Starting On Upright Bass for School Play

[b00m69]

My school is doing the play "Oliver" and I was asked to play some of the music for it. It requires upright bass and NOT electric so I got the school to rent me one and it arrived today. I've played electric bass for 4-5 years now(private lessons for about 2) and am pretty advanced in technique and can sight read almost all music. Are there any tips that you can give me for a beginning upright player? The play is in about a month and I'm confident on the aspect of being able to play all the music.

Intonation and being able to hold the bow properly is my biggest worry as the music has a lot of arco spots which require the bow. The music isn't too complicated except for a few 8th/16th note runs the rest is quarter notes.

If there is a song with some arco spots, but many non-arco would it be a wise idea to pluck with my fingers on that instead of using the bow the whole way through.

Taking care of the bow as well. I know you need to loosen it before you put it away, but what is rosin exactly? Is that some sort of liquid that is put on the horsehair to make it smoother and therefore sound better?

P.S. The bass is 3/4 your typical upright's size.

Any tips are appreciated.

Thanks

[mjt0229]

Your school's orchestra director should be able to help a bit. Rosin is a sticky substance that helps to give some grip to the bow hair on the strings.

In terms of bow care, avoid touching the hair with your bare hands - finger oil and rosin turn into a nasty gum that's not sticky.

I wouldn't suggest plucking through arco portions of songs. Sometimes you have time to put the bow down, but frequently you won't, and you have to find a comfortable position to hold the bow that allows you to still pluck.

One or two lessons with a teacher will probably go a long way towards answering your questions and making the double bass experience much more enjoyable.

[b00m69]

Originally Posted by mjt0229

Your school's orchestra director should be able to help a bit.

One or two lessons with a teacher will probably go a long way towards answering your questions and making the double bass experience much more enjoyable.

We don't have an orchestra.. (Varsity, Percussion, Beginning, Guitar and Jazz (jazz is before school)) =/ we only have one cello player and a few violinists (varsity band). I'm actually teaching the cellist to play on electric bass in the Jazz/Varsity band next year so I'm thinking he might be able to give me a few tips on upright since they share some similarities.

I/My mom know an older upright player that used to play music at my church... he was impressed with my skills in technique about a year ago so maybe he can teach me some on upright.

OR If neither of those work I will get searching for a good teacher. I remember the cellist saying he had a good orchestra teacher in gradeschool.

Thanks for the reply.

[Bass Barrister]

While I applaud your sense of adventure, I think a bit of a reality check is in order.

Your EB skills certainly put you some steps ahead of the typical DB noob, but please understand that playing the DB requires a very different physical approach that takes time to master. To develop sufficient skill and endurance to handle a full length musical is not something that, IMHO, can be learned from scratch in one month.

At the very least, you must take some DB lessons to learn basic skills of holding the bass, using the left hand, bowing (arco), and plucking (pizzicato). Unless you are some sort of virtuoso and can devote the majority of your time to this endeavor for the next few weeks, you may well be disappointed.

If you are committed do going ahead with this, please seek out some DB teacher asssistance ASAP.

Good luck.

[drurb]

Originally Posted by Bass Barrister

While I applaud your sense of adventure, I think a bit of a reality check is in order.

Your EB skills certainly put you some steps ahead of the typical DB noob, but please understand that playing the DB requires a very different physical approach that takes time to master. To develop sufficient skill and endurance to handle a full length musical is not something that, IMHO, can be learned from scratch in one month.

At the very least, you must take some DB lessons to learn basic skills of holding the bass, using the left hand, bowing (arco), and plucking (pizzicato). Unless you are some sort of virtuoso and can devote the majority of your time to this endeavor for the next few weeks, you may well be disappointed.

If you are committed do going ahead with this, please seek out some DB teacher asssistance ASAP.

Good luck.

+1! Following this advice will also help you avoid injury. As I've said many times, the double-bass and the electric bass are two related, but very different instruments.

[CamMcIntyre]

Good luck.

I'd consider stringing your electric with flats and not messing with the double bass. I did that in high school for several of our plays. I played "The Wizard of Oz" on electric bass instead of the written double bass. Why? I had barely been playing double bass for a year, and the teacher agreed that it would be best for me to just play it on electric bass.

Like the others have said, they are related, but very different. I tried to do the same thing as many of the other young guys do-simply start playing it without putting in the work needed. That was a costly decision as the first chunk of time at conservatory was spent unlearning and relearning technique. Don't rush the double bass. Take the time and do it right. This will save you a lot in the long run.

[powellmacaque]

While you may not get a desirable tone, I think if you work super hard, it can be "doable".

My bass teacher EXPECTED me to have bowing and left hand technique down the first month. My problem is reading music and not doing the whole "one finger per fret" thing on upright. I entered college not being able to read music at all, never playing an upright, and never even thinking about bowing. Many players on here told me to not even try out for my music department, and now I am getting paid by the theatre department to do the same thing you are doing only 2 months into school (granted, I am playing in a production that requires electric bass).

Find a teacher or somebody who can show you how to properly bow. If this gig is that important to you, drive to a major city or college if you have to, and expect to pay AT LEAST $40 for lessons, and try to get a teacher who has either been playing for years professionally or has a masters degree or higher.

