1x18 Cabs...

AdamJames306 · #1 02-17-2011, 04:05 PM

Hey guys. I'm building a rig that currently consists of a GK 1001 RBII into an Ampeg 1x15 and a Hartke 4x10. It sounds great, but I've recently started using an MXR M-80 into an MXR octave pedal (which I affectionately refer to now as The God Sound) and I wanna get as much bottom as I can. I'm thinking of changing out the 4x10 (which isn't really mine anyway and doesn't add much to the overall sound) and replacing it with a 1x18 to really punch people in the guts. Maybe an SWR Big Ben or an Eden?

Now my question is this- am I gonna get that much more bottom than I have now? I don't know of many players who use them, which leads me to believe they may have limited application. But I want to have an over-the-top sound (not to mention I like the idea of having the biggest cab on the block) and it seems, from the research I've done, that in this case bigger is certainly better.

Thoughts? Suggestions?

Lastly, there's a guy in my area selling a Big Ben for really cheap, but it's 31 years old. Should I be wary of buying a cab that's older than I am?

MuthaFunk · #2 02-17-2011, 04:46 PM

I have an old Big Ben and it's awesome! The low end out of it is fantastic. Deeper than any other cab I've owned and I've had Eden d410xlt, golliath jr II, Fender 15", and now my Mesa Radiator 12.

I wouldn't worry about how old the one local to you is as much0 as if it's been abused or not. It should have a Bag End driver in it. If not, it's not original. The newer ones have a different 18" speaker in them, I don't know what it is.

Bassmec · #3 02-17-2011, 04:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AdamJames306

Hey guys. I'm building a rig that currently consists of a GK 1001 RBII into an Ampeg 1x15 and a Hartke 4x10. It sounds great, but I've recently started using an MXR M-80 into an MXR octave pedal (which I affectionately refer to now as The God Sound) and I wanna get as much bottom as I can. I'm thinking of changing out the 4x10 (which isn't really mine anyway and doesn't add much to the overall sound) and replacing it with a 1x18 to really punch people in the guts. Maybe an SWR Big Ben or an Eden?

Now my question is this- am I gonna get that much more bottom than I have now? I don't know of many players who use them, which leads me to believe they may have limited application. But I want to have an over-the-top sound (not to mention I like the idea of having the biggest cab on the block) and it seems, from the research I've done, that in this case bigger is certainly better.

Thoughts? Suggestions?

Lastly, there's a guy in my area selling a Big Ben for really cheap, but it's 31 years old. Should I be wary of buying a cab that's older than I am?

I cant see why a 1 X 18 + 1 X 15 if wired so the drivers are in phase should not give you a big old bed of rumble with an option of adding a midrange box like a 4 X 6" you might even go mad and add an L Pad and a tweeter to the 4 X 6" one day.
31 year old quality speakers can be fine if they don't have foam type suspension rings, I think Big Ben's had a linen cambric edge cast frame speaker made by Eden so if it ain't actually blown it should be fine, quite a lot of gear never gets to be other than a garage ornament and has probably done very few hours in all those years.
Test it! if it sounds good, it is good, you can always re-cone it
quite cheap if it blows up.
Just dont pay too much!.

billfitzmaurice · #4 02-17-2011, 05:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AdamJames306

Now my question is this- am I gonna get that much more bottom than I have now?

No. The average 4x10 and 1x18 have similar output and response. And the average 4x10 goes as low as and louder than the average 1x15. Chances are your best bet would be to lose the 1x15 and add another identical 4x10.

Blankandson · #5 02-18-2011, 11:07 PM

I used an Echolette w/18" Goodman back in the 60s. Only negative was I never felt I could be heard on stage, but people in the crowd would tell me I was killing them. The sound just doesn't go out evenly - at least not with that system. I used an Arbeiter FuzzFace with my Hofners and that combined with the 18" gave me a nice 'rooster crowing' sound, aka The Yardbirds. If you like it, buy it.

Ric5 · #6 02-18-2011, 11:22 PM

A 1 x 18 and 2 x 10 cabs compliment each other quite nicely.

MysticMichael · #7 02-18-2011, 11:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Blankandson

I used an Echolette w/18" Goodman back in the 60s. Only negative was I never felt I could be heard on stage, but people in the crowd would tell me I was killing them. The sound just doesn't go out evenly - at least not with that system.

