212 or 410

tlr1293 · #1 02-23-2011, 11:21 AM

Did a search - may have missed it...

Same manufacturer, price, wattage handling, etc...
all things being equal - why would someone choose a 410 over a 212, or vice-versa (212 over a 410)?

What makes one better or different than the other?

IntrepidCellist · #2 02-23-2011, 11:25 AM

410s are generally more sensitive, 212s can often be lighter.

Honestly though, most cab companies voice them to be different, so whichever one sounds best is what I'd choose.

christw · #3 02-23-2011, 11:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tlr1293

Did a search - may have missed it...

Same manufacturer, price, wattage handling, etc...
all things being equal - why would someone choose a 410 over a 212, or vice-versa (212 over a 410)?

What makes one better or different than the other?

They're different options that are pretty similar. Using Genz Benz Ubers as an example, the 212 handles less power, weighs about 10 lbs less, but is otherwise very similar to the 410 on paper. I'd still like to try both before I'd buy one though.

All other things equal and buying blind, I would probably buy a 410 because it'll be capable of moving a little more air.

BigOldHarry · #4 02-23-2011, 11:30 AM

My experience - the pros of each (I won't bother with the cons - they are implicit):

4x10 will push more air and be a bit more scooped in tone;
2x12 will be lighter and less expensive, giving a more mid-focused tone.

5StringPocket · #5 02-23-2011, 12:26 PM

I have the Uber 410 and 212 cabs which are the same size but the 212 is 9 lbs lighter and handles 600 watts vs 1000 for the 410. The difference between them is not as much as the thermal wattage ratings might show. The efficiencies are about the same (103 vs 102 dB/w) and either one puts out a LOT of solid punchy sound; enough to handle most gigs quite nicely. The 212 is voiced a little deeper with a little rounder bottom and not quite as much going on in the upper mids/low treble (2500-4000 Hz). The 410 is a little more even top to bottom. Both cabs have good articulation and low end clarity.

The cabs have different voices and players would have a preference for one or the other depending on the sound they are after. If your first criteria is max volume and cut through I mix I'd pick the 410 but don't sell the 212 short if it's voicing suits the style of music.

Marko5657 · #6 02-23-2011, 12:44 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tlr1293

Did a search - may have missed it...

Same manufacturer, price, wattage handling, etc...
all things being equal - why would someone choose a 410 over a 212, or vice-versa (212 over a 410)?
What makes one better or different than the other?

First choice = 212 over 212,
Far-second choice = 410 over 410.

BigOldHarry · #7 02-23-2011, 12:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 5StringPocket

...
The cabs have different voices and players would have a preference for one or the other depending on the sound they are after. If your first criteria is max volume and cut through I mix I'd pick the 410 but don't sell the 212 short if it's voicing suits the style of music.

The factor in these discussions that is always missing is brand and model; I know for a fact that my Epi NYC 4x10 does not sound much like a GK 4x10, which does not sound much like a Aguilar 4x10...

So this discussion becomes tricky in a hurry.

johnnybass01 · #8 02-23-2011, 01:01 PM

I am in the same boat as you , only my choice is between two GK cabs , I have had a couple of different 2x12 cabs and although they were light , they just didn't have the focus of the 410 cabs I have played through. but in my case the GK i am looking at only weighs 45 pounds, that is the lightest 410 i have seen for sure.So my choice is really hard there is only 7 lbs diff in the two cabs..

Calaverasgrande · #9 02-23-2011, 02:23 PM

I have tried 4x10 cabs in the past, lord know I have tried to like them. But I have yet to meet one that I could stay with. Folks always talk about the 4x10's forte being that they are multiple small drivers which deliver a more focused/attacking sound. I find the oposite to be true. Because so many drivers are reproducing the same sound it seems to muddy up faster than a 2x12 or 15" cab.
I currently use an all 15" setup, but I have heard some really good 2x12 and 4x12 cabs that easily beat a 15 for tone and can compete with a 4x10 for spl. I'm kinda looking to get a 2nd rig based on 12" cabs and a hybrid head, Something lighter at least!

billfitzmaurice · #10 02-23-2011, 02:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tlr1293

why would someone choose a 410 over a 212, or vice-versa (212 over a 410)?

