Which 4x12? Bergie or Traynor?

Stanley Design · #1 10-19-2010, 01:59 PM

My band is excessively loud. I run a stereo rig containing the following.

G&L L2000 tuned to D-standard
Traynor YCS100 into Traynor 215S 2x15
Traynor DB800 into Eden D410XLT 4x10

I'm looking to sell the Eden and replace it with a 4x12, and eventually replace the 2x15 with the same 4x12. I have my choice narrowed down to two at the exact same price and am not sure which one to buy. Which one should I buy and why?

Bergantino NV412

Configuration: 4x12", sealed cabinet design
Woofer: 4-12" woofers with vented pole pieces
Tweeter: none
Frequency Response: 45Hz to 4.5kHz
Power Handling: 800 watts (continuous unclipped power)
Impedance: 4 ohm
Connection: two 1/4" jacks, two Neutrik Speakon
Dimensions: 36"H x 24"W x 15"D
Weight: 108 lbs.
Handle: two side mounted handles, one recessed cup handle top/center, tilt back castors
Covering: black Tolex

Traynor TC412

Cabinet Program Power (Watts) 900 / 450 (x2)
Cabinet Impedance (Ohms) 4
Speaker Configuration - LF (Size / Power) 4x12''
Frequency Response (Hz +/-3dB) 40 - 18k
Inputs 2 Speakon / 2 1/4-inch
Other Features Metal Corners
Tiltback Wheels
Metal side, top and bottom bar handles
16 guage punched metal grille
Dimensions (DWH, inches) 18.5 x 24.25 x 43.25
Weight (lbs / kg) 112 / 50.8

From what I can see, the traynor has less power handling (program is less than continuous right?) but has much better handles for transportation. But I'm pushing the DB800 to it's max, so if it can't handle 800w easily it's no good to me. What do you think?

babebambi · #2 10-19-2010, 02:31 PM

I had a 410 xlt but I had no experience with the 215 you have

between the two 412
the traynor has a bigger box and is also ported, it will likely give you a deeper bass
it also goes higher with the tweeter
the berg is a sealed cab, which gives you a higher (also smoother) bass roll off

these are two very different inherent tone
do you use the tweeter on your eden?

by definition continuous power is more demanding than program power
but in reality, most bass cab is limited by displacement in the bass region
thus, the number by itself really does not tell you much

I think they can both handle the DB800
how's your EQ like?

Stanley Design · #3 10-19-2010, 03:05 PM

My EQ is pretty flat on both amps, but I bump my mids up on both a little bit. I run my tweeter on my eden but not wide open. I'm not really concerned about losing it. You're right about the bigger box probably being better for low end. I'm leaning towards the Traynor, as I often do.

rockstarbassist · #4 10-19-2010, 03:29 PM

If you want extreme crushing volume while still having FTW tone, get a Mesa 412.
If you want a not as crushing volume cab that is still extremely loud with a "sweeter" tone, get the Berg.

Randall · #5 10-19-2010, 04:38 PM

Keep in mind that the Berg will cost a lot more (400ish) especially if you want to buy two of them.
Not much wheeling and dealing on price of Bergs in Canada anyway that I found.

BigOldHarry · #6 10-19-2010, 04:39 PM

If I had to choose: BERG.

bassvi · #7 10-19-2010, 04:46 PM

+1 on the Mesa 4x12, that's got to be a killer cab. You might also want to check out the GK412 or a Marshall VB412.

Personally, I would go with the Berg. My NV610 is loud AND clear. I love it!

Stanley Design · #8 10-19-2010, 05:03 PM

They are both $1400.

I've checked out the other brands, these are the two that I've narrowed it down to, although the Mesa is nice.

PWV · #9 10-19-2010, 05:19 PM

I wouldn't let the handles affect your decision - the Berg has a tilt-back in the middle (can't see in that pic) and its really easy to tip and lift into a vehicle. I say get the BERG! It is powerful loud!

