Aguilar - Official 'Tone Hammer 500' 3.8lbs 500w Thread #3

[SpinyNorman]

Originally Posted by ceerod

I totally agree and appreciate the advice. So...I just ordered (2) 8ohm DB212's. The chocolate thunder I wanted wasn't in stock so may take a bit longer but I don't mind waiting. Can't wait...but now I gotta sell all my Ampeg gear to recoup some $$$!

Lol. I listed my SVT-CL and SVT-610HLF on Craigslist-Chicago yesterday. I might have a buyer this evening. I certainly hope he shows up before my new DB112, or the Ampeg is going to have to sit out on my balcony.

[SpinyNorman]

Originally Posted by Dominoes

Thanks. Any other opinions on GS vs DB vs SL 112? I'm about to buy one with a TH500, and don't have any local stores to test them.

Unless weight is an issue (in favor of the SL), I think the DB would be the best choice. There doesn't appear to be a lot of love for the GS series around here.

[Dominoes]

Originally Posted by SpinyNorman

Unless weight is an issue (in favor of the SL), I think the DB would be the best choice. There doesn't appear to be a lot of love for the GS series around here.

Intresting; the last time I was on Talkbass looking at amps, circa ~2006, the GS-112 was highly recommended.

[rodl2005]

Ebb & flow. The GS112's scooped mids are cool for some. The love on here for em back then pushed me into getting one & it worked well as a stand alone 112 for my upright.
Eventually tho when using it for electric,I found it's shy mids a li'l much & found Berg 112's & I've still got them.
If I'd not had a crook back at the time, I think a couple of DB112's or the 212 would've been in my garage.
I find I'm using the TH500 more & more lately. It just "works". No fuss.
Sounds great, excellent eq, great DI, small, light, powerful.... What more?

[DrumsAndBass]

Originally Posted by SpinyNorman

Unless weight is an issue (in favor of the SL), I think the DB would be the best choice. There doesn't appear to be a lot of love for the GS series around here.

SpinyNorman,
I gigged with a pair of GS 210 cabs and an AG 500sc for 7 years. Don't know about the GS 112's. But yes!, the GS series do sound great. I did not have any problems with the so called mid scoop that many write about.

[rodl2005]

Originally Posted by DrumsAndBass

SpinyNorman,
I gigged with a pair of GS 210 cabs and an AG 500sc for 7 years. Don't know about the GS 112's. But yes!, the GS series do sound great. I did not have any problems with the so called mid scoop that many write about.

Edited my above post. My experience is only with the GS112
It's mid scoop presents as a smooth sound & doesn't give a great punch at a volume my current 12's can.
As I said tho, I did like it & it did a great job for a few yrs, especially with upright.

[blowinblue]

Originally Posted by SpinyNorman

There doesn't appear to be a lot of love for the GS series around here.

I can't speak for 'around here' but at my house there is a lot of love for a certain GS 212. It sounds great with my TH 500. But my idea of 'bass' is probably different than many folks.

Originally Posted by rodl2005

Ebb & flow.

Ebb & flow indeed. Flavor of the month, flavor of the year, etc. And everyone prefers a different flavor. For some odd reason I just remembered that thread from 2007 about the GS 112 being poorly designed and constructed. I'd post a link to that thread but...I just couldn't bring myself to do that. I have standards, people.

M. M.

[tbone0813]

I originally planned to pair my TH 500 with a DB112 but I have an opportunity to pick up an AE112 really cheap. How does the TH 500 pair with an AE112? Anyone with experience care to weigh in? Thanks.

[rodl2005]

I like it, I use it with one or 2 AE112's with good results. I like it with my NV412 better & I haven't used it with an Aggy DB cab at all tho.
Altho it may be suited to more "vintage" voiced cabs, I dunno, but the
TH500 & 2 AE112's is a rig I use frequently & enjoy.
Sorry I ain't up on describing nuances of tone like some tho :-/

[KJung]

Originally Posted by blowinblue

I can't speak for 'around here' but at my house there is a lot of love for a certain GS 212. It sounds great with my TH 500. But my idea of 'bass' is probably different than many folks.



