craigslist bass

[relacey]

Originally Posted by drurb

As to why old Kays are so popular, well, that's the result of a number of factors. They are a no-longer-produced bit of Americana. That, in and of itself, accounts for much of the value of old Kays. In addition, they do have a characteristic sound that many find especially suited to certain genres of music.

True, plus in some bluegrass circles there is name snobbery. The mandolin and banjo must be from Gibson, the guitar has to be a Martin, the dobro from National, and only a Kay or old American Standard is acceptable; regardless of how any of them sound. For some reason the fiddle gets a pass on this as long as it's old.

I had a friend who had a 70's Gibson "lump scroll" mandolin (generally considered a low point in Gibson mandos) and he upgraded to a high end Kentucky (Asian made but they are really fine instruments). He claims that his band kicked him out cause he didn't have the correct name on his instrument. I've hung around bluegrassers enough to believe him.

To the OP, IMHO the least costly way into upright bass is to get a modern plywood from one of the manufacturers listed above. If you're hankering for a vintage Kay, buy from a reputable dealer (search the archives for names).

In either case, a dealer will sometimes offer a trade-up option or a rent-to-own plan. Going cheap up front will cost more almost every time, you may wind up with an instrument that's unplayable, or worse, one that will injure you. And before I get a bunch of posts from folks that somehow got their CCBs into a playable state for no money, don't overlook the cost of your time put into fixing the thing, the resale value, if any, and the expected life-time. There are tons of posts in the archives about BSO and CCB horrors.

Originally Posted by wdnewman

in total, have about $1,000 in the instrument which is probably worth $500 at this point

Cudo's to wdnewman for being honest.

[drurb]

Originally Posted by relacey

True, plus in some bluegrass circles there is name snobbery. The mandolin and banjo must be from Gibson, the guitar has to be a Martin, the dobro from National, and only a Kay or old American Standard is acceptable; regardless of how any of them sound. For some reason the fiddle gets a pass on this as long as it's old.

I had a friend who had a 70's Gibson "lump scroll" mandolin (generally considered a low point in Gibson mandos) and he upgraded to a high end Kentucky (Asian made but they are really fine instruments). He claims that his band kicked him out cause he didn't have the correct name on his instrument. I've hung bluegrassers enough to believe him.

To the OP, IMHO the least costly way into upright bass is to get a modern plywood from one of the manufacturers listed above. If you're hankering for a vintage Kay, buy from a reputable dealer (search the archives for names).

In either case, a dealer will sometimes offer a trade-up option or a rent-to-own plan. Going cheap up front will cost more almost every time, you may wind up with an instrument that's unplayable, or worse, one that will injure you. And before I get a bunch of posts from folks that somehow got their CCBs into a playable state for no money, don't overlook the cost of your time put into fixing the thing, the resale value, if any, and the expected life-time. There are tons of posts in the archives about BSO and CCB horrors.

Cudo's to wdnewman for being honest.

Thanks for this excellent post. The insight into bluegrass "labels" was enlightening and the advice you gave is dead on-target!

[edmidlifecrisis]

That's hilarious but I believe it. The BG'ers I hang around with are pretty much beginners, so there is no name snobbery. Yet.

I haven't been able to re-connect with the guy, so for now, I'm dead in the water with this one. But I will pursue buying one and report back when I do.

Ed

[Paul Warburton]

Originally Posted by relacey

True, plus in some bluegrass circles there is name snobbery.

I had a friend who had a 70's Gibson "lump scroll" mandolin (generally considered a low point in Gibson mandos) and he upgraded to a high end Kentucky (Asian made but they are really fine instruments). He claims that his band kicked him out cause he didn't have the correct name on his instrument. I've hung bluegrassers enough to believe him.

Before I landed my first carved bass in about 1960, it was not only carved bass snobbery with jazz bassists.....they had to be German carved basses. I'm serious. Even if you had a master carved Italian bass from the 1700's, they tell you you got to get a German. It didn't matter what shop it came from either......just old and had to have a German label inside.
Then, it had to be a flat back. I had a Jacobus Hornsteiner carved back bass when I first went out on the road. Bass players would come up and give compliments on the sound until they'd see it wasn't a flat back. They would actually say..."Can you imagine how great that bass would be if it was a flat back?" Same deal with classical players. Have to be Italian. Best if it was Bresciano.
No chance to hang unless you have the right ****.

[relacey]

Originally Posted by Paul Warburton

Before I landed my first carved bass in about 1960, it was not only carved bass snobbery with jazz bassists.....they had to be German carved basses. I'm serious. Even if you had a master carved Italian bass from the 1700's, they tell you you got to get a German. It didn't matter what shop it came from either......just old and had to have a German label inside.
Then, it had to be a flat back. I had a Jacobus Hornsteiner carved back bass when I first went out on the road. Bass players would come up and give compliments on the sound until they'd see it wasn't a flat back. They would actually say..."Can you imagine how great that bass would be if it was a flat back?" Same deal with classical players. Have to be Italian. Best if it was Bresciano.
No chance to hang unless you have the right ****.

