2 hours to find a bass once we decided to shop

Harling · #1 10-04-2009, 03:59 PM

We bought the bass this summer within a 2 hour time frame from a vintage guitar shop - and by bought I mean we started shopping and concluded the purchase within 2 hours (hence no time to sign up to TB and learn from all your wisdom).

My son was in a jazz workshop this summer and his bass teachers said at the end of it all that they thought he should get a double bass - he has been playing BG for a while now. My son had noticed a bass the day before at lunch time while looking at BGs in a nearby guitar store. He told his his teachers as part of the "you should get a double bass" conversation and Don Thompson agreed to walk over to the store to look at it. He recommended the bass very highly, said if it was in Toronto he would buy it just to sell it again for the money. An hour and half later I was off work, with a smoking hole in my line of credit, and we were trying to figure out how to get a DB into a Toyota. My son's other workshop teacher, Neil Swainson, showed us how to do that - talk about learning the fundamentals of DB from some of the best players.

The bass is a ca 100 year old 3/4 Czech flatback, subsequently valued by our local luthier (Jim Ham) at 3 times what we paid for it and will still be valued double what we paid once he has done the work it needs. It sounds great even with 20 or 30 year old strings on it and badly in need of a setup (apparently sat in a closet for 20 years). He did put in a new end pin (N-pin installed, old one missing), reset the bridge and tweaked the sound post just so it could be used for practicing on. It should serve my sons gigging needs for many years to come.

Dimensions (inches):
Full Height 71.66
Scale Length 41.42
Upper Bout Width 20.50
Lower Bout Width 25.50
Width at Nut 1.69

Pictures can be seen at the link below. These pics are of it in its current state before it goes to the luthier, later this winter when he has time.

http://picasaweb.google.ca/HarlingPt...eat=directlink

MDEbass · #2 10-04-2009, 04:02 PM

Congrats! Must be exciting.

Harling · #3 10-04-2009, 04:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MDEbass

Congrats! Must be exciting.

It is. I am not a musician, but my son very much is. He is loving the bass and will miss it while it is being worked on. I am excited to get a bass that he won't need to trade up for a very long time and when that time comes, if ever, he will be the one paying for it

)

Greg Clinkingbeard · #4 10-04-2009, 04:17 PM

That looks almost exactly like my bass, although mine has lost it's external linings at some point and been refinished. The dimensions are very similar and the back bracing is nearly identical. Your bass appears to be healthy.
Your son will indeed enjoy that instrument for many years. Good one.

Harling · #5 10-04-2009, 07:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by clink

That looks almost exactly like my bass, although mine has lost it's external linings at some point and been refinished. The dimensions are very similar and the back bracing is nearly identical. Your bass appears to be healthy.
Your son will indeed enjoy that instrument for many years. Good one.

That's cool. I wonder about the attributions as "german" (such as your bass) or "czech" like this one. Not sure if the labels in my son's bass dates to original import (the Toronto label can't predate the early 1930's when that company was established in Toronto), or if the labels were added later. I suppose also that at some points in history (such as around WWI), "german" might have become "czech" for political/economic reasons - would make sense without knowing anything much about this topic.

The bass has good health according to the luthier - he was surprised that there are no cracks on the rib and almost none on the top (photos show both of them). He suspects it has spent much of its life in the kinder west coast climate.

hdiddy · #6 10-04-2009, 08:51 PM

If Don Thompson tells you to buy a bass... say no more!

Greg Clinkingbeard · #7 10-04-2009, 09:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Harling

That's cool. I wonder about the attributions as "german" (such as your bass) or "czech" like this one. Not sure if the labels in my son's bass dates to original import (the Toronto label can't predate the early 1930's when that company was established in Toronto), or if the labels were added later. I suppose also that at some points in history (such as around WWI), "german" might have become "czech" for political/economic reasons - would make sense without knowing anything much about this topic.

The bass has good health according to the luthier - he was surprised that there are no cracks on the rib and almost none on the top (photos show both of them). He suspects it has spent much of its life in the kinder west coast climate.

http://s114.photobucket.com/albums/n...atback%20bass/

I suspect my bass came from this region:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Markneukirchen
Being so close to the border, makers on either side were probably prone to sharing designs and ideas. I've seen very similar bass labeled Czech or German.

Yes, your bass has had a very good life. Mine has several repaired cracks in the top, some in the ribs and back. A total restoration has it singing beautifully though, so none of that matters much.

Harling · #8 10-05-2009, 09:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by hdiddy

If Don Thompson tells you to buy a bass... say no more!

Absolutely. Not only a fantastic musician on lots of instruments, but one heck of a nice guy. A terrific mentor.

scotty77 · #9 10-10-2009, 09:11 PM

So, out of interest, where did you find the bass? I've been looking, but mostly at L&M and Larsen. Didn't think to check out the guitar shops. (Or just never made the time.)
Congrats, sounds like you got a good deal.

Harling · #10 10-11-2009, 10:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by scotty77

So, out of interest, where did you find the bass? I've been looking, but mostly at L&M and Larsen. Didn't think to check out the guitar shops. (Or just never made the time.)
Congrats, sounds like you got a good deal.

It was a shop on Fort. I think its the only time they have had a DB in there. Have you looked at the 1970 Engelhardt that is in the Cobble Hill area?:
http://www.usedvictoria.com/classified-ad/9756138
It might be of some interest if still available.

arto alho · #11 10-11-2009, 11:21 AM

Congrats for the purchase. I´ve seen a few basses like that here, since after WWII instruments were imported also here from Czeckoslovakia. Remember, that the country existed from 1918 to 1938 and then after the war up to 1992.

The unlabeled instruments come mostly from the Luby area and its surroundings. Our basses are usually from 50´s to 70´s. After that companies like Strunal got the most part of the market. The design did not change much, the quality of the instruments varies more.

B & J New York refers to Buegeleisen and Jacobson, who were a NY based instrument importers and sellers during 1930-1940. This might help to locate the age and the origin.

Harling · #12 10-11-2009, 11:34 AM

Thanks for the info. B&J Toronto seems to have been established in 1930 so that may be pertinent too. However, I am told that the labels could be added later in the life of the instrument and thus are not necessarily an indication of age or origin. I suspect that for a bass like this, we will never know, unless something is hidden away on the inside.

Paul Warburton · #13 10-11-2009, 01:26 PM

The way you're luck is running, how about a Vegas trip? Timing, a little investment $, two of the best players on the planet for feed-back and instruction, one of the finest luthiers...who could ask for more.
Great pics, by the way.
I'd wish you good luck, but apparently you don't need that. You flat got it. Have fun.

Harling · #14 10-11-2009, 02:57 PM

Dang, you are right - should've bought a lotter ticket that day.

Part of the "luck" is that Victoria, for all its being a small town and bit of a back water, has some good opportunities for younger musicians. One of them is the Victoria Conservatory of Music Summer Jazz programs to which they bring some very good players.
http://www.vcm.bc.ca/033_SummerJazzWor/index.html

scotty77 · #15 10-11-2009, 11:17 PM

Thanks for the heads up on the Englehart.
Last spring, I picked up a Kay through the conservatory that I'm currently working on (typical broken neck problem). Once I get that fixed up and playable, it will be my bass for awhile I'm sure. I've got to get working on it as I took my rental back to L&M. Again, congrats on finding the bass.

Don C · #16 10-13-2009, 12:28 PM

Scotty you have a PM