?

You can play through ten 4x10s that will all sound different, and ten 2x12s that will all sound different, so how can you categorize a 4x10 'sound' versus a 2x12 'sound'?
You can't.
Personally I'd run a 2x12/2x6 loaded with 3012 woofers, as it would be smaller, lighter and go louder with better dispersion than a 4x10, because there are no ten inch equivalents to the 3012 yet. But with something other than a 3012 drivers that probably wouldn't be the case. So to make an informed decision without actually having the cabs side by side to compare you've got to know what drivers are in them. Otherwise you can't predict the result.

TheVoiceless · #11 02-23-2011, 02:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tlr1293

Did a search - may have missed it...

Same manufacturer, price, wattage handling, etc...
all things being equal - why would someone choose a 410 over a 212, or vice-versa (212 over a 410)?

What makes one better or different than the other?

IMO, the twelves are more of a fatter rock tone, and the ten's are more focused and jazzy. I am in love with my new GKNEO2x12II. It was exactly what I was looking for. Its like the best of ten's and 15's.

tlr1293 · #12 02-23-2011, 03:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Calaverasgrande

but I have heard some really good 2x12 and 4x12 cabs that easily beat a 15 for tone and can compete with a 4x10 for spl!

which ones?

As far as 410's from manufacturer to manufacturer - this is only a 212 and 410 of same manufacturer - no way to start splitting Company X 410 v. Company Y 212 (impossible).

billfitzmaurice · #13 02-23-2011, 03:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tlr1293

As far as 410's from manufacturer to manufacturer - this is only a 212 and 410 of same manufacturer -

Totally unpredictable unless you know what drivers are being used. I know you said 'all things being equal', but the fact of the matter is that they never are.

Calaverasgrande · #14 02-23-2011, 04:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tlr1293

which ones?

The Mesa and Aguilar (DB series) 2x12 cabs are awesome. I even kind of like some of the GK 2x12 and 4x12 cabs. I cant remember the model of the GK stuff. Lord their cabinet names are all way too similar!
I see a Mesa or Aggie (or Bergantino) 4x12 in my future someday. Right now I'm working on building out a smaller rig for smaller gigs and auditions though.

ThunderousFunk · #15 02-23-2011, 04:36 PM

Well, I'm sure there are some specifics. But to my ear, I just played a GenzNeoX212 powered by a Shuttle 9.0 head. And it sounds as good, if not alittle better than my Eden410XLT powered by a WT400 head. Plus, it's only a 60lb rig compared to one thats 115-120lbs.

michricker · #16 02-23-2011, 08:59 PM

I just went through this myself. Had it down to a berg ae410 vs stack of 2 aggi db112 s. I ended up keeping the aggi db112 stack to better meet my tone goals and the ability to use one cab for small Gigs/practice and two for Gigs. Sounds abit more old school.

bombpop14 · #17 02-23-2011, 09:17 PM

The genz benz neox-212t wound up being the perfect solution for me when I don't need to drag the o'l 8x10 out. I have several 1x15's, 4x10's, but the 212 neo is light and powerful enough for any situation. Bad ass cab.

tlr1293 · #18 02-24-2011, 06:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bombpop14

The genz benz neox-212t wound up being the perfect solution for me when I don't need to drag the o'l 8x10 out. I have several 1x15's, 4x10's, but the 212 neo is light and powerful enough for any situation. Bad ass cab.

I always seem to keep coming back to this one. I have to believe there's one in my near future.

Great discussion, and as always, I learned a lot. Thanks everyone.

I think I'll also pick up the NEOX112 for LARGE needs, and small needs - as an addition to the 212 or by itself.
(Carvin BX500 - 2ohm ready

)

name44 · #19 08-18-2011, 09:10 AM

How about the GK 410MBX vs the 212MBE?

Thought of buying a small practice amp but after reading some TB threads I ditched the idea and saving for something I can jam/gig with eventually, so far the GK 700RB-II looks good. Those cabs are a close price point, so wonder how they would compare esp with that head.
Plan on playing rock/blues/metalishness... maybe even country if the women at the bar are decent.