Interesting eBay Bass?

[wilsonn]

http://cgi.ebay.com/Early-Bass-Violi...QQcmdZViewItem

http://users.zoominternet.net/~buyold/violin1.jpg

Saw this this morning on eBay. Not much information to go on, but three interesting pictures. Any ideas on what they have here? Anyone close enough to look at it in person?

Neal Wilson

[KSB - Ken Smith]

Originally Posted by wilsonn

http://cgi.ebay.com/Early-Bass-Violi...QQcmdZViewItem

http://users.zoominternet.net/~buyold/violin1.jpg

Saw this this morning on eBay. Not much information to go on, but three interesting pictures. Any ideas on what they have here? Anyone close enough to look at it in person?

Neal Wilson

Junk German/Czech Shop Bass.. early 20th century. Will cost as much or more to repair it correctly than it is worth.

[wilsonn]

It's great to have a forum where's such a knowledge base. Thanks for the post and steering me clear of a disaster.
Neal

[Mike Goodbar]

I'm always wary of e-bay ads that describe the height of the bass (Stands 6' tall!).

[Benton]

What a shame to call it junk. I can see making a fiberglass Roth ino a planter but this seems as if it could be given a second life. The bass may not be a priceless relic but their are many similar basses working, making music today and for years to come. Their are obvious cosmetic issues but structuraly it looks to be servicable. I see some small cracks but that is not uncommon. The top looks to have it original shape and is not cracked around the critical bass bar area. The neck appears to be in place and has a nice thick fingerboard. The finish is obviosly shot and there are a number of chips. I think that this may never be worthy of Kens collection but could certainly be brought back to life. The buyer must beware and ready for a considerable invesment and risk. I just can't see throwing it out as junk. If I found it in the trash I would make certain it was brought back and taken for a walk.
Peace
Benton

[KSB - Ken Smith]

Originally Posted by Benton

What a shame to call it junk. I can see making a fiberglass Roth ino a planter but this seems as if it could be given a second life. The bass may not be a priceless relic but their are many similar basses working, making music today and for years to come. Their are obvious cosmetic issues but structuraly it looks to be servicable. I see some small cracks but that is not uncommon. The top looks to have it original shape and is not cracked around the critical bass bar area. The neck appears to be in place and has a nice thick fingerboard. The finish is obviosly shot and there are a number of chips. I think that this may never be worthy of Kens collection but could certainly be brought back to life. The buyer must beware and ready for a considerable invesment and risk. I just can't see throwing it out as junk. If I found it in the trash I would make certain it was brought back and taken for a walk.
Peace
Benton

I didnt' say to throw it out. I did say however that repairing it is possibly more costly that it is worth. Therefor, don't buy or bid on it was my advice.
The Bass has some long top cracks on the bottom part of the Bass under the FF holes and may have more once it is taken apart to be repaired.
In this Pic, blown up, http://users.zoominternet.net/~buyold/violin2.jpg .. I see a huge nasty sound post crack from the saddle up past the bridge and up to the Neck/shoulder with several horizontal and verticle patches of wood inlayed in the Top under the current touched up finish. This is a disaster for a bass. Even if it was a regular crack there, it could be fixed if the wood was still original and not loose too much value.

I have seen 100s or Basses in dis-repair. Here on TB I have also voiced opinions of projects and each time the buyer went against my better judgement, he found out the hard and expensive way.

It costs just as much to repair Cracks in a Testore or Prescott if done correctly. Why spent 10k on a Bass worth only 3-5k on it's best day.

Sure, you can buy this Bass and make it servicable but why would you take the risk knowing how much visible damage already exhists?

Have you ever seen an old house or Building torn down to build another in it's place? That is because it is cheaper to build a new one on the property than fix the old one.

Spend your time and money wisely. Walk away from deals that seem like YOU are making out on the deal. People usually know what they have and do better on their end than you do on yours. There is a reason they put it up on Ebay. Often no one that actually sees it in person will buy it.

[KSB - Ken Smith]

Did you see this blown up?.. http://users.zoominternet.net/~buyold/violin5.jpg

The Scroll is Screwed in at the Nut. Does it need a Graft Repair, more screws, some more glue, new neck?

Who knows.. It's a can o worms!

It is just a Factory shop Bass in bad condition. I have seen worse and if it was my Bass, I would probably fix it or sell it but I would never buy a Bass in that condition.


Or, buy the Bass, a Gallon of Glue, bucket of nails n screws, a couple of strings to match the ones there and what ever else it need and have fun. Wear a hard hat just incae it explodes when your playing it..lol

Oops.. never mind the Strings.. I see it has 4 of them hangin out of the pegbox already!

[Benton]

I agree that the bass is a big risk and the buyer should be warned. I don't think the top has recangular patches rather tape that has preserved the finish underneath. I dont see deformation of the top that would definatly spell big $$. I know that 10k could probably be spent on it but it might be made playable for less. I think that a closer look would be needed before buying. I just hated to see it dismissed in a word "junk". Ebay is a smart option for the seller because it has us talking about it discussing its value. I'm sure the junck is worth something. In the time we have been talking it just doubled in value. Oh yeah I'm not buying it the risk is to much for me.
Peace
Benton

[drurb]

Originally Posted by Benton

I agree that the bass is a big risk and the buyer should be warned. I don't think the top has recangular patches rather tape that has preserved the finish underneath. I dont see deformation of the top that would definatly spell big $$. I know that 10k could probably be spent on it but it might be made playable for less. I think that a closer look would be needed before buying. I just hated to see it dismissed in a word "junk". Ebay is a smart option for the seller because it has us talking about it discussing its value. I'm sure the junck is worth something. In the time we have been talking it just doubled in value. Oh yeah I'm not buying it the risk is to much for me.
Peace
Benton

The bid may have doubled but the "value" as could be assessed by a pro stayed quite constant. The point, I believe, is to have a playable bass and not a planter. This all seems much talk to no avail. I consider Ken's advice well-informed and solid. Why in the world would one start in with this when PROPER repairs would cost more than the instrument would be worth? Yeah, maybe it would cost less than $10k to bring it back to life. Still, at half that it seems a bad deal! Take that money, save your time, and buy what could be a better bass from a reputable dealer who'll provide a proper setup. That's the best advice one could give to a potential bidder on this nightmare and that's what Ken is saying. In other words, walk away-- end of story.

