Dialing in an SB2

MascisMan · #1 10-15-2008, 09:48 PM

Hey guys Im new to the G&L club with a recently purchased (used) USA SB2.

I love how it looks and plays (one of the best players I have experienced actually) but I'm having a bit of trouble dialing in the sound.

I love a little growl but this bass seems a bit too growly, like it has too much bite. Almost sterile if that makes sense. Right now I am playing through a GK 800RB (which may be compounding the issue) but I get my Orange AD200 back on Friday (new power tubes/bias) and will see what it sounds like. It may help in warming it up and reducing a little bite.

I might also try half-rounds instead of round wounds.

Anyone else experience this phenomena with the SB2? How did you reduce some bite?

Thanks!

Ken Baker · #2 10-15-2008, 11:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MascisMan

Hey guys Im new to the G&L club with a recently purchased (used) USA SB2.

Congratulations!

Quote:

Anyone else experience this phenomena with the SB2? How did you reduce some bite?

I catch a fair amount of grief for doing my broken record thing, but here goes anyway.

Turn it down. Seriously. The SB-2 is incredibly hot and can be miserable to control if you dime the controls.

Try setting the neck volume to about 75% and the bridge a little less than that. If you run the gain on the 800RB fairly high, try backing it off as well and adjust the master accordingly.

Hope this helps.

Ken...

MascisMan · #3 10-15-2008, 11:04 PM

Cool thanks Ken!

Will this help with taking some of the "zing" out?

coop · #4 10-15-2008, 11:22 PM

You might try lowering the pickups, especially the bridge. It helped with mine. YMMV.

Ken Baker · #5 10-16-2008, 12:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MascisMan

Cool thanks Ken!

Will this help with taking some of the "zing" out?

It may, it may not. Zing is more a string and EQ issue than something peculiar to the bass. For example, stainless steel strings will have a zing that only EQ or a change to nickels will reduce. Some people like the zing, others don't. Something else to remember is that new nickel rounds will be a bit zingy until they break in, then they usually settle down. My '93 SB-2 is strung with Infeld Superalloys, and they were pretty intense for a while. Now, they're just fat sounding.

Coop mentioned to lower the pickups, and that's good advice for a lot of basses - but especially G&Ls.

Just remember that this ain't no Jazz or Precision; it's a whole lot hotter and it's got an entirely different voice. So play with the volume controls, your amp, and pickup height until you arrive at the tone you like. It's there.

Ken...

68Goldfish · #6 10-16-2008, 11:12 AM

I'll +1 on the turn it down advise. The passive SB-2 is hotter than any of my active J's. There is quite a difference in the sound of the bass in the last 10-15% of the P pickup volume knob. It's nice and fat and P bassy for the first 85 percent then it takes on a super grindy quality at the very end. I love the grind but it just drives all my amps crazy. I want to try putting a volume pedal inbetween the bass and the amp so I can keep the P pickup mostly dimed and still turn down the signal before it gets to the amp. Not sure if it will work but I'm gonna try it and see what happens. I'd love to hear the sb-2 with an 800rb and 8x10 I bet it would be gnarly!

TDR1138 · #7 10-16-2008, 11:48 AM

I used my SB2 for a few years through a 800RB with my last band. I think they work well together, but here's the way I liked to run the setup...

1) I modded the SB2 to a vol/tone/3-way. I would run the bass with just the P pickup, dimed on the volume (sorry Ken) and about 80% on tone. Strung with Rotosound Swing 66's, which can be pretty bright strings.

2) Amp's EQ set at about 12 o'clock for all 4 knobs, but I did use the pre-shaped mid cut. Boost channel was only set to about 9 o'clock when used. Use the padded -15db switch. I rarely used the bi-amp option.

3) You didn't mention your cabs... The cabs I used were a GK 1x15 and 4x10. I could never get a good sound out of it without the 15. The 4x10 alone just did not give the bass enough depth and power out of the low end. (that might also be attributed to the particular 4x10 cab and speakers, though)

Anyway, this is what worked for me. I'll agree with 68 goldfish, that last 15% on the volume is where a lot of the bite comes from. I like the bite, but I really felt like adding the tone knob took a little of that harshness out of the bite. Not sure if you want to go that route, but you can probably get similar results edging off the treble on the amp.

ljazz · #8 10-16-2008, 04:32 PM

Ken hit it right on the head..... back off a bit. I roll off the P vol to about 60-80% of full, and roll up the J to about 20%.

A side note to all of this. When I roll off the J all the way, and the P all the way up, I'm reminded of how hot my '87 SB1 P MFD used to be. Darn near too harsh..... but the rolling off of the vol, plus the green corrosive buildup on the pup over the years has mellowed it into a sexy, funky beast. I hope my SB2 ages as gracefully.

Ljazz

Ken Baker · #9 10-16-2008, 06:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TDR1138

1) I modded the SB2 to a vol/tone/3-way. I would run the bass with just the P pickup, dimed on the volume (sorry Ken) and about 80% on tone. Strung with Rotosound Swing 66's, which can be pretty bright strings.

No apology necessary. It's all about getting your tone. My recommendation is just a decent starting point. Well, once we get used to the idea that it can, indeed, be turned down.

