DB newb, Is it worth it?

anomalybass · #1 05-23-2006, 01:43 PM

I just recieved a used stand up from kstate. I didn't purchase the bass but will be using it for the summer. The first thing I noticed is it is plywood and the plys are peeling off of the edges in small chunks. There is a large spot on the side where the top has completely seperated from the side. At least a foot. It has old ass strings I obviousle need to change, and lastly I noticed the strings arent even with the neck. The e has a 1/4 gap and the g has almost an inch. Do most standups have floating bridges? Does it need to be adjusted to play right? Should I attempt to adjust it if it is a floating bridge? I'm sorry about the long post I probably could have ran a search on. This isn't my bass, I don't want to take the chance running a search and getting the wrong info because I don't know enough about standups. Should I attempt to glue/clamp the top back to the side? I know enough about woodworking to do it , I just want to get your opinion before I do anything. thanks -joe p

anomalybass · #2 05-23-2006, 01:46 PM

Also, considering the work it needs, what do you think it is worth? It is a cheap bass to begin with. Is it worth buying if they want to sell it. I'm new to this and don't want to spend alot. thanks, joe

Steve Killingsworth · #3 05-23-2006, 02:00 PM

Based on what you have posted, I think you would be much better off to rent a bass for the summer than to attempt to practice on a poorly setup, crumbling instrument. And absolutely, positively do not attempt repair yourself unless you can live with the very distinct possibility of ruining the bass. Repairing or setting up a bass ain't like dusting crops boy. I have worked in carpentry/cabinetry for over 25 years and I would never try to repair a bass I wanted to use.

If you would fill out your profile, someone on the board might recommend something in your area.

anomalybass · #4 05-23-2006, 02:13 PM

Thank you very much. I am from wichita kansas. I am an electric player. I have never played a standup but have always wanted to. That is why I borrowed this bass. I guess my only concern is if it would be worth it to buy the bass . I will not be tinkering with this bass. That is precisely why I posted. Thank you for the warning. -joe

Whit Townsend · #5 05-23-2006, 02:18 PM

<<<<<<Repairing or setting up a bass ain't like dusting crops boy.>>>>

That for sure. No power lines in sight. A whole lot less dangerous that dusting crops.

<<<I have worked in carpentry/cabinetry for over 25 years and I would never try to repair a bass I wanted to use.>>>>
If you've been around the dang thing for very long, then dosn't sound like you the confident type, so I don't think I'd want one of your cabinets either.

Sounds like the school don't care about the dang bass or you either.
Glue the dang thing back together best you can, adjust the action using common sense and see how it does. If your sucessful, you aint out a dime and you can afford some strings.

anomalybass · #6 05-23-2006, 02:24 PM

Floating bridge? Obviously I need to loosen the strings to adjust the bridge. Right? Or am I completely confused and just need to take it to the repair shop?-joe

drurb · #7 05-23-2006, 02:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by anomalybass

I guess my only concern is if it would be worth it to buy the bass. -joe

For how much? Gee, if you could buy it for $250 and have a luthier repair it and set it up properly, it MIGHT be worth it depending on the quality of the instrument which, to us, is unknown. Generally, given what you describe, it sounds like the answer is likely to be, "No, it is not worth it."

One thing is for sure. A poorly set-up instrument will frustrate your efforts and may even result in injury.

Whit Townsend · #8 05-23-2006, 02:37 PM

Well, if you don't understand how the bridge stays on, where its supposed to go, and have never fooled around with setting up a fiddle or a mandolin even, then you are probably not competent to mess with it. Disregard my previous post and get the to a luthier.

Steve Killingsworth · #9 05-23-2006, 02:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Whit Townsend

<<<<<<Repairing or setting up a bass ain't like dusting crops boy.>>>>

That for sure. No power lines in sight. A whole lot less dangerous that dusting crops.

Evidently my obscure Star Wars quote was wasted.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Whit Townsend

If you've been around the dang thing for very long, then dosn't sound like you the confident type, so I don't think I'd want one of your cabinets either.

Dang it! Another lost sale!

Anomaly, before you decide on Whit's John Wayne approach or follow my girlyman advice, spend some time reading the newbie links at the top of the forum. There is enough info there to keep you busy for a while and when finished, you will be much better informed than you are now.

anomalybass · #10 05-23-2006, 03:19 PM

I am looking for specific answers. I have done alot of work and repair on electric basses, acoustic bass guitars and guitars. I realize this is a whole different monster, but i'm not a complete stranger to repairs. It looks like the bridge is about half an inch farther to the left than it needs to be even with the frettboard. Does this matter? If the bridge isn't glued to the body is it that hard to loosen the strings and move it over? Is using wood glue and clamps going to work to repair the seperation on the side? If this isn't as easy as it looks does anyone know why? I'm not trying to be an *******, and I do appreciate the info, I just want reasons not just warnings. -joe

ToR-Tu-Ra · #11 05-23-2006, 03:25 PM

Yay! Seems I got the chance to be the first one to take a bite outta this one, so here it goes:

WHAT FRETBOARD?

And about your question. Yes, the bridge should be centered, usually the nothces on the F holes serve as a guide. But there's more than that to the setup. The bridge has a close relation to the soundpost. Take a look inside the G string side F hole, there should be a wooden rod around there.

anomalybass · #12 05-23-2006, 04:04 PM

Thank you. And yes...fingerboard.