Ebb & flow indeed. Flavor of the month, flavor of the year, etc. And everyone prefers a different flavor. For some odd reason I just remembered that thread from 2007 about the GS 112 being poorly designed and constructed. I'd post a link to that thread but...I just couldn't bring myself to do that. I have standards, people.

M. M.

The GS cabs are fine cabs and I remember when they came out, they were among the first small cabs with a 12 that you could do a moderate sized gig with. Many still dig them. I greatly prefer the DB112 now, since it has the same components as the GS112 (from what the Aguilar guys posted here when they were introduced), but a more stiff cabinet and different tuning that results in similar low end and volume of the GS112, but a more present midrange response which also maked the tweeter seem more integrated. I have not played the SL cabs, so can't comment there.

The GS cabs are made quite well. I think you might be remembering a lower priced line of cabs that Aguilar put out a while back (can't remember the name), but they didn't go over that well from what I remember.

Regarding the TH500, you can think about the cab matching with that head similarly to the DB750 (since they are in a similar tone family). For many, a cabinet with more midrange response helps balance out the big low end of the TH500, and allows you to better use the powerful semi-parametric mid control for tone sculpting versus just 'filling a hole' in a cabs voicing. IMO. That head sounds magnificent to me with the DB112's, and very good with the Bergantino AE410, 210, and the AE112. The AE212 is kind of a different thing, and is a bit more wide and relaxed sounding, and I've run into room where I had a hard time sounding 'big and punchy' at the same time.

[KJung]

Originally Posted by tbone0813

I originally planned to pair my TH 500 with a DB112 but I have an opportunity to pick up an AE112 really cheap. How does the TH 500 pair with an AE112? Anyone with experience care to weigh in? Thanks.

Grab it! The only downside is that it might be a long time before you can find a second one.

[blowinblue]

Originally Posted by KJung

The GS cabs are made quite well. I think you might be remembering a lower priced like of cabs that Aguilar put out a while back (can't remember the name), but they didn't go over that well from what I remember.

I agree that the GS (and DB) cabs are made with quality. I've peeked inside both. The thread I referred to was specifically about the GS 112. Someone had started a thread giving their reasons why they thought the GS 112 was a poorly constructed product. The sparks started to fly. After 12 pages the thread was (mercifully) closed down. A total waste of bandwidth, IMO. But hey...this is Talkbass.

M. M.

[SpinyNorman]

I got a chance to try my Fender American Standard V with my TH500/GB Focus 2 x 112 rig this weekend, and I was not impressed.

First, wow, talk about midrange. I had been primarily playing my P bass though the stack, but the passive Jazz has almost too much mid.

The real problem was with the low B. There was just nothing there. An open E sounded great, but anything B through Db on the B string sounded compressed as hell. I was expecting the floor to shake, and instead I could barely hear it.

I'm curious if this is the cabinets, or the head. I assume it's the cabinets. Anyone regularly play a five string through the Focus cabinets?

[GRoberts]

I would ditch those cabs. They are great for the money, but a 'sonic compromise'. I tried the TH500 with a very tight, focused, midrange dominant Bergantino AE410. Bumped the low end on the TG500 to 2 O'clock and holy cow was it ever amazing! Punchy, articulate. VERY nice. I would say the issue is not the amp. But you do have a midrange prominent amp and bass in that equation. Perhaps too many mids all the way around. Still, I think you can do much better with different cabs. That's my theory.

Originally Posted by SpinyNorman

I got a chance to try my Fender American Standard V with my TH500/GB Focus 2 x 112 rig this weekend, and I was not impressed.

First, wow, talk about midrange. I had been primarily playing my P bass though the stack, but the passive Jazz has almost too much mid.

The real problem was with the low B. There was just nothing there. An open E sounded great, but anything B through Db on the B string sounded compressed as hell. I was expecting the floor to shake, and instead I could barely hear it.

I'm curious if this is the cabinets, or the head. I assume it's the cabinets. Anyone regularly play a five string through the Focus cabinets?

[KJung]

Originally Posted by SpinyNorman

I got a chance to try my Fender American Standard V with my TH500/GB Focus 2 x 112 rig this weekend, and I was not impressed.