[ToR-Tu-Ra]

http://users.zoominternet.net/~buyold/violin5.jpg

Is that a gut D string? That thing's gotta be old! Do you think he'd sell just that string? Any guesses for the other rusty strings?

[Don Higdon]

It is junk.
Sue me.

[JimmyM]

LOL...Benton is trying to say that this bass shouldn't be dismissed as junk, then says he's not going to bid on it because it's too big a risk. What a ringing endorsement!

I love the internet!

[KSB - Ken Smith]

Originally Posted by JimmyM

LOL...Benton is trying to say that this bass shouldn't be dismissed as junk, then says he's not going to bid on it because it's too big a risk. What a ringing endorsement!

I love the internet!

Ok, actually the point is this; For $10,000.oo you can have a nicely restored $5,000.oo Bass! I don't think you can write off your taxes 5k for making a donation to the 'Church or Temple of Bass'!

Other than that, it's one of about 20,000 Basses just like it that may be in better or worse condition in and out of service.

Ever drivin by an Auto Junk Yard? Gee, why didn't they save all those Cars?

[Benton]

I just hope the bass is brought back to life. Ken metions houses that are torn down and car to tthe Junkyard. My Brother has made a hundreds of thousands off houses that other thought were junk, He's on his was to Peuto Rico tomorrow for vacation. I have seen Ford Model A farm Truck that sat in a field for 30 years or more (a rusted heap) bought for 3000$ for restoration. But this bass is "junk"? I have seen a Kay with a destroyed neck and that was stripped with a disc sander semi-restored. (I didn't think that one was worth it.)
If you have to ask us about the bass then it is not for for you. If it were mine I would have it fixed but alas I already have a bass and don't have expendable cash to gamble with. So go on throw your stones it's real easy to dismis it and cast it off as trash. I will watch the bidding and hope that someone gets it who has the knowledge and will to bring it back. I just love those old Basses even if they don't have the pedigree.
Peace Benton

[drurb]

Originally Posted by Benton

I just hope the bass is brought back to life. Ken metions houses that are torn down and car to tthe Junkyard. My Brother has made a hundreds of thousands off houses that other thought were junk, He's on his was to Peuto Rico tomorrow for vacation. I have seen Ford Model A farm Truck that sat in a field for 30 years or more (a rusted heap) bought for 3000$ for restoration. But this bass is "junk"? I have seen a Kay with a destroyed neck and that was stripped with a disc sander semi-restored. (I didn't think that one was worth it.)
If you have to ask us about the bass then it is not for for you. If it were mine I would have it fixed but alas I already have a bass and don't have expendable cash to gamble with. So go on throw your stones it's real easy to dismis it and cast it off as trash. I will watch the bidding and hope that someone gets it who has the knowledge and will to bring it back. I just love those old Basses even if they don't have the pedigree.
Peace Benton

Interesting. Now, with regard to those houses and the Model A farm truck, it seems that the individuals who purchased them did not lose money on them. You say your brother made hundreds of thousands. That is, after restoration, the possessions were not worth less than the cost to restore them.

Sure, if you can do the work yourself, many items that could and should be classified as junk can make you some $$$. That was not the issue here, though. Ken was wisely advising that a buyer who would have to pay to have the bass restored properly should steer clear of it.

[KSB - Ken Smith]

Here is a small list of Basses I have recently had restored as well as 2 that are still in restoration. The costs of these range from 8k to 15k to restore and each Bass is well worth the total of the cost and repairs after completion. The 5er and Morelli were closer to it's total value than the Prescott or Mystery Bass but still, I had a clue about costs and values going into this; http://www.kensmithbasses.com/Double...tt_preview.htm
http://www.kensmithbasses.com/Double...orelliBass.htm
http://www.kensmithbasses.com/Double..._that_bass.htm
http://www.kensmithbasses.com/Double.../Hungarian.htm

This Bass as well is going under the knife soon but mostly costemic stuff. Still, it will run 4-6k for the job. I knew this b4 making the purchase; http://www.kensmithbasses.com/Double...GilkesBass.htm

This one just got about $1,000. of clean-up work done to it; http://www.kensmithbasses.com/Double...d/DoddBass.htm

And this one needs about 5k to do it up nicely but is playable as-is for the moment as I have already done two Chamber Music concerts with the Bass and it worked great and people loved the sound. Still, when I get the time, it will be cleaned up a bit; http://www.kensmithbasses.com/Double...eri/Loveri.htm

This one came form Italy and I set it up and used it the same week. Still, I put over 5k to get it where it is now and do not regret a penny of the money spent to fix it up nicely; http://www.kensmithbasses.com/Double...ini_bass_2.htm

So you see, fixing and selling could be profitable if you know what you are doing. If not, be prepared to loose money if and when you sell the Bass.