JGR · #10 10-19-2010, 05:20 PM

Berg!

Stanley Design · #11 10-19-2010, 05:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by PWV

I wouldn't let the handles affect your decision - the Berg has a tilt-back in the middle (can't see in that pic) and its really to tip and lift into a vehicle. I say get the BERG! It is powerful loud!

Yeah I just like how the traynor has handles on the bottom too. Lots of Berg love though and I'm still split right down the middle. I wish there were a way to test them both, but I don't have reasonable access to either. I will say that just the thought of "having two bergantino 4x12's" sounds more amazing than "having two traynor 4x12's".

Just for fun, here's my rig.

bassist4dalord · #12 10-19-2010, 05:46 PM

You can buy handles and have them installed. I'm considering buying some for my GK MB115, just because it's awkward to carry with only the top strap-thing.

Stanley Design · #13 10-19-2010, 06:04 PM

Also, does anyone have any pictures of heavily gigged bergs? I know a lot of guys on here have them but also they normally look very well kept. I mean there's never a bad review, I've never heard a complaint about them. Is anyone on board for the traynor?

MrDOS · #14 10-19-2010, 06:36 PM

I've been following this thread with interest. I recently filled in with a band that was so loud that my trusty 9-year-old Bergantino HT310 was not quite loud enough at rehearsal. Lucky for me, at the gig, the volume was much more manageable, and my stage volume was probably a little hot.
At the risk of sounding like a geezer, is your band really that loud that the above rig is not cutting it?
My Berg is heavily gigged, but its design is different than the NV412.

Anthbass · #15 10-19-2010, 07:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stanley Design

My band is excessively loud. I run a stereo rig containing the following.

G&L L2000 tuned to D-standard
Traynor YCS100 into Traynor 215S 2x15
Traynor DB800 into Eden D410XLT 4x10

I'm looking to sell the Eden and replace it with a 4x12, and eventually replace the 2x15 with the same 4x12. I have my choice narrowed down to two at the exact same price and am not sure which one to buy. Which one should I buy and why?

Bergantino NV412

Traynor TC412

From what I can see, the traynor has less power handling (program is less than continuous right?) but has much better handles for transportation. But I'm pushing the DB800 to it's max, so if it can't handle 800w easily it's no good to me. What do you think?

I thought street pricing on the Traynor was supposed to be around the $1000 mark? Clubbass lists the NV610 for $1300. I haven't tried either one, yet. If you are playing loud and often, you may have better warranty service buying the Traynor. I haven't hear many bad things about Bergantino products, though, so it essentially comes down to which cab will do what you want at a price ya can live with. If you do go with the Traynor, I'd love some pics and a report.

Stanley Design · #16 10-19-2010, 07:19 PM

The Traynor clocked in at $1175 from L&M earlier today. Plus tax that is $1350.

ishouldbeking · #17 10-19-2010, 07:44 PM

I think an Aguilar DB412 should probably be added to your list...

babebambi · #18 10-19-2010, 10:49 PM

is there no chance that you can try them both first?

I Forget · #19 10-19-2010, 11:18 PM

I know you said you've already narrowed down your choices but given you don't have the opportunity to try any of them before you buy, is there any chance you can source one of these?

1200w power handling and 57lbs (!) is a nice start.

Thornton Davis · #20 10-20-2010, 07:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stanley Design

The Traynor clocked in at $1175 from L&M earlier today. Plus tax that is $1350.

That's list price. You can knock $100.00 - $150.00 off that from any L&M store.

As for the power rating, initially the TC412 was going to have a switch that would allow it to be run either stereo (spliting 2x12's into pairs @ 450 watts each) or mono.

Yorkville decided not to install the mode switch, so it CAN NOT be run stereo, only mono. The power rating for mono is 900 watts.

I checked the TC412 out a couple of weeks ago. It's impressive to say the least. If you've got the man power to move it and a big enough vehicle to transport it, go for it.

TD