King Bass?

powerbass · #1 01-26-2009, 06:13 PM

I want to take up the DB and someone offered to sell me a 1934 King bass. I haven't seen it yet but the fellow is a local jazz player who likes old american basses and has a few. This one he wants to part with. I did a little research on the internet about them. Does anyone have experience w/these instruments? Assuming it is in decent/playable shape what would the value be of such a bass? Any advice is appreciated

CalebWilson · #2 01-26-2009, 10:29 PM

Well, I dunno the brand, but one tip. If it's "solid top", it should sound very nice and be worth quite a bit, because "solid top" basses sound better over time, and this one has had a lot of time.

If it's a "laminate", it will probably sound similar to the day it was made. And it won't be worth quite as much as a 74 year old solid top.

@everyone else: Did they even have laminate back in the 30s?

Jake deVilliers · #3 01-26-2009, 11:29 PM

Hey Powerbass, those old King Moretones are great basses. Use the Search function to find lots of prior discussion on these pages. :

http://www.hnwhite.com/string%20page.htm

Gearhead43 · #4 01-27-2009, 12:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CalebWilson

Well, I dunno the brand, but one tip. If it's "solid top", it should sound very nice and be worth quite a bit, because "solid top" basses sound better over time, and this one has had a lot of time.

If it's a "laminate", it will probably sound similar to the day it was made. And it won't be worth quite as much as a 74 year old solid top.

@everyone else: Did they even have laminate back in the 30s?

Steve Swan · #5 01-27-2009, 07:10 AM

The King Moretone basses along with the American Standard models are some of my favorite domestically made factory instruments. You are on to something really nice. Congratulations!

Tejano Bass · #6 01-27-2009, 09:01 AM

powerbass - - listen to Jake & Steve - they are both professionals who sell and/or repair basses - they know of what they speakl!

Whereas for Caleb:

Quote:

Well, I dunno the brand, but . . . & . . . Did they even have laminate back in the 30s?

I must agree with gearhead43 -

Even I know (with my relatively limited knowledge/experience when compared to Jake & Steve), that a '34 King would be highly regarded in the both the bluegrass & jazz genres - possibly even more especially by some player/collectors given it's condition/sound.

Phil Rowan · #7 01-27-2009, 09:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CalebWilson

@everyone else: Did they even have laminate back in the 30s?

American Standard's 1st year of production: 1936
King Bass': 1934
Kay Bass: 1937

Hey Powerbass, good for you man! I've played a few old King Moretones and was impressed with their sound and playability.

Gearhead43 · #8 01-27-2009, 09:19 AM

A friend of mine has one, it was by far the loudest ply bass I have ever heard or played. (had a great setup too) It literally rattled the windows acoustically.

Great craftsmanship and elegant looking also. Seemed to have a more complex midrange voice than alot of ply basses also.

I still often wonder what exactly made the HN White basses a cut above their peers.

Phil Rowan · #9 01-27-2009, 09:31 AM

If I had a Kay, a King and an American Standard side by side I might be able to confirm this.. but I think the plywood on HN White basses is thinner that that of Kays, which I think would make for a louder and boomier bass (one of the Moretones I played, which I've mentioned several times on TB, had a BIG sound to fill up the whole room).

MollyKay · #10 01-27-2009, 10:49 AM

I can only speak from what we own…but my 1935 King Bass has a thick top and a huge neck…it is a really heavy bass too…but has a low end boom that is great for bluegrass. I bought it site un-seen thinking it was a carved top bass. The top on this bass is unlike any other top on a Kay, AS or Epi I have. I read somewhere King was some of the first laminated basses and they may have had a few imported from Germany…if I had to guess I think mine might be one of those basses. It is built like tank. If you ever want to do a side by side comparison let me know…I got one of every flavor.

jtlownds · #11 01-27-2009, 11:42 AM

I had a 39 King Moretone. The top was pretty thin on that one as was the neck. It was one of the best sounding laminates that I have ever heard. IMHO they sound much better than the American Standards. Many of the older ones have had the "D" tuner broken off. If you can live with the 43.5 inch string length, and it's in good shape, I would go for it.

Gearhead43 · #12 01-27-2009, 11:47 AM

I did read that the earliest Kings were actually imported from a maker in Germany.

I suppose maybe the later and more common US made Kings were the ones with the thinner tops & necks.

Jake deVilliers · #13 01-27-2009, 01:59 PM

Hey Molly, why don't you slip a digital caliper in the f-holes and give us a measurement on that King top?

tomshepp · #14 01-27-2009, 02:07 PM

I played on one at a bass shop in my neck of the woods awhile back. It was in poor condition and the action was a mile high. It was amazingly loud.

MollyKay · #15 01-27-2009, 04:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jake deVilliers

Hey Molly, why don't you slip a digital caliper in the f-holes and give us a measurement on that King top?

For you Jake...anything...except we don't have a digital caliper...we are old school (no batteries required, you need to read a ruler)...but here you go anyway!

These measurements are all from the G side F hole at the notches with an old school caliper from the 1970's.

1935 King 5/16"
1937 AS 3/16"
1937 Kay 5/32"
1939 Epi B-1 3/16"
1939 Epi B-2 7/32"

Yeah baby the King bass is thick...5/16" is NOT a mistake. The Bass Monkey re-measured three times.

Gearhead43 · #16 01-27-2009, 04:29 PM

Now we need someone with a later year King to get a top thickness measurement to compare.

5/16"? Wow. That's huge.

I bet they went to the 3/16" later, like the AS bass you have listed.

Supposedly it was only the first couple years that they imported basses, then they started making them in house.

I love learning about this stuff, love the old American ply basses.

Gearhead43 · #17 01-27-2009, 05:54 PM

Just got a message back from my friend who has a 1944 King Moretone.

His measurement of the top thickness at the G side ff-hole notch is 7/32".

reedj · #18 01-27-2009, 06:03 PM

I don't know if my response will be of any assistance, but in my experience, in the world of American-made plywood basses, the basses manufactured by H.N. White are significantly better than their contemporaries. The quality of tone and manufacture seems so much higher than Kays or even Epiphones. I have owned Kay basses, Epiphones, and American Standards, and I have played many Kings. I find the Standards and Kings to be superior to other American plywoods. Put simply, go for the 1934 King. Being their first year of production and the fact that it is what it is, this is a desirable bass, and I really doubt you will be disappointed if you go with it. If it doesn't work out between you and the King, pm me!

Steve Swan · #19 01-28-2009, 07:54 AM

I hadn't heard about the very first King Moretone basses being imported. That is good info. The 1938 American Standard that I had last fall was really light for a plywood instrument, like a big eggshell with a handle. Once it got an ebony board and a good setup, it was monster for pizz.

Definitely let us know about top thickness and neck dimensions when you get it in!

MollyKay · #20 01-28-2009, 11:53 AM

I stand corrected...here is what the King website (hoted by Kip Martin) stated about some of the early King basses...

Note: There is mounting evidence to support the theory that there were some Kings and built in Europe. Chris Charvatt, historian for the H.N. White family believes this may be a possibility. Substantiating this theory is extremely difficult, but the existence of tags glued inside basses with foreign imprints seems to indicate that this could have been the case for a short time, probably in the very early days of the King production effort.