First, wow, talk about midrange. I had been primarily playing my P bass though the stack, but the passive Jazz has almost too much mid.

The real problem was with the low B. There was just nothing there. An open E sounded great, but anything B through Db on the B string sounded compressed as hell. I was expecting the floor to shake, and instead I could barely hear it.

I'm curious if this is the cabinets, or the head. I assume it's the cabinets. Anyone regularly play a five string through the Focus cabinets?

It is not the head Those little Focus cabs are nice, but they are what they are.. small, relatively inexpensive, and relatively midrange voiced. The TH500 puts out BIG low end, which can actually result in LESS perceived low end if you have small cabs that aren't reproducing those frequencies efficiently (or at all).

That being said, just like with the filters on the Markbass heads, there is a LOT of user error with the TH500. The drive control is not a 'distortion control', but more of an 'old school knob' which will roll of low end and top end significantly. If you have that knob up a bit with a small midrangey cab(s), well, you will get nothing but midrange!

[jumblemind]

Now you tell me. I have a couple of Focus 1x12 cabs arriving tomorrow to pair with my TH500. However, even with a 1x15 sealed cab, I haven't noticed all the low end from this amp people are describing, and I leave the Drive knob completely off. I get more low end boom from my little mb200. It just sounds like a great tube amp to me. Haven't noticed any special scoops or bumps in any range (aside from not having any high end treble, just like an old tube amp). It does seem very naturally compressed, which I'm trying to get used to. I was actually looking forward to the Focus 12's to get better dispersion and more hi fi sound with the horns.

[GRoberts]

Originally Posted by jumblemind

Now you tell me. I have a couple of Focus 1x12 cabs arriving tomorrow to pair with my TH500. However, even with a 1x15 sealed cab, I haven't noticed all the low end from this amp people are describing, and I leave the Drive knob completely off. I get more low end boom from my little mb200. Sounds like a great tube amp to me. Haven't noticed any special scoops or bumps in any range. It does seem very naturally compressed, which I'm trying to get used to. I was actually looking forward to the Focus 12's to get better dispersion and more hi fi sound with the horns.

Do you bump the Low End EQ on your TH500 to 2 O'clock or leave it at noon or less? That amp is very responsive to EQ changes. Don't be afraid to twist the knobs!

[jumblemind]

Originally Posted by GRoberts

Do you bump the Low End EQ on your TH500 to 2 O'clock or leave it at noon or less? That amp is very responsive to EQ changes. Don't be afraid to twist the knobs!

Hmmm, noon or less. I've pretty much left everything at noon and tried each one individually. I guess I need to twist them all in conjunction if the EQ is as interactive as described. I thought that was just a Genz Benz amp thing.

[GRoberts]

Originally Posted by jumblemind

Hmmm, noon or less. I've pretty much left everything at noon and tried each one individually. I guess I need to twist them all in conjunction if the EQ is as interactive as described. I thought that was just a Genz Benz amp thing.

Seriously, try 2 O'clock on the bass/low EQ knob. It's not boomy. Just adds a wonderful low-end bump that is very punchy, yet articulate. I think you'll love it.

[KJung]

Originally Posted by jumblemind

Hmmm, noon or less. I've pretty much left everything at noon and tried each one individually. I guess I need to twist them all in conjunction if the EQ is as interactive as described. I thought that was just a Genz Benz amp thing.

The extreme interactivity of the EQ of the TH500 with the drive and gain control is somewhat unusual, and does bring to mind the Streamliner a bit (although the tonality is very different). VERY powerful EQ that can make that amp thunder or grind/growl like a monster with a few simple twists of the knob.

I would recommend starting by turning the gain control down lower than you might usually on other amps (it really is more like a tube preamp in that there is lots of grind and grit added when you turn up that gain), turn the drive completely off, and set all the tone controls flat (noon).

Start by boosting the bass control just a very small amount (less than 1 o'clock), and then boost the midrange volume to 1 o'clock and sweep the freq control. Dial in something that sounds good, and now start playing with the gain and drive control levels, adjusting the master to keep the volume constant.

Amazing variety of tones in there.