is a 4x10 plus a 1x15 silly?

tishtash · #1 03-03-2013, 02:48 PM

Hello all!

I currently play through a single mesa 15 with an ashdown evoII 350 head. Before I had the 15 I had an eden 2x10 but blew both speakers and lost the cab.

Now the band is playing bigger venues and I need/want bigger sound. I am working with a very limited budget of $400 and here are two used options.

1.) Hartke 2x10 (speakers placed diagonal, no horn) with tone tubby speakers for $130. This is tempting for the speakers alone even if I ditch the hartke and throw these into another enclosure.

2.) Mesa Powerhouse 4x10 for $400

my main concern is being able to push without being afraid of blowing more speakers. I play in a heavy shoegaze/post-punk psych band and use a lot of effects.

There are a few questions here,

What is the difference between a 2x10 1x15 vs 4x10 1x15 as far as air movement, sound etc? is the 4x10 plus 1x15 obsolete?

Is there a disadvantage to diagonal placement of speakers?

Is the absence of a horn in the 2x10 hartke going to be a disappointment? (the mesa 4x10 has one)

oh and ... thoughts on the tone tubby?
Thank you all!!!!

IPYF · #2 03-03-2013, 02:55 PM

Can you get a matching Mesa 15 in that price range?

Most people around here will recommend that you never mix driver sizes. The general rule of thumb is that it's not a good idea, unless you've tested how it's going to sound and you personally feel its superior to the matched setup.

If you did get the 410 you would need to keep the 15" on top near your ears so you could hear it should it struggle. With only 350 watts on tap though I think you'd probably be fairly safe.

**Ric5** · #3 03-03-2013, 03:06 PM

is a 4x10 plus a 1x15 silly?

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

As long as both cabs are 8 ohms it will work.

JimiLL · #4 03-03-2013, 03:18 PM

O-M-G

BawanaRik · #5 03-03-2013, 03:25 PM

I used to use a 2 10 and a 1 15. I would add the 1 15 kinda like a tone control.

Stevorebob · #6 03-03-2013, 03:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JimiLL

O-M-G

+1

uOpt · #7 03-03-2013, 03:27 PM

Quote:

is a 4x10 plus a 1x15 silly?

Yes, they are too close. You need 4x10 + 1x18, silly

Zoa · #8 03-03-2013, 03:33 PM

Yeah, the general consensus is that of the commonly used setups, the 410/115 is the least optimal, mostly because of the dramatic difference in power handling and sensitivity between the two. I would try and find a matching 15 before considering any other options.

bgavin · #9 03-03-2013, 04:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zoa

Yeah, the general consensus is that of the commonly used setups, the 410/115 is the least optimal, mostly because of the dramatic difference in power handling and sensitivity between the two.

That is it.

Most 4x10 will spank a 1x15 quite handily.
Unless you are actively bi-amping with level balance, said spanking will be obvious.
If you throttle back the 4x10 output to that of the 1x15, it is totally loafing.
It takes a T48 bass horn 4x the input power to do an SPL match at 40 Hz with a D410-XLT above 100 Hz.

IMO, if you want more noise, stack a 2nd 4x10 same as the first.
If you don't like the low bass of the original, you will not like a pair of 4x10 any better. Change cabs.

iualum · #10 03-04-2013, 06:04 AM

Silly? Well, yes. Go 2 x 410 or 2 x 115.

**MetalcoreBP** · #11 03-04-2013, 06:25 AM

Not to hijack the thread, but I have a 410 and was wondering if a 215 is typically louder than a 410? I found a 215 that I can get for what I can sell my 410 for.

Same impedance, same manufacturer.

iualum · #12 03-04-2013, 09:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MetalcoreBP

Not to hijack the thread, but I have a 410 and was wondering if a 215 is typically louder than a 410? I found a 215 that I can get for what I can sell my 410 for.

Same impedance, same manufacturer.

Also depends on if they're from the same "series" of cabs from the manufacturer. If they are, I'd guess quality of components would be similar. And generally then, they'd be close, with the 215 winning. Due to the dimensions, more rectangular vs. square, the 215 would likely be an easier schlep, too. Plus, the 215 would probably be a least a few pounds lighter.

**WoodyJ** · #13 03-04-2013, 09:30 AM

I had a Mesa PH 4x10 and 1x15 stack and it just didn't work. The 4x10 carried most of the volume and the 1x15 might as well have not been there.

To my ear, either cabinet sounded better individually than when they were together. I sold the 1x15, still have the 4x10 which isn't being used as I'm just doing studio work nowadays.

tishtash · #14 03-06-2013, 04:30 PM

I want to thank all of you for your responses, even the OMG

I ended up hunting down my missing eden 2x10 cab (long story) and have for the mean time, decided to replace the speakers (Eminence Kappa Pro10A 500w) and see how that sounds.

If it doesn't work for me I'll most likely end up selling both cabs and getting a solid 4x or 6x. I've learned a lot from this experience, so big thanks! ...i've also learned that it's time to up the watts in my head! but that's for another thread.

Fair Warning · #15 03-06-2013, 04:36 PM

The 410 and 115 stack has been a standard for quite some time. Just do it. I know the watch makers around here talk it down, but it works just fine for many pro acts.

rzpooch · #16 03-06-2013, 05:00 PM

Why not run thru the PA and stay with the 2x10?

BassmanPaul · #17 03-06-2013, 05:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Fair Warning

The 410 and 115 stack has been a standard for quite some time. Just do it. I know the watch makers around here talk it down, but it works just fine for many pro acts.

Yes indeed it has become a standard. Unfortunately it's not a good pairing with the 15 being a weak link. OP please do a search on the subject. There's a lot of info there as this topic comes up every couple of days!

markkoelsch · #18 03-06-2013, 05:11 PM

Either get another matching 15 or ditch the 15 alltogether and just use the 410. A good 410 is a solid performer and most can take a fair amount of power. Heck, find a used Peavey 410TX...they sound good and can take a bunch of power.

Sundogue · #19 03-06-2013, 05:35 PM

I think 115 cabs make wonderful stands for 410 cabs.

Silly? Only if you connect the 115 to your amp.

bryan gibson · #20 03-06-2013, 05:39 PM

[quote=tishtash;13969842]Hello all!

I currently play through a single mesa 15 with an ashdown evoII 350 head. Before I had the 15 I had an eden 2x10 but blew both speakers and lost the cab.

Now the band is playing bigger venues and I need/want bigger sound. I am working with a very limited budget of $400 and here are two used options.

1.) Hartke 2x10 (speakers placed diagonal, no horn) with tone tubby speakers for $130. This is tempting for the speakers alone even if I ditch the hartke and throw these into another enclosure.

......This box is at the GC in Stl/Crestwood, correct? FWIW, if you cross the river and hit up the GC at Fairview, they have a used Carvin redeye 410 for around $160.