Must be a universal human truism. The better the instrument, the better the player. Too bad it's not true. If it were, I could buy my way into the NY Philharmonic or as a sideman for Sonny Rollins or Clark Terry, assuming I had the money.

Although the converse would kill me. If I were forced to play a bass equal to my talent/ability I'd have a washtub and a stick. And it would probably be a dirty stick. And if I practiced hard maybe they'd give me a string for my stick.

Are we sufficiently OT yet?

[edmidlifecrisis]

Originally Posted by relacey

Although the converse would kill me. If I were forced to play a bass equal to my talent/ability I'd have a washtub and a stick. And it would probably be a dirty stick. And if I practiced hard maybe they'd give me a string for my stick.

Are we sufficiently OT yet?

From the OP: I'm enjoying the ride, and I also would be playing a washtub with string and stick....

[wdnewman]

...the U.S. Navy taught me to play the upright. They had no use for a viola player, and since I had played tuba in my high school band, it was only logical that I play upright. Surprisingly, I loved it. I was not too bad with a bow either (thanks to the seven years of viola), but mostly all I did for three years was play big band and small combos. The Navy had two kinds of uprights. Kays and Epiphones. We didn't have any other choices unless we bought our own (and since we were on military pay, good luck). We had no chance at becoming snobs at all. A year ago I got the CCB and went back to the dark side. In that short year I have found out that the Navy taught me just enough to do what they wanted me to do. In that year I have found a whole new world of thumb positions and bunches of notes above the G harmonic I didn't know existed. All this history to tell you that I have never played anything but full ply basses. Ever. Never even touched anything else. I have now ordered a Thompson Hybrid from String Emporium and am awaiting arrival to give it a try. I hope to be impressed. The point here is that if you need to get a CCB to get started, do it. But do it with the understanding that it might be so bad that you could lose interest, and that even if it is a good player that probably within a year you are going to want to get something else.

Ah well...bass playing is a kind of disease.

[Paul Warburton]

Originally Posted by relacey

Are we sufficiently OT yet?

We can do this.

[relacey]

Originally Posted by wdnewman

In that short year I have found out that the Navy taught me just enough to do what they wanted me to do.

This cracks me up. On a par with "if the Navy wanted you to have a wife, they'd have issued you one."

Originally Posted by wdnewman

The point here is that if you need to get a CCB to get started, do it. But do it with the understanding that it might be so bad that you could lose interest, and that even if it is a good player that probably within a year you are going to want to get something else.

I totally agree. I sold a decent violin and mandolin to buy my bass; it's nothing extravagant but a nice instrument. The initial cost is definitely a big hurdle to getting into this instrument. Everyone has to follow the best path they can find. Good luck with your Thompson, I've never played one.

Originally Posted by wdnewman

Ah well...bass playing is a kind of disease.

Amen to that!! And PW, sorry about veering back. I just don't have that touch in taking those right angles from the topic. I defer to the masters and I include you in that group. I have much to learn.

[drurb]

Originally Posted by wdnewman

...the U.S. Navy taught me to play the upright. They had no use for a viola player, and since I had played tuba in my high school band, it was only logical that I play upright. Surprisingly, I loved it. I was not too bad with a bow either (thanks to the seven years of viola), but mostly all I did for three years was play big band and small combos. The Navy had two kinds of uprights. Kays and Epiphones. We didn't have any other choices unless we bought our own (and since we were on military pay, good luck). We had no chance at becoming snobs at all. A year ago I got the CCB and went back to the dark side. In that short year I have found out that the Navy taught me just enough to do what they wanted me to do. In that year I have found a whole new world of thumb positions and bunches of notes above the G harmonic I didn't know existed. All this history to tell you that I have never played anything but full ply basses. Ever. Never even touched anything else. I have now ordered a Thompson Hybrid from String Emporium and am awaiting arrival to give it a try. I hope to be impressed. The point here is that if you need to get a CCB to get started, do it. But do it with the understanding that it might be so bad that you could lose interest, and that even if it is a good player that probably within a year you are going to want to get something else.

Ah well...bass playing is a kind of disease.

Nice story and thanks for sharing. Still, it strikes me that in the face of the fact that, as you say, a CCB might be so bad so as to cause one to lose interest, and that even if a relatively good one that one would want to upgrade within a year, there would be precious few circumstances under which one would "need" to get a CCB to get started. With such associated risk, better to wait to save up or try to rent/borrow something better.

[topbop]

It may cost more than a couple of beers but for not too much $$$'s one of the guy's at the shop might go along and provide a professional assessment?

Just my 2 cents...

Good luck!
Robert

Originally Posted by edmidlifecrisis

Thanks for the great replies, all. You guys are terrific. This is why TB is my #1 favorite forum.

The only problem is that I don't know anyone who plays DB!! The one at our class, he's self taught, and a beginner at DB. However, I think that I probably can make a reasonable decision myself if I see it and hear it. And if he returns my call/email, which so far he has not. I will call him tonight and see what happens.

We have a good shop in the area that sells/repairs violins through DB's exclusively, they recently restored and upgraded a handmade violin that my wife owns and seem very knowledgeable and competent. However they are in the complete opposite direction from this guy, a heck of a long haul...But if I buy it I will take it to them.

Stay tuned.