, gigging, etc. We're not talking DB here which requires great strength. We're talking BG. Play music, as often as possible, and you will find, that speed becomes built. But, I sincerely believe, if you perform non-musical exercises and neglect other things, while you may be able to move around faster, your musicianship, or ability to say anything interesting at that speed, is diminished.

Originally posted by ALL THAT JAZZBO
I believe it comes more down to muscle memory....

You're right. Apologies if my post made it seem like I was taking away from practicing scales and stuff because that wasn't my intention at all.

I was just thinking from personal experience (or maybe lack of experience? LOL). My fingers aren't strong at all. I've made it part of my practice routine to first warm-up with finger exericses then move on to scale runs. Another big problem I have is (when playing fast, heck even sometimes when playing slow) that either my brain can't catch up with my fingers or my fingers can't catch up with my brain. LOL. It gets frustrating sometimes.

Whenever I look at speed. I think...alternate your fingers back and forth in mid air. that should be as fast as you can go.

then the next step is just making that connection with your bass.
:p

If you can sing it, you can play it!


My highschool music teacher used to tell us this in drumline and jazz band all the time. To a point its true.

Often I find that my problems don't involve muscle strength or stamina, but are tempo related. I can play really fast, REALLY fast, but do you want me to actually play a solid set quick tempo? Pssh, get outta here. ;)

It helps me to count it out while you are playing. Play it with a metronome SLOWLY and quicken the tempo (pretty much what everyone else is saying.)

Originally posted by jazzbo


When individuals simply spend time doing musical things on their instrument, things like speed come naturally.

There's your "secret" to "playing fast"...nothing more nothing less.:) Put away your handgrips and technique video's,magazine finger exercises and mindless chromatic patterns with a metronome and just follow Jazzbo's advice above,you'll gain all the speed you'll ever need.

Originally posted by ConU


There's your "secret" to "playing fast"...nothing more nothing less.:) Put away your handgrips and technique video's,magazine finger exercises and mindless chromatic patterns with a metronome and just follow Jazzbo's advice above,you'll gain all the speed you'll ever need.

'Swhat I said too... ;)

I've said it before and will say it again - speed is a byproduct of good technique, NOT an end to pursued by itself.

I cn slZp rE47 FaZzt d00dz :cool:




Continuing the off topic discussion, because I love derailed threads. I personally cannot play fast at all when it comes to fingerstyle. I am envious of fingerstyle hardcore punkers (they exist, I've seen 'em) and metal bassers. It's all about being able to play what the song calls for, and sometimes the song calls for 16th notes at 150 bpm. So I could use some speed exersizes as well. I mostly do chromatic scales up and down the neck as Mr. Robot suggested.

"As i get older, i play simpler and simpler... because i can." -my bass teacher

I agree that muscle memory will definetly add to the speed but it can also lead to playing the same lines over and over again. Tough choice to make. Great to get the stuff together but remember to stay musical.

Originally posted by Wrong Robot
Yeah, but, it's like. What if you get someone that is 100% uninterested in anything other than playing green day songs with a pick on a bass strung below their knees?

and they couldn't care less about anything else, and you try and preach to them...but they couldn't be bothered, and they just want to know one particular thing about their specific interest, and no one gives them the input they want, because everyone is too busy talking about how much better musicians they are?

what then?

I play green day all the time... but mainly because it is catchy and I just play along with them to help me develop my singing while playing shhtuffff.

I also need speed because I want to learn some Geezer solos... and those are quite fast.

--------------------------------------------------------

And Jazzbo, please enlightmen me on what you meant. I'm beyond playing fast because it sounds cool, so really any advice on any speed level would be much appreciated.

Hmm... I think this thread has moved on a bit, but here's a good excercise I learnt from my bass teacher.

Try playing all the different triads of a key, up and down the neck. It gets you moving around the fretboard and processes some good theory. and it also helps build up stamina, technique, and yes, speed.

So, for example, (I'm sure I'm explaining this badly by the way, so it might be worth reading up on a bit of theory if you decide to use this), you want to practise in the key of G, you would go through all of these triads:

G maj (G B D D B G)
A min (A C E E C A)
B min (B D F# F# D B) etc...
C maj
D maj
E min
F# min b5
G maj

Play though those triads up and down the neck with a metronome, starting slowly at first and building up speed. Once you've done it in G, try moving up to Ab, then to A, then to Bb... you'll be playing Geezer solos in no time. :D

Oh, and to add my little comment to the speed issue, I think that speed of itself isn't too important: playing something that's tight, that grooves, and that sounds right melodically is more important.