Ampeg SVT-410HLF Farting Out

jeremynyc · #1 05-22-2011, 07:51 PM

Has anyone else experienced awful "farting out" with the Ampeg 410HLF cabinet?

I have an Ampeg SVT-CL (2005ish USA made) and play mostly with a 76 p bass with roundwounds.

When I play a "C" on the E string I get a terrible farting sound. It's like the cabinet just can't handle the volume. However, I'm really not turning up the SVT that loud. I have the gain on 6 and the master around 3. All other controls flat.

I took the whole rig to a respected tech here in NYC to have him look it over. It's not the head, I just had it retubed with JJs. And he didn't find anything broken with cabinet. No speakers are blown and there aren't any weird wiring phase issues. Nothing obvious was rattling around. After looking at it for a week he determined that is was just a poorly made unit.

It's just plain unusable, which is surprising to me as its such a popular cab. I've played this particular configuration of SVT with 410HLF many times before too and have had none of these issues. Also, I just did a string of gigs in Vegas with the same band and I used an Ampeg SVT-CL but with the 410HE and it sounded great. No farting or breakup at reasonable volume.

Is this a common thing anyone else has experienced? What gives with the 410HLF, is it just poorly designed and can't handle an SVT?!?

Wes Whitmore · #2 05-23-2011, 08:27 PM

Well, you haven't got much help here. I'll ask a few questions to get some discussion going. First off, is your EQ flat on your bass?
Pull the grill off. Is it the cab vibrating, or a speaker(s) making the offensive noise? I had a cab that vibrated on F's, no matter where I played them on the neck. Turned out to be a loose speaker magnet. Also, are your speakers creased? A crease is a fold-over where the cone and surround are glued together when the speakers are in the out position. You can see lines i the carboard, and if you manually push the speaker out with your fingers, you can see them fold at that crease. That means they were overworked at some point in their life. Hope this gets you started.
Wes

jgroh · #3 05-23-2011, 08:30 PM

Let me just say that I run my Little Mark II (at 500 watts) through my 410HLF and have no problem with farting out. If there isnt anything wrong with the cab then like Wes said, what is your EQ settings?

JimmyM · #4 05-24-2011, 01:01 AM

have you tried it in various locations to find out if it's something in the room faking you out? if it's only on the C, that sounds more like sympathetic vibrations and not a problem with the cab, unless there's something in the cab causing it.

vivifiction · #5 05-24-2011, 01:08 AM

I've had that problem twice, yet neither time has my 410HLF been the culprit. The first time was due to a wiring issue with a 9v in an active bass, and the second was a situation more like yours where no one could find an issue. I decided to replace the (tested and seemingly fine) speaker cable in a last-ditch effort and with a new cable, no more fartsies.

Arjank · #6 05-24-2011, 02:18 AM

Maybe it's your bass.
The C on your E-string might be a "wolf" tone, this is the opposite of a deadspot, thus increasing the volume instead of decreasing it. If this is the case, