Anyone heard of J. Balaton of Effingham IL

[sssbobbyr]

Ive got an old J. Balaton or salaton? or Salalon? from looks like effingham Illinois. Trying to find out if this thing is worth getting worked on or should I start at the bottom wrung with a new one and keep trading up? It's the only DB I've ever played. Everyone I know with experience on other DBs says it sounds great but that it is a monster to play. Any input appreciated.

[Andrew McGregor]

Well, if it sounds great, that's the most expensive part taken care of. So it's most likely worth getting a setup done to fix the playability. It's almost impossible for a setup to cost as much as another bass.

[drurb]

Originally Posted by Andrew McGregor

...It's almost impossible for a setup to cost as much as another bass.

That is, unless...

See here.

[Eric Swanson]

Originally Posted by drurb

That is, unless...

See here.

Nice photo, Drurb!

[Jake deVilliers]

I love the ad copy, especially the phrase " unlike other cheap imitations"!!

[drurb]

Originally Posted by Jake deVilliers

I love the ad copy, especially the phrase " unlike other cheap imitations"!!

Well, not to re-open old wounds but this bass was the subject of this contentious thread. When I searched ebay for a humorous example of a bass being cheaper than a setup, there it was again! Oh, and let's not forget:

"IT CAN BE CONVERTED TO A LEFT HANDED BASS BY SIMPLY REVERSING THE STRINGS AND BRIDGE"

Oh yes, those cheap imitations that use individual scroll tuners-- such as the Rubners on my own bass here:

[Martin Sheridan]

I haven't heard of him which doesn't necessarily mean anything. It could be a repair label? Does it have a date?
Plywood or carved? Pictures?

[shadygrove]

+1 on putting some money into setup if you're happy with the sound. What is it that makes it "a monster to play"? If it's too long a scale length then that could be potentially expensive to alter and the sound of the bass might change, but if the strings are too high getting the bridge or nut height adjusted shouldn't be too expensive.

What strings are you using? They can also make a big difference in how much effort it takes to play.

Whether or not you can identify who made your bass should not be the deciding factor in whether it is a keeper or not. The important thing is whether it has the sound you want. From the examples other posters have given of the "bottom rung" it seems unlikely to me those basses will sound better than what you have.

If your idea of "bottom rung" starts at more like $1000 than maybe you can get something you can resell to move up to a better bass later, but for much less than that the quality, sound and playability is usually such that it is difficult to resell without taking a loss.

[Rickengeezer]

Originally Posted by drurb

Well, not to re-open old wounds but this bass was the subject of this contentious thread. When I searched ebay for a humorous example of a bass being cheaper than a setup, there it was again! Oh, and let's not forget:

"IT CAN BE CONVERTED TO A LEFT HANDED BASS BY SIMPLY REVERSING THE STRINGS AND BRIDGE"

Oh yes, those cheap imitations that use individual scroll tuners-- such as the Rubners on my own bass here:

I offer this with some trepidation but perhaps some here might find my saga amusing. I, a veteran of 35 years of BG but as a total DB newbie curious about doing some acoustic blues gigs on DB, took the plunge and bought the infamous "Antigua" about 4 months ago. I did so even after reading this board extensively. Of course, I live not far from Houston so I went, in person, to Mr. Antigua's "storage" facility and looked at three or four before settling on a "4/4" (it has 42.5" string length bridge to nut) that seemed decently put together. Mr. Antigua charged me a little more than the $199 for in-person pickup as he seems to make some change on his $285 shipping charges. So, I own a $240 genuine Antigua.

Mr. Antigua imports these directly off the freighter from Indonesia. He has a curious take on DB construction, as is evident from his ad copy; I sort of saw him as being to DB sales what Hank Hill (from "King of the Hill"), who he reminded me of, is to propane sales. This similarity led me to speculate some about the moniker "akaHank"....but I digress. Some of his more interesting selling points: Looking under the extension of the fingerboard made it apparent that the board was "ebonized" and not ebony, so when I commented he asked me if I had heard of "white ebony". I indicated that I hadn't but it sounded similar to "military intelligence". At that point, he mused why bass builders didn't use a hard wood like maple anyway--why use this stupid soft ebony wood? I had no insights on that, so he suggested that "girls" like the softer wood. Aha.

I also asked him about all the reports of string breakage. He blamed those on "electronic tuners". That clarified (?), I moved on to the "exploding bass" syndrome. Here, he moved into the vicinity of reality by asking me if I had ever heard of hide glue. I told him I had, and he noted that hide glue is designed to come apart in conditions of heat and humidity--so, people take their Antiguas to the beach, and voila, hide glue-related explosions! I pointed out that his stock of Antiguas was sitting inside an un-airconditioned railroad car in the sun in Houston during the summer, and I suspected it got pretty hot and humid in there--and he mumbled something about a "vent" and changed the subject to shipping charges. By the way, the top is clearly laminate and not carved as advertised, and it has a pronounced flat E bevel facing for the E string, which would make that "conversion for lefties" a bit difficult (aside from the fact that the bassbar would become, I suppose, a treblebar).

Anyhow, I loaded the Antigua into the back of my wagon and made it home. Of course, reading these boards made me a bit suspicious of the quality of my shiny new BSO, so I was very careful about letting the bass get acclimated to my air-conditioned music room. I took my time tuning the thing to concert pitch over 4 days. I lost my first string (G) at around Eb, and all told only one string--A--made it to concert pitch without breaking. Undaunted, I bought some CCS (cheap chinese strings, $24 a set) off ebay, also from a (different) importer from Houston, that actually arrived the next day. And, lo and behold, these new strings actually held up (and have held up) to concert pitch, and I thumped happily away for 30 minutes or so before....THWAAAAANGGGG...there goes the tailgut cable! But, armed with $2.20 and Bob Gollihur's instructions on this board, I marched to Home Depot and solved that problem with some aircraft cable, which has held up just fine.

Now, when I first mounted the bridge the action could have been measured in meters, although the fit of the feet actually seemed quite good. Again using the Gollihur Method (TM) of cutting deep grooves to align things and then doing some coping saw and sanding work, I've got the action at about 8mm at G and D, 10mm at A and E. At those heights, I had a small rattle around C# on the A string, so I identified the problem area with the china marker on the string underside trick (thanks Ken/Bob/Arnold or whoever described that one!) and with 1000 grit and a straightedge, I've got the rattle under control at an action I find pretty playable. I also had to take quite a bit of material off the nut to get the strings closer to the board up at that end, but that was easy enough.

I've been playing daily, 30 to 60 minutes, for about 4 months and I've been having a gas, both learning the differences from BG as well as tinkering with the instrument itself to get it set up to my uninstructed tastes. Everything seems tight, no loose seams or rattles, and no grooves in the fingerboard. I even borrowed a bow and tried arco out of curiousity, but the howling of the neighborhood dogs quickly put that to rest. I'm mainly playing old blues, and it seems to have a good tone for that...at least it has the tone I expect in my head, and this is from someone who has dozens of BGs in order to get specific tones. I did make a trip to the only string shop in town, and played various unidentifiable (by me) basses priced up to around $5k, and didn't find any that I thought were either more playable or had a markedly better tone. I doubt those were the cream of the bass crop, but the experience didn't make me feel any worse about my limited investment.

So, after 4 months I'm pleased with my infamous Antigua, even though I've had to replace pretty much every piece of metal on the instrument (metallurgy in Indonesia doesn't seem quite up to snuff). If it blew up tomorrow, I'd feel that I got my money's worth, and that it served its purpose--demonstrating to me that I have fun playing this thing without spending an arm and a leg to find out (I suspect renting for 4 months would have more than equaled my current investment). At this point if it did blow up I'd probably make the investment to get a better quality starter instrument, but if it doesn't blow up I'm happy with it for now. I just thought I'd let people know about my trip to the "Heart of Antigua", offer a somewhat limited endorsement, and offer my thanks to the various experts on this board for the tips that have made it possible for me to get this thing working for me--despite the fact that I have violated with impunity virtually every directive offered to newbies in the stickied links. I can't say I'd recommend the infamous Antigua for everyone, but if you like to tinker, you have limited expectations, and particuarly if you can look in person before you leap--it's the best $240+$24+$2.20 I've spent in a while! The infamous Antigua:

[KSB - Ken Smith]

First off, there is a Mr. Antigua? He named himself after an imported Bass? How special..lol

If he thinks that Maple is harder than Ebony (a convenient sales line for the dumb and dumber) then maybe he can give me two $20s for a $10. Like.. over and over..

To shed a little light here. I have posted some links above with facts about these two woods he is so very wrong about. The variety of the species I refer to may not be the exact as used on his or other Basses but the the density properties are nearly the same for the examples I have shown.

[Rickengeezer]

Originally Posted by KSB - Ken Smith

First off, there is a Mr. Antigua? He named himself after an imported Bass? How special..lol

If he thinks that Maple is harder than Ebony (a convenient sales line for the dumb and dumber) then maybe he can give me two $20s for a $10. Like.. over and over..

No, Ken, I don't think his name is actually Mr. Antigua, although he has that status on this board. Actually, I didn't even see anything about "antigua" on the shipping boxes and certainly not on the instrument itself, so I don't even know where that name came from.

And his "maple" comment was just to change the subject, because he advertised the fingerboard as ebony when it clearly wasn't. I'm not even certain the fingerboard is maple, but at least it doesn't seem to be pine!

[dchan]

Thanks, Rickengeezer, for that entertaining account of your experiences with the infamous Antigua basses. In a way, I was looking to some sort of closure to the "akaHank and Antigua" saga, and nobody I can recall actually had any sort of experience with these basses (except for supposedly akaHank). Not only have you given us your experience, you went far and beyond any of our expectations and given us the real scoop of these basses. Not only was it humorous and entertaining, it was very well-informed and pretty well researched. Bravo!

From your account, it seems Hank Hill had more sincere faith in his propane than Mr. Antigua seems to ever have had with his BSOs. I remember that some of our more patriotic-minded have complained about the Chinese flooding our markets with cheap basses (or even finely-built basses), and we have an American now (I assume) who is deliberately flooding our market with Indonesian basses. So if you want to take it out on somebody, take it out on the sleazy importers, I suppose.

One thing I remember about akaHank's first post was that his (or her) claim to be a luthier was sketchy at best. The use of weird lingo (box as a word for the body of the bass) was one tip-off, and now your confirmation that these basses appear to be laminated rather than his/her claim that they were fully-carved confirms that he/she was not who he/she claimed. And what was up with his/her automatic confrontations with anybody who disagreed with his/her posts?

[drurb]

Originally Posted by Rickengeezer

...I did make a trip to the only string shop in town, and played various unidentifiable (by me) basses priced up to around $5k, and didn't find any that I thought were either more playable or had a markedly better tone.

Thanks so much for your enlightening, entertaining, and thorough post! It certainly confirmed my suspicions about these basses and those who sell them. The only statement about which I was really puzzled was the one above. Basses around $5k that didn't play or sound substantially better than the Antigua? What in the world are they selling for $5k?

[Rickengeezer]

Originally Posted by drurb

Basses around $5k that didn't play or sound substantially better than the Antigua? What in the world are they selling for $5k?

That's a good question...there were about seven basses in there, ranging from about $1k to $5k, and I suspect most had been rentals. I looked inside and many of them had a "Setup by xxxxx" tag, which were the same name so I assume it was the luthier tied to the store, but I didn't see any other identifying tags. A couple of them looked to be fully carved (including the $5k one) albeit a tad beat up, so maybe there was a "vintage" premium associated with them. I'm going by price numbers that were hanging on the tags, which are often "list prices", and this is a store that pretty much has a monopoly on DB sales for 100 miles in all directions--so I suspect their prices aren't too competitive. Other factors: I am a novice playing standard blues scales pizz on these things, and this store clearly caters to the local junior/senior high school-type band customer, so if they're set up for anything it would probably be for arco, and thus I wasn't impressed with the action relative to where I have mine now. With that young clientele, many also seemed to be 1/2 size, and those didn't have the "boom" of my Indonesian echo chamber. So, there wasn't really anything in there that gave me serious Upright Acquisition Syndrome relative to mine--and I am pretty seriously predisposed to disorders of this type. Soon I'll take a trek over to Austin and sample some of the stock from the great shops there--that should give me a better feel for what a really high end instrument feels like. For the time being, though, the Antigua seems to do the job....and as somebody who gigs in some pretty rough places, the thought of taking a fully carved European bass into one of them gives me the willies!

[boylebass]

I want a bass with rack and pinion tuning...