Laminated Wilfer Vs. Carved Eberle

[MCML]

Assuming that the cost was the same, which would you rather have - a fully carved Eberle (maple sides and back with spruce top) or a laminated Wilfer (laminated maple sides and back with laminated spruce top)?

[Silversorcerer]

The fully carved Eberle will probably be the best in the long run. Laminated Wilfers are good no doubt, but I think the only reason the Eberle is much less than a carved Wilfer is the economics of origin. Other opinions may differ of course.

[wineaux]

If this is my only choice, I'd take the laminate, but for purely practical reasons. I'm mostly a bluegrasser, so the bass is probably going to spend a fair amount of time outside and going to and from gigs and jams. The laminate will hold up better in the long run under those conditions.

In a perfect world, of course, I'd win the lottery and have one of each, plus a whole lot more!

[jisbass]

Are you referring to the basses from bassesonline? I should have tried the basses when I was in the store couple of months ago, but I was there to buy a violin for my niece, and I was focusing on that. great place to shop, very nice people. I thought all they had were things on the website, but they have a wearhouse full of all kinds of stuff like bows, bridges, fingerboards, strings, wheels, etc etc.

Anyway, I don't know what your musical goals are, but the carved bass is probably gonna be better in the long run. Carved will sound better when bowed, and depending on what sound you want, it may sound better pizzed as well. Only thing better about the ply Wilfer is probably the finish, and the name (and may be construction, but don't know). But like the previous poster said, if you're thinking of playing a lot of out door bluegrass, the durability of the ply might be better. But then why not get the cheaper eberle ply, or look into other ply basses in that price range?
Ideally, it would be best to try the bass before buying it.

If you're gonna buy from bassesonline, you should take the option of not having them setup and save a few bucks. You're gonna have to get it set up locally anyway, cause their setup is very general. If I have a chance to go back to the store(which won't be any time soon), I'll try the basses.

[MCML]

Thanks to you all for your input.

Yes I am considering buying a bass from Bassesonline.

I had already decided to buy without setup so . . great minds think alike!

It is difficult to know exactly what I would be buying especially since the Eberles in question are represented as being twenty-thirty years old (pre-unification) and there is lots of information on the web questioning the quality of some East German bases of that vintage. Because I will not have a chance to see and play the basses this makes a decision more difficult.

[dchan]

My high school had 2 laminate Wilfers. They were nice, solid instruments and felt like they could have taken a bullet. My school also had a carved Matthias Thoma and a bunch of plywood Enescos, which are Romanian. The carved Thoma had a nice, deep sound, but the Wilfers were easily the better constructed instruments. They played really easily despite their coat-hanger tailgut because their strings were setup very low. Soundwise, they were okay. It was not a very loud and boomy sound, but loud enough and nice and clear.

I have also played the carved Eberles at Ideal Music (bassesonline.com). They are nice instruments, but silversorcerer is incorrect in saying that the only reason that they cost less than carved Wilfers is their economics of origin. Both are German-made, but the Wilfer is definitely a much nicer instrument that is better constructed and better sounding.

The Eberles are nice and solid instruments, but they are definitely on the lower end of the carved bass spectrum. The ones I played were somewhat inconsistent in sound. One of them had a pretty deep sound and had potential to be a good bass in the long haul. It was hard to tell, however, because the setup of the bass was very basic.

I would personally recommend that you try out their basses; if that's impossible, try out basses closer to where you live. That's the only true way of gaging whether you actually like the instrument. But if your heart is set on buying the Eberle or plywood Wilfer, ask them which bass has the best sound because they actually pick them out and mark them.

[MCML]

It is not that I have my heart set on one or the other. It is that, after checking out EUBs and learning a bit about what was available, scale lengths, construction, etc. it seemed to me that a "real" bass for about the cost of a mid-range EUB was a good way to go. They are offering the basses I referenced above for $1,500 without setup (and there are a couple of excellent places I can take it here in L.A. for that). So, (for what? $1,750 expertly set up?) with the right bridge, strings, etc. it seemed to me, based on what I have learned so far, that if I was making a mistake it would likely be only a small one. On the other hand, it might be a really good deal.

[EJ_Dad]

I purchased a carved Eberle on the fall of 2004 new from Ideal. I'm finally now getting it setup beyond the basic setup. A stamp inside the bass indicated that it was completed in Dec '91.