The issue is that ultra low frequencies create very large, long waveforms. Of course you're not going to be able to hear them fully developed from your vantage point on stage, right in front of the rig. You may even have been turning up and/or EQing the lows in order to compensate. If so, it's no wonder you were roiling the guts of the audience members. They were probably standing right where those low-frequency waves were coming to a focus...

MM

billfitzmaurice · #8 02-19-2011, 06:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MysticMichael

The issue is that ultra low frequencies create very large, long waveforms. Of course you're not going to be able to hear them fully developed from your vantage point on stage, right in front of the rig.

You're repeating the myth of wave development. If it was true headphones wouldn't work, nor would autosound or home theater.
The actual cause of this particular phenomenon is room cancellation modes, which, along with boundary reinforcement, is something every bass player should be very aware of, as they deal with them every time they plug in.

AdamJames306 · #9 02-19-2011, 10:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by billfitzmaurice

You're repeating the myth of wave development. If it was true headphones wouldn't work, nor would autosound or home theater.
The actual cause of this particular phenomenon is room cancellation modes, which, along with boundary reinforcement, is something every bass player should be very aware of, as they deal with them every time they plug in.

Bill- it's interesting you touched on this. In small clubs and bars/roadhouses, where I imagine most of us are playing, there's only so much control we have over stage configuration. What are your thoughts on maximizing sound quality in these environments?

BassGreaser · #10 02-19-2011, 10:32 AM

What about the BagEnd S18-D? has anyone heard that cab?

billfitzmaurice · #11 02-19-2011, 11:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AdamJames306

Bill- it's interesting you touched on this. In small clubs and bars/roadhouses, where I imagine most of us are playing, there's only so much control we have over stage configuration. What are your thoughts on maximizing sound quality in these environments?

Listen to your rig from the audience, adjust it for the best tone there, and if it sounds like crap on stage live with it, you'll get used to it. Ideally the tone on stage comes from your amp, the tone out front from the PA, and you can have it good all over, but in small clubs that's seldom an option.

SlingBass4 · #12 02-19-2011, 11:45 AM

One of the best (or at least most thumping) rigs *I* ever played through were a pair of 15" custom folded horn cabs through an Acoustic 270 head

countrybass007 · #13 02-19-2011, 09:08 PM

I still use my Boogie 118 on occasion for festivals, and it does really throw the deep bass into the audience. I use a NY 4X5 cab as a stage monitor and set the 118 so it sounds great out in the crowd. We always do a careful soundcheck for each instrument, and adjust accordingly. Ideally, you end up with a good sound on stage too, but that isn't always the case.

Blankandson · #14 02-20-2011, 03:44 PM

I was 16 and didn't know a frequency from a hertz back then. Plus we didn't have a PA or a monitor system, the singer sang through a Selmer w 2x10s. We thought we were the best band in Heidelberg. Probably way down the list, but we had a blast.

Jaco who? · #15 02-20-2011, 04:10 PM

So, you wanna punch people in the guts? Drive a pair of Avatar TB153s with your 1001RBII.

GrowlerBox · #16 02-20-2011, 05:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Blankandson

I was 16 and didn't know a frequency from a hertz back then.

**mikeddd** · #17 02-20-2011, 05:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jaco who?

So, you wanna punch people in the guts? Drive a pair of Avatar TB153s with your 1001RBII.

Ooooh, that could be deadly.

"Optimum dispertion" and "time-aligned midrange" concerns aside, two of these cabs with umpteen watts behind them would produce decadent decibels of full-range bass goodness. It would be really loud. WHAT? I said, IT WOULD BE REALLY LOUD!

christw · #18 02-20-2011, 06:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mikeddd

Ooooh, that could be deadly.

"Optimum dispertion" and "time-aligned midrange" concerns aside, two of these cabs with umpteen watts behind them would produce decadent decibels of full-range bass goodness. It would be really loud. WHAT? I said, IT WOULD BE REALLY LOUD!

Six ten's and 450~600 watts taught me what bass really is. I felt it! It was a HiWatt DR405 through Genz Benz 610 XB2 and my 1001RB-II through my Bag End 210/410 stack. Wow! I know what bass really is. I also met the first head to make that GB cab fart, the HiWatt. It was super clean at any volume!