Kay Bass

[was3funk]

Hi All,

I'm planning on purchasing a '62 Kay M-1 in excellent all original condition. The only work I would need to do is replace the original bridge which is cracked and put new strings on it so maybe drop $300-400 additional. The owner wants $2K for it. Do you think this is in the ballpark for a Kay Bass or should I negotiate the price down some?

Also, could anyone recommend strings for the bass. I was thinking Thomastik Spirocore Double Bass Strings, would they be a good option?

Much Thanks,

Bill

[bilco]

Originally Posted by was3funk

Hi All,

I'm planning on purchasing a '62 Kay M-1 in excellent all original condition. The only work I would need to do is replace the original bridge which is cracked and put new strings on it so maybe drop $300-400 additional. The owner wants $2K for it. Do you think this is in the ballpark for a Kay Bass or should I negotiate the price down some?

Also, could anyone recommend strings for the bass. I was thinking Thomastik Spirocore Double Bass Strings, would they be a good option?

Much Thanks,

Bill

That price is definitely in the range of the Kays that are listed at FretwellBass.com. If it is in really good shape, I guess it's a really good deal. I'm still trying to get over the shock of uprights costing so much. You used to be able to pick up a Kay for $500 all the time, of course that was back in the '80s......

I have the Thomastik Spirocore Weich on my upright and I like them. For a newbie to upright, they feel very similar to the Thomastik Jazz Flats I have on my Pbass. They aren't too rough on your hands and from what folks have said, they last a long time.

I put on some used Eurosonic Lights that my bass teacher loaned me and I did not like them. To me they sounded like plastic and the gauge was way larger than the Spirocores. I do have to say they had low tension and the sound of them slapping the fingerboard is not as harsh as the Spiros. I tried them for 2 days, but took them back off and put on the Spirocores again. I think I will stay with them.

I have only been playing upright for a month, so take everything I say with a block of salt...

Bill Colbert

[Pcocobass]

Hey man, you should check out the finerboard and see if it needs a new one. If the bass has the original fingerboard on it, it most likely will need to be replaced. This costs roughly $1000, so you can use that to possibly negotiate the price.

I love my Kay; I wouldn't sell it for the world. It is an amazing instrument, but I did have the finerboard and bridge replaced. I also use Spiro Weichs, and I'm very happy with them for pizz/jazz playing.

Hope this helps.
Pete

[drurb]

Originally Posted by was3funk

Hi All,

I'm planning on purchasing a '62 Kay M-1 in excellent all original condition. The only work I would need to do is replace the original bridge which is cracked and put new strings on it so maybe drop $300-400 additional. The owner wants $2K for it. Do you think this is in the ballpark for a Kay Bass or should I negotiate the price down some?

Also, could anyone recommend strings for the bass. I was thinking Thomastik Spirocore Double Bass Strings, would they be a good option?

Much Thanks,

Bill

That seems to be the price for which Kays are going as collectibles. You should know (you may already) that you can acquire a far superior instrument for that kind of money. I had a 1967 Kay from 1967 through about 2002.

[Jeff Bollbach]

Originally Posted by drurb

That seems to be the price for which Kays are going as collectibles. You should know (you may already) that you can acquire a far superior instrument for that kind of money. I had a 1967 Kay from 1967 through about 2002.

I'm gonna have to go ahead and disagree with this,[which is against my self-interest as I can sell you a new Shen which is a fine instrument and I can't easily find an old Kay] I have seen many a Kay that had a vibe and sound that I can only attribute to age and it is something you generally don't see in new basses.

[Gufenov]

Originally Posted by Jeff Bollbach

I'm gonna have to go ahead and disagree with this,[which is against my self-interest as I can sell you a new Shen which is a fine instrument and I can't easily find an old Kay] I have seen many a Kay that had a vibe and sound that I can only attribute to age and it is something you generally don't see in new basses.

+1 SCRUB never misses an opportunity to run down Kays and Engelhardts.

[Pcocobass]

Originally Posted by Jeff Bollbach

I'm gonna have to go ahead and disagree with this,[which is against my self-interest as I can sell you a new Shen which is a fine instrument and I can't easily find an old Kay] I have seen many a Kay that had a vibe and sound that I can only attribute to age and it is something you generally don't see in new basses.

Hey Jeff can I assume you might be thinking of my Kay.....?

[Jeff Bollbach]

Originally Posted by Pcocobass

Hey Jeff can I assume you might be thinking of my Kay.....?

Ahh,,Yeah Baby!

[armybass]

There are lots of folks here who have negative opinions of Kay's and Englehardts but there are just as many of us who think they are great basses and can be really good instruments for the money.