Worst case scenario: you learn the music and tell the conductor or band leader that you're more comfortable with playing the stuff on electric. If they REALLY want an upright, then tell them they are sacrificing tonal quality for the upright sound. If they REALLY want good tonal quality, and you can provide it on electric, tell them that. I think you can do it if you bust your butt, I did it and am still doing it, and you have the advantage of being able to read. The mechanics are frustrating and hard at first, but after a month you should be able to at least play simple pieces, especially with the guidance of a good teacher.

If you are in Florida or southern Georgia/Alabama/Mississippi, I can hook you up with an amazing teacher.

[b00m69]

Well the this past weekend we finished the play (Did 3 shows) and It went well. I ended up taking 2 lessons from a guy named Jay Hungerford and played fairly decent in the show. There was another, older, more experienced player there and he thought I did okay. I know my intonation could be way better, but other than that my technique is decent.

P.S. I got a huge blister on my pointer and middle fingers on my plucking hand so I was actually happy to play the arco parts with a bow because it didn't hurt my fingers as much. Hopefully they will callous enough to where there won't be any pain.

I might be able to upload a scene from the play if any of you would like to see part of it.

[JtheJazzMan]

Youd be far better off playing well on electric rather than poorly on double bass.

Though good luck explaining that to a musical director that doesnt understand. Expecting you to pick up a bass and a bow and play because you play an electric bass is rather naive on their part.

Expecting you to play it in 4 weeks is silly.

Id recommend doing the gig on electric.

[b00m69]

I already played the show...

[Bruce Lindfield]

Originally Posted by b00m69

P.S. I got a huge blister on my pointer and middle fingers on my plucking hand so I was actually happy to play the arco parts with a bow because it didn't hurt my fingers as much. Hopefully they will callous enough to where there won't be any pain.

As a Jazz player, I play pizz all the time and I never get blisters from this - but every year at Jazz Summer School there are new DB players who have terrible problems.

What I notice is that they play with the tips of their fingers, whereas I play with the side of my fingers - as is the usual recommendation from Jazz players. So if you use the sides of your plucking fingers more, it is less likely to give you blisters if you are doing a lot of pizz!

[Paul Warburton]

Originally Posted by Bruce Lindfield

So if you use the sides of your plucking fingers more, it is less likely to give you blisters if you are doing a lot of pizz!

Bruce, come on. We just did about three threads on this no-blister and callus nonsense. If you pluck the DB at any length you will get blisters before the callus builds up from that. It is part of being a jazz bassist. If you don't get blistering something is very wrong.

[JtheJazzMan]

Originally Posted by b00m69

I already played the show...

Oops, sorry, brain fart.

[Dubbin]

b00m69, I really enjoyed your story. How many hours did you spend a week preparing? Ed

[b00m69]

Well each day I would play it in jazz band (5 days a week for 45-50 minutes) and 1:30 in Varisty Band. Then the weekend before and the week of the play I would say I practiced a total of 20 hours. Weekly before that it was around 10-12 hours a week (due to jazz and varsity band at school). I started to blister the week of the show because a lot was pizz and I spent the majority of my time working on my bowing which is alright, but needs improvement in tone. It was a shame in the pit I couldn't hear myself too well so it was hard to know if my note was in tune perfectly or not.

[Bruce Lindfield]

Originally Posted by Paul Warburton

Bruce, come on. We just did about three threads on this no-blister and callus nonsense. If you pluck the DB at any length you will get blisters before the callus builds up from that. It is part of being a jazz bassist. If you don't get blistering something is very wrong.

I was just trying to get at something I have seen in people who transfer from BG to DB - so they will pluck the DB, the same way they did BG and get a thin sound and blisters very quickly!!

I do notice that the sides of my fingers have become harder and coarser - but I have never got blisters from playing DB...

That's just the truth - maybe I don't pull hard enough!!

[Paul Warburton]

If you play a two hour gig with any kind of intention, you will blister.

[Mike Goodbar]

I got my blisters/callouses from playing in the school play, "How to Succeed in Business...." I'd playing for about a year, but exclusively arco. I was using "classical" pizz technique and discovered using the sides of my fingers just to avoid the pain of playing on the blisters (I eventually developed blisters there too
.

Also, with all the switching from pizz to arco in that show, I thought "Wouldn't it be a cool idea to have some kind of thing to hold the bow and have it handy when I need it?" So I stole one of my dad's archery quivers and tied it to my tailpiece, thinking I had come up with something completely new. I proudly showed my "invention" to my bass teacher, who had a good laugh out of it.

[Bruce Lindfield]

Originally Posted by Paul Warburton

If you play a two hour gig with any kind of intention, you will blister.

I intend to play a gig of at least 2 hours in Chichester this Saturday coming!!

But I don't expect to get any blisters - I have stubby fingers and very thick skin!!

[Paul Warburton]

Originally Posted by Mike Goodbar

.

Also, with all the switching from pizz to arco in that show, I thought "Wouldn't it be a cool idea to have some kind of thing to hold the bow and have it handy when I need it?" So I stole one of my dad's archery quivers and tied it to my tailpiece, thinking I had come up with something completely new. I proudly showed my "invention" to my bass teacher, who had a good laugh out of it.

Yeah.
I've done that "I think I got something here..." kinda thing writing a tune, only to find out that my "original" was wrritten by somebody a long time ago. Some Dude named Bach.