410 -vs- pair of 210's

[jimmeyer176]

All things relatively equal, take a GK Neo 410 and a pair of GK Neo 210 cabinets.

The 410 is rated at 800 watts, the 210's a 400 each. Playing through a 500 watt GK head.

Now I believe the 410 is 8 ohm, but even if it was 4ohm, wouldn't the pair of 210's be louder than the single 410?

If so...why? If not, then why not? Thanks!

[Downunderwonder]

Not, why would you think they should be?

The advantage to 2x10 is you can stack them up vertically for better monitoring and if you're carrying a bar room or church with your rig the sound is nice and even.

But GK dropped the ball with their latest 2x10 and put them in square boxes with the drivers on the diagonal.

[Wadge]

I've just looked at the product line up. They've discontinued the Neo 2x10 which is a shame. I actually prefer the Neo 2x12 but I ended up getting the Neo 2x10 because of the tilt back feature and the lesser weight. Pity.

[shoot-r]

Originally Posted by jimmeyer176

All things relatively equal, take a GK Neo 410 and a pair of GK Neo 210 cabinets.

The 410 is rated at 800 watts, the 210's a 400 each. Playing through a 500 watt GK head.

Now I believe the 410 is 8 ohm, but even if it was 4ohm, wouldn't the pair of 210's be louder than the single 410?

If so...why? If not, then why not? Thanks!

If all things are equal, a 410 or two 210's would still be moving equal amounts of air with the same square inches of cone area. Both should be equally loud.

The difference would come into play when the two 210 cabinets are stacked as a vertical 410.

A vertical 410 will have better mids dispersion, better projection, and with less phase problems than the standard configured 410.
Plus, a vertical 410 will give the same height advantages of a larger/taller cabinet by getting the top driver up nearer your ears for better clarity.

Another advantage of working with two 210 cabinets, use one for small gigs/rehearsals, both when more volume and coverage is needed.

I've been gigging a vertical 410 set-up for some time now.
I wouldn't consider going back to a standard 410.

[Tuned]

Phase correction? Don't phase problems occur when two speakers emitting the same signal are separated? In a standard 4x10 cabinet no speakers are more than about 14 inches apart center-to-center, but an inline 4x10 configuration the two at each end are 30" apart...

Try stacking your 2x10's as a square on top of a stool and stand no more than 5' away. That way you can hear better at a lower level, and let the PA do the heavy lifting. Bass cabs can't project deep bass very far, what happens is you get nice low end in front of the cab(s) but out in the room there's usually 3x as much 180Hz as there is 80Hz. Only dedicated subwoofers can project deep bass more than about 15' without creating a bunch of overtones. The less you're bleeding off stage the better.

When I finally get a 2x10 in addition to my 4x10, even running both cabs I'd still put them on a stool, unless my ankles grow ears. I've never needed more than the 4x10 though.

[Downunderwonder]

Comb filtering, look it up. Phase is the wrong word but it's also the right word.

The left and right speakers become out of phase in the mids due to the horizontal spread giving a significantly different distance to ears. Vertical speakers maintain phase.

Then look up beaming. This is the most obvious problem with 4x10, etc. They sound very much brighter in the middle than to the side.

[One Drop]

Originally Posted by Tuned

Phase correction? Don't phase problems occur when two speakers emitting the same signal are separated? In a standard 4x10 cabinet no speakers are more than about 14 inches apart center-to-center, but an inline 4x10 configuration the two at each end are 30" apart...

Try stacking your 2x10's as a square on top of a stool and stand no more than 5' away. That way you can hear better at a lower level, and let the PA do the heavy lifting. Bass cabs can't project deep bass very far, what happens is you get nice low end in front of the cab(s) but out in the room there's usually 3x as much 180Hz as there is 80Hz. Only dedicated subwoofers can project deep bass more than about 15' without creating a bunch of overtones. The less you're bleeding off stage the better.

When I finally get a 2x10 in addition to my 4x10, even running both cabs I'd still put them on a stool, unless my ankles grow ears. I've never needed more than the 4x10 though.

My understanding is that stacking vertically gives you better mids dispersion on the horizontal where you usually want it, and the trade off is poor vertical dispersion, which is unnecessary. Lows are multidirectional.

I also thought that mids dropped off more quickly that lows as you move away from the source, the opposite old what you are saying. This is where the fallacy that bass waves take a lot of distance to develop comes from.

[Downunderwonder]

The less you're bleeding off stage the better

you got that right.