TroyK · #13 05-23-2006, 04:27 PM

And we really prefer "doublebass" or "contrabass".

You didn't say why they loaned you the bass. If you're thinking about majoring in it and you are not sure, then maybe it is worth it for the summer to find out if it is for you. You can probably center the bridge, it won't be glued on, but there are a number of other things that you shouldn't do, like gluing the top. Find a luthier and get an estimate. Setting the soundpost (ditto). Checking the bass bar (ditto).

I would find a luthier, preferably not at a music store if you can help it, explain to them who you are and where the bass came from and ask them if they can make it playable for you for the summer. Consider their estimate and then decide. You can probably rent a properly set up bass for around $50/mo in Kansas. So, 3 months in the summer, that's about $150 worth of repairs. If you think you could like the bass and wanted to find one to buy, can repair it for the cost of a rental and buy it for a few hundred, then it's worth it. You'll out grow it fairly quickly, but can always sell a functional bass for under $1,000 and you should be able to get your money back.

If it costs you more to fix than to rent, I wouldn't do it. As your total repair/purchase combined cost approaches a grand, I'd walk away. Functional basses from shops start at around $1,800. There are crappy ones that need work to be had for closer to $1,000 most places if you look.

The repairs you need sound serious, but don't judge a bass by it's cosmetic condition. There are some great basses that look like crap. Look for a label on the inside and tell us what it says, it would be helpful to us.

Hope that helps.

Troy

anomalybass · #14 05-23-2006, 04:41 PM

That's all I needed. Thank you. -joe

Whit Townsend · #15 05-23-2006, 04:43 PM

Loosen the strings about 1/2 tension and
Put the bridge between the f hole notches.
Careful you don't let the bass bar(woops edit here: SOUNDPOST) drop, or you'll have to improvise a way to stand it back up! Aint easy but it can be done. I've done it with some cooking tongs and a coathanger or two, but you don't wanna go there if you can help it.
You may have to wedge the top of the bridge back vertical as you tighten up the strings. Align it with the fingerboard by sighting down from the peghead.
If it pulls back off center, check the tailpiece assembly and make sure everything is squared up.
The soundpost should sit very close or just behind the treble side bridge foot.
On gluing:
You're supposed to use hide glue (the powdered kind you mix yourself) cause it can be undone easily, but if you don't care, use wood glue and a big old clamp, future real luthiers working on it will hate you, but will they waste their time on it anyway? Probably not.
I have glued little flecks of laminate back on my old kay with superglue, but if you get it on the surface, it'll dry cloudy.
Stewart McDonald sells powdered hide glue.
They also sell a super glue that dries clear, but its expensive.
I'd keep the old strings on till I go it playable.
On my bass my strings hts measured at the end of the fingerboard are roughly
G around 6-7 cm
D,A,E around 9-10 cm

I'd call that a high action. I'd start with that you may can go lower depending on the condition of the fingerboard, but that'd be a good starting point.
If you have to cut down the bridge top,use a long straight edge to shoot a curved line for reference on the bridge from the end of the fingerboard. Mark the above hts at the appropraite locations, draw in the curve, and sand it down with a dremel tool (take it off first! don't loose that soundpost!). I cut my string slots in the bridge with a very sharp pocket knfe, and rounded them with a small round file. I'd let about 1/2 the string sit above the top of the bridge. You want an an edge to the bridge but not a real sharp one. round off the top a little. Work slowly, can't put wood back on.

String ht at the nut should be as low as it'll go before it buzzes, about the thickness of a business card, or just a hair more. I used a small round file from Lowes to do mine. If you work on this end go slow and be careful, can't put material back on.

It ain't rocket science, but you do have to have an understanding of how the thing is put together. Read all you can here on the stickys, observe the way the thing is put together carefully, go slowly, think things through logically and use common sense and you'll do fine.

Whit Townsend · #16 05-23-2006, 04:50 PM

<<<<And we really prefer "doublebass" or "contrabass".>>>>>
Some folks are picky that way. Call it a doublebass, contrabass, bass fiddle, doghouse, stand up, upright, or just plain bass is fine with me. Just don't call it "that thar big geetar" and your ok with me.

arnoldschnitzer · #17 05-23-2006, 04:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Whit Townsend

Careful you don't let the bass bar drop, or you'll have to improvise a way to stand it back up!

And those dropping bass bars make a horrific sound!

Whit Townsend · #18 05-23-2006, 04:55 PM

Excuse goofy me, I ment to say soundpost not bass bar!
I'l edit, thanks.

anomalybass · #19 05-23-2006, 05:57 PM

The bridge is already on the lowest setting for action. Should I leave it there since it's not buzzing, or will raising it improve overall sound/playability? I'm at work now, but when I get home I will look and see who made the bass. You guys can tell me if it's even worth fixing. Is it possible/worth it to refurbish a contrabass to it's origional condition if it was a cheap bass to begin with?-joe p

TroyK · #20 05-23-2006, 06:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by anomalybass

Is it possible/worth it to refurbish a CONTRABASS to it's origional condition...

atta boy!

By the way, I wouldn't screw with the bridge height at this point. Just center it. Increasing height will increase tension on the top and based on the description you gave, that may not be a good idea. Bigger fish to fry right now.