To carry my broken record further, I usually go on to say that once turned down there comes a great deal of control to the right hand in the way of dynamics and the bass just kind of sings. I usually keep the volume just a hair on the lower side of where it gets crazy. I play with a normally light touch, so I just play harder to get louder within my amp settings. I've found this to be the case with every G&L I've laid hands on.

But that's just me. Everyone has a tone in their head and that's how I get mine.

Ken...

ac11367 · #10 10-17-2008, 12:06 PM

Like Ken said, turn down the gain/boost, which is almost a must with SB2. I have a 800RB also. 2x10 Hartke and 1x15 Mesa Boogie. I soloed the J pup, raised both pups' heights (for easy finger-picking), dial the treble up to 3 o'clock, and adjust the volume on either the amp or the bass. It sounds hot, but not at an extremely level. I play in a trio, so I can afford to have a less bassier sound. For a more bassier sound, I just finger-pick on the P pup position.

On a side note, I checked out a Lakland Darryl Jones at Sam Ash yesterday. I may bring my SB2 to the store one day and compare them side by side. I love how the DJ sounded, especially for slapping. But something about the SB2's growl that's preventing me from trading it in for the DJ. Also, I don't know how good the DJ is in terms of cutting through the mix. But I know for sure that the SB2 seriously cuts through.

MascisMan · #11 10-17-2008, 12:40 PM

hey AC,

Its interesting that you use the bridge pup solo (when most use the p pup primarily).

You don't find that the bridge pickup solo with the treble at 3 o'clock is too much?

ac11367 · #12 10-17-2008, 02:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MascisMan

You don't find that the bridge pickup solo with the treble at 3 o'clock is too much?

No. My SB2 has the stacked tone knobbed modification. And I turn the tone knob (stacked underneath the volume knob) all the way up on cut (since it's a passive bass, there's no gain, only cuts). So in other words, I further neutered my bass. And instead use the treble knob on my amp to adjust tone. If I want more punch and less brightness, I just finger-pick from the neck pickup position.

sunbeast · #13 10-18-2008, 01:56 AM

The SB-2 P pickup must be one of the hottest passive pickups around (actually hotter than some actives). What is really confounding about its hotness is that it is both hot AND clear- most pickups that are wound really hot also tend to lack in clarity. I really miss my SB-2....

I dealt with the harshness by adding a tone control (Neck volume, stacked bridge volume/ tone control). I personally think the tone mod is incredibly useful on the SB-2. I also modified the tone sweeper to make the tone pot a "no load" pot (it was a 500K Audio taper pot with a .047uf capacitor). In other words, when the tone control was up all the way, it was electronically removed from the circuit- so I could get the stock SB-2 tone if I wanted to. I would generally run the tone at 50% or less and there was still plenty of grind when I would dig in- without the tone pot I found it to be very harsh and clanky sounding when I dug in (my technique is certainly also to blame for that!).

Karl

ac11367 · #14 10-18-2008, 11:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sunbeast

In other words, when the tone control was up all the way, it was electronically removed from the circuit- so I could get the stock SB-2 tone if I wanted to.

I wonder if mine was set up this way too. I bought the bass used with the tone mod already in place, and the previous owner told me that the tone knobs are for cut only. So when I turn the tone knob all the way up, I was assuming that it cuts down the harshness from the stock SB2 tone. Now it may be that when I turn the tone knob up, I was really getting the stock tone. Either way, I'm loving it more since turning down the boost level on my amp. My bass definitely sounds a lot clearer and the growl is more apparent.

sunbeast · #15 10-18-2008, 02:06 PM

It doesn't happen to be black with black pickguard, ebony fretboard and matching black headstock, does it?

Damn, I've been missing that thing for aesthetics if nothing else (and there was alot more to it than just the aesthetics!).

Karl

Quote:

Originally Posted by ac11367

I wonder if mine was set up this way too. I bought the bass used with the tone mod already in place, and the previous owner told me that the tone knobs are for cut only. So when I turn the tone knob all the way up, I was assuming that it cuts down the harshness from the stock SB2 tone. Now it may be that when I turn the tone knob up, I was really getting the stock tone. Either way, I'm loving it more since turning down the boost level on my amp. My bass definitely sounds a lot clearer and the growl is more apparent.

Ken Baker · #16 10-18-2008, 02:31 PM

Kinda like this. Stacked volumes and a tone control.

This is a simple Jazz V-V-T circuit using a .047uf cap in treble-cut only. If the cap is dialed out of circuit, it's bone-stock SB-2.

I did this in an exercise of seeing how it would work, and it worked as planned. It's just that its use was actually pretty limited to taming new strings. The bass is now back to stock configuration.

Click the image for a PDF file suitable for printing.

Ken...

ac11367 · #17 10-19-2008, 06:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sunbeast

It doesn't happen to be black with black pickguard, ebony fretboard and matching black headstock, does it?

No. It's tranparent green with pearloid pickguard, bought from a fellow TB'er. A totally black one like what you had would've been nice though, very fitting consider how nasty that thing sounds.

Here's mine:

http://www.talkbass.com/forum/showth...27#post6092827