-14db question

[BaronVonHavok]

This may be a total noob question, and I'm not even sure if this belongs in basses or amps, but I had a weird thought this weekend at band practice and figured I should go to talkbass to have it all sorted out.

I play either a Warwick $$ or an Ibanez 1405e through a GK700RB-II. I realized both have active pre-amps, but I'm not sure if they have active or passive pups. Maybe you guys can help me with that as well.

Now here's my thought: I figured that with the active electronics in the basses, I should have the -14db pressed in on the amp, so that I don't blow anything. But then I remembered that both my basses have switches to bypass/turn off those active electronics and that would essentially make them passive, correct?

The reason I'm having this thought is I'm wondering if I would be able to get more volume out of my amp if I didn't have the -14db engaged. I wouldn't mind doing that but I don't want to destroy my amp.

Sorry if this isn't clear, I'm still working on the whole "explaining myself over the internet" thing. hahaha

[KJung]

That pad setting has nothing to do with active or passive (even though some amp companies still list their 'lower gain' setting or input as 'active', based on way outdated info from back in the day).

The pad switch is useful when you have a stupid high output bass, or very aggressive technique that overdrives the initial gain stage of an amp even with the gain control turned way down. This would be a very rare situation, it is as likely to happen with a passive bass as one with an onboard preamp.

Engaging the 'pad' switch greatly reduces the input level from the instrument, and adds a touch of circuitry between your bass and amp.

There is little reason to use an active input or pad switch in general, and having an active bass (rare to have active pickups, usually just an on-board preamp) is not an indication that you would benefit with greatly reducing the input to your amp.

Finally, many active circuits are now set to match the output level of the bass in passive mode (bypassing the preamp), and/or have internal volume pots to adjust the gain of the preamp to match the passive mode.

Edit: Per your last question, yes, if you have a low output (or normal output bass) and use that extreme gain reduction setting, you might not even be able to drive your amp to full performance. Turn it off!

[BaronVonHavok]

AAAAAHHHHH. That makes a lot of sense. Thank you very much for this info. I was always afraid that if I had anything active in the bass, I'd have hotter signal coming out of my bass into my amp and that I would blow something, so I always had the pad pushed in. Now I can get that little extra volume to compete with my guitards! haha

Thank you very much, KJung.

[JohnMCA72]

I'll add to Klung's post that using the "low-gain"(attenuated) input or turning on the input pad will force you to turn the main volume up to get the same output level you'd get "normally". This can amplify the amp's natural noise (every amp produces some) to a point that you might not like.

[KJung]

Originally Posted by JohnMCA72

I'll add to Klung's post that using the "low-gain"(attenuated) input or turning on the input pad will force you to turn the main volume up to get the same output level you'd get "normally". This can amplify the amp's natural noise (every amp produces some) to a point that you might not like.

+1

[rust_preacher]

I use the pad sometimes because I want to have a bit more perceptible control with the input gain knob, i. e. I can set the control closer to "noon" setting. Sometimes it just feels silly having the input gain very close to the minimum setting.

[KJung]

Originally Posted by rust_preacher

I use the pad sometimes because I want to have a bit more perceptible control with the input gain knob, i. e. I can set the control closer to "noon" setting. Sometimes it just feels silly having the input gain very close to the minimum setting.

+1 You are using that control correctly. If the output of your bass is hot enough that you have to turn the gain down VERY low (and hence lose most of the usable range of the gain knob), then the pad is appropriate.

This is exactly why, in rare situations, you would use a pad.

I have kind of a cool pad control design on my Glockenklang heads. There are two separate inputs. One is the typical 'no pad input' that most would use. The second input has a true variable pad (like a mixing board) that allows you to exactly control the input gain (from -1db all the way up to the more typical -15db) so that you can exactly match the output of the instrument to allow for the maximum range and 'precision' of the gain knob.

I never use it myself, since my technique is not particularly aggressive and the basses I use have typical 'moderate' output. Cool design though, versus the typical 'nothing or too much' pad designs on most bass heads.

[B-string]

The important thing on your G-K is that the Clip LED is NOT affected by the input volume. If the LED lights up a lot you need to engage the pad as the pad switch adjusts the gain on the first stage before the input volume control. With pad out if the clip LED doesn't light you do not need to use the pad switch.

[KJung]

Originally Posted by B-string

The important thing on your G-K is that the Clip LED is NOT affected by the input volume. If the LED lights up a lot you need to engage the pad as the pad switch adjusts the gain on the first stage before the input volume control. With pad out if the clip LED doesn't light you do not need to use the pad switch.

That is a nice design.

[B-string]

Originally Posted by KJung

That is a nice design.

Yes IMO a better use of the indicator.
If you don't like having the "volume" control so low or feel you want more finite control with it, turn your masters (woofer/tweeter) down some. That will allow more control. One way to "warm" up the sound is to use a higher volume setting with lower master.

[BaronVonHavok]

Awesome. Thanks a lot guys. I was definitely completely off with what I thought it was used for and I'm glad this was all laid out loud and clear.