You could start a thread about how your Kay jumped in front of you and took a bullet that had your name on it and someone will post about how another bass would have done it better

[drurb]

Originally Posted by Jeff Bollbach

I'm gonna have to go ahead and disagree with this,[which is against my self-interest as I can sell you a new Shen which is a fine instrument and I can't easily find an old Kay] I have seen many a Kay that had a vibe and sound that I can only attribute to age and it is something you generally don't see in new basses.

Having owned one of those Kays, I know of what I speak and I truly respect that you do as well, especially given your overwhelming qualifications. My Kay was 35 years old when I sold it. Yes, it had that vibe in spades! I have often said in these threads that, if you are after that specific "Kay" sound that seems so perfect for certain genres of music, then go for it. On the other hand, for all other genres (that is, most genres), it is my opinion that a double bass that conforms more closely to what are the typical ideals for the instrument would be more fitting.

This is my opinion. If a student of jazz or classical music had $2-3k to spend, there is no way I would recommend a Kay of any vintage. For that money, one can often find a good hybrid. The day I hear any Kay approach the sound of a good hybrid, I will be happy to admit I was wrong. It hasn't happened yet.

Then there are the other laminates that are available. Again, for that money, some of the new laminates I have heard and played and which have been discussed many times in these pages, surpass in all relevant respects any Kay I have heard or played.

Then there is the skinny Kay neck...

Yes, this all comes down to personal opinion. To each his own.

[Pcocobass]

Originally Posted by drurb

This is my opinion. If a student of jazz or classical music had $2-3k to spend, there is no way I would recommend a Kay of any vintage. Then there is the skinny Kay neck...

Gotta disagree; my Kay has an incredible jazz sound - warm, rich, lots of sustain. I've used it for recording and gigging exclusively. Hey, I love that neck!

Originally Posted by drurb

Yes, this all comes down to personal opinion. To each his own.

We'll agree to disagree....

[drurb]

Originally Posted by Pcocobass

We'll agree to disagree....

Cool! That's what makes this a fun place. At least folks can read opposing and respectful opinions. In the end, it's one's own ears and hands that count. By the way, the Kay I had (and it was all I could afford) served me just fine for classical, bluegrass, and jazz. Despite my opinions, there is, deep-down, a love for them!

[was3funk]

Thanks for all the input. I had to drive 5 hours, but I picked it up today for $1800. Can't wait till I get the bass set up with some new strings.

-Bill

[armybass]

Looks great man. I am jealous!

[Jake deVilliers]

That's a nice looking bass was3. A great colour.

It will probably sound a little stronger when you get the bridge back down where it belongs.

[Pcocobass]

Congrats man, she's a beaut!

[klocwerk]

That's a sweet Kay!
I just put Obligato's on my Kay, they sound fantastic! They were recommended by a few other Kay owners, and do in fact seem to work really well with the plywood kays.
Just my two cents.

Oh, and I know people like to trash Kays, but when i got mine I A/Bed it with all the other basses in the luthier's shop (he was a restoration guy) that cost under $3k, and it blew them all away, including a carved Czech bass and a few other "better" basses.
The sound was quite simply far superior.

[Pcocobass]

Originally Posted by klocwerk

Oh, and I know people like to trash Kays, but when i got mine I A/Bed it with all the other basses in the luthier's shop (he was a restoration guy) that cost under $3k, and it blew them all away, including a carved Czech bass and a few other "better" basses.
The sound was quite simply far superior.

I had a similar experience while checking out basses that were even higher priced, all carved. I couldn't find one that had a better sound, imo.

[Bob Branstetter]

Despite what proponents and opponents have to say about Kay basses, Kays are like most basses. There are some that are very good, some that are very bad and the rest are somewhere in between. It doesn't seem to make any difference whether the model is an M1, C1, or any other model (3/4 size). If you have one of the good ones, keep it. If it isn't, get something better as soon as you can afford it.

[drurb]

Originally Posted by Bob Branstetter

Despite what proponents and opponents have to say about Kay basses, Kays are like most basses. There are some that are very good, some that are very bad and the rest are somewhere in between. It doesn't seem to make any difference whether the model is an M1, C1, or any other model (3/4 size). If you have one of the good ones, keep it. If it isn't, get something better as soon as you can afford it.

I wonder what produces substantial variances across mass-produced ply basses of a common brand and type. I can easily imagine factors that would produce such differences in carved basses even of the same brand and design (individual quality of wood, grain, graduation, etc.)

Furthermore, assuming that set-up is not a factor, the only way I can understand the preference of a Kay over a carved bass is if:

1) The carved bass is relatively poor in that it does not produce the complexity of tone typical of even a decent carved bass

2) The individual simply prefers the sonic characteristics typical of a ply bass

3) 1 & 2

No judgments here, just trying to understand. I think a great deal is wrapped up in personal preference and the sound one is seeking for the music one is playing.