The wood on the bass is very good, very tight grained top, flaming on the maple back, ribs & neck. Much nicer than the ply pictured on the web site. The ebony fingerboard is thick with a straight grain. The bridge has a straight grain.

There is just a little too much good wood. The top is a little thick as probably are the back and ribs. The bass is heavy for its size. It is very solidly constructed.

I play primarily classical, the sound is good but not great. The lower bout is a little small so the sound doesn't have a huge bottom. It isn't a particularly loud instrument, but as the sound is a bit mid-rangy, it does cut through an ensemble well. It has opened up and darkened up quite a bit since I purchased it. The Belcantos help.

The other bassist in the comunity orchestra just bought two basses around $7k each. His Chinese has a much bigger bottom in the sound. His German is about the same as the Eberle, but it is brand new and the Eberle has been played for three years. I expect his German to open up and be much louder than the Eberle in a couple of years.

The Eberles (Musimas) retailed in this area for around $5K list before I saw them online. I'm happy with the bass and think it is a good value at the price point. The folks at Ideal were very easy to work with. I'll keep the bass for at least another 5 to 7 years, but will probably purchase a better bass someday (after the kids are out of college).

[MCML]

Thanks, EJ Dad. That is useful information. I think I need to ask Steve if he knows the dates of manufacture of the basses. Of course, since my kids are already out of college (and law school, too - well, almost, for the younger of the two) maybe I should just spend their inheritance and buy a really expensive instrument!

[Nagrom]

Here's a photo of the carved Eberle I got from Steve & his mom 3 weeks ago. I like it. It's the darker version, circa 1996

[philip sirois]

my 2 cents

It's hard to judge the sound of any bass with the minimal setup provided by ideal. I bought my hybrid wilfer from them. They're very nice people and easy to deal with. I got it set up right away by bill merchant for a couple hundred bucks and the difference was night and day.
Volume, tone, playability all enhanced. Made a good deal even better.

So ejdad- don't wait another second before that setup!

[MCML]

Originally Posted by philip sirois

my 2 cents

It's hard to judge the sound of any bass with the minimal setup provided by ideal. I bought my hybrid wilfer from them. They're very nice people and easy to deal with. I got it set up right away by bill merchant for a couple hundred bucks and the difference was night and day.
Volume, tone, playability all enhanced. Made a good deal even better.

So ejdad- don't wait another second before that setup!

There are, I believe, only laminate Wilfers available from Ideal/Steve/Greene/Bassesonline (no more hybrids). Steve did send me some info on a carved Wilfer that had been repaired by Merchant and is available in the Bay Area. He also has two carved Wilfers that need a lot of repair work. I do not think that I will go that route, though.

[EJ_Dad]

Originally Posted by philip sirois

my 2 cents
So ejdad- don't wait another second before that setup!

Having to wait until next week, the congruence of funding and no concerts finally arrived.

[Tyler_W]

I personally own the carved Eberle, and I'll tell you that its one hell of an instrument for the price, the tone is amazing... it improves after playing it for a while, along with the acoustics of your environment (sometimes, its as significant as the difference between night and day!). However, I would definitely tell you to get the instrument set up right away, because the action is rather high, which makes thumb position difficult! I think they offer an adjustable bridge for $100 installed if you wait.

...Also, purchase the $99 UB bow, it'll make a world of a difference in the sound as well... outside of the setup issues, the Eberle is a great bass!

[LouisF]

For various reasons I needed a back up bass here in LA and didn't want to get another laminate or hybrid. I ordered one of Steve's "Bassesonline" carved Eberle's (the dark varnish model) and it arrived yesterday. The document from Musima (former East German maker) dates the bass at 1995.

I strung it up with a Thomastik tailpiece and Supersensitive Sensicores that I had around and it makes one heck of a booming full sound! I'll get it (set up) done properly next week, but am very pleased with the bass - and the service Steve provided. For $1500, + shipping + tailpiece/strings + set up (a few hundred $$) it becomes a terrific carved bass at the that price.

Thanks.

Louis

[toman]

I can't comment on the comparison, but I had a laminated Eberle with a great setup and some upgraded parts, and it was a GREAT bass that I regret selling. Absolutely indestuctible, played great and sounded good, for a low$ plywood, quite good. I'd leave that thing in 150 degree cars, play it in the rain, throw it in a pickup with no bag... Man, that was a good bass. Since then I've owned finicky old carved basses, newer carved basses and all the rest... That bass was rock solid.