Go Back   TalkBass Forums > Double Bass Forums > Basses [DB]
Register Rules/FAQ/CUP Members List Calendar Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Basses [DB] Discussion on the instrument: double bass, string bass, contrabass, bass viol, acoustic bass, upright bass, standup bass, bass fiddle, bass violin, doghouse bass, bull fiddle... :)


Supporting Membership
Thank You

Latest Supporting Member
Donate to Upgrade Today

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread
  #1  
Old 03-24-2010, 04:49 PM
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: NYC
Advice: Top caved in on E string side, splintering on G string side

I have a Mathias thoma that has a caved in top.
E string side.
The sinking on the E string side has caused splintering on the G string side now as well.
Bass was sitting in its bag for the last couple years while this was occurring.

Looking for advice on what options I have for it and what makes the most sense.

Thanks in advance for your input.
Sign in to disble this ad
  #2  
Old 03-24-2010, 07:07 PM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Location: Boston, MA
I am no luthier; neither are most people here. I would hazard a few guesses, based on what people have told me, in similar situations:
- Take the tension off of the bass by loosening the strings, immediately, to avoid further damage.
- Get the bass to a GOOD luthier for an assessment of the cost/practicality of repairs vs. value of the bass (is the bass worth fixing?).
- Look for a rental or a loaner if you need a bass to play or work. Whatever is going to happen next is going to take awhile.
  #3  
Old 03-24-2010, 07:21 PM
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: NYC
thanks Eric,

Tension is off the bass.

I think its pretty clear the bass is not worth fixing. At least by an experienced luthier.
Wondering if anyone knows of a student luthier looking for some experience with such a project.

bummer.
  #4  
Old 03-25-2010, 01:27 AM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Westminster, Maryland
pictures

Quote:
Originally Posted by edham View Post
thanks Eric,

Tension is off the bass.

I think its pretty clear the bass is not worth fixing. At least by an experienced luthier.
Wondering if anyone knows of a student luthier looking for some experience with such a project.

bummer.
Possibly. Please post some pictures. Thanks.
__________________
Never try this at home.
  #5  
Old 03-25-2010, 11:55 AM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Vancouver, BC, Canada
When a top is caving in to the extent you seem to be indicating, this is usually the result of the bassbar letting go of the top, usually in the lower half. I've seen bassbars peeling away from the belly, sometimes the glue failing, sometimes taking a lot of belly with them, up to 75% of the bar's length. This is usually repairable, and the re-attached wood can then be reinforced using raw linen (NOT cotton!) strips across the bar as needed to hold the connection securely. This is to say heavy raw linen cloth on pre-warmed wood, the linen being saturated with successive applications of strong hide glue until it is hard, then polished somewhat for acoustical smoothness (reflecting sound more than absorbing it) and to avoid dust sticking to rough fibers. Such 'bandaid' fixes have held very well in my experience with no signs of letting go in at least a few cases in, so far, over a decade of professional use.

If some degree of arching correction is also needed beyond what merely gluing the bar back accomplishes, this is a much more expensive surgery. Even just cleaning up the joint and re-gluing and patching the bar is potentially expensive, as removing the belly, cleaning the belly/rib juncture, and re-attaching the belly properly is itself consumptive of several hours of skilled labour in most cases. Luthiers do get 'lucky' at times, when previous luthiers have left clean and just-right glued joints such that the glue separates cleanly without splintering of the belly edges, and minimizing the amount of preparatory work to re-glue it. This is rarely the case with cheaper instruments however, as they tend to use synthetic glues which multiply the labour input many times. I've had bellies of fine instruments part company with the ribs and blocks in less than 5 minutes. I've had tops of cheap Korean or Chinese basses take all day to remove, and much of the next day be consumed by repairing just the damage done to the edge in the removing, before even beginning the repairs for which the top had to be removed. A 'cheap' bass in such cases is anything but. On the other hand, some recent basses I've seen from China are a positive joy to work on, as they incorporate very fine traditional techniques and great woods. Several of the nicest model from a company using the 'J. Heinrich' label are every bit as well made as many lower-priced hand made American basses costing $12,000 to $20,000, though costing less than $3,000 in these cases. Hide glue throughout, beautiful joinery, and really amazingly fine wood, all beautifully carved and varnished. A number of other J. Heinrichs I've seen have been entirely different, awful things made using white glue and inferior materials, though the asking prices are similar, so this must be a large shop making diverse instruments to cater to different market tastes.

Anyway, hope this helps in your decision. I don't know the model you named so can't comment directly on its quality and value.
__________________
Gerard Ivan Samija
http://www.luthier.ca
Reply



Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off

Follow TalkBass on Twitter   Visit TalkBass on Facebook  

All times are GMT -6. The time now is 04:52 PM.




Copyright 2011 Talk Music Group Inc. All rights reserved.
Play guitar? Visit our new sister site TalkGuitar.com [beta]
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.6.12
Copyright ©2000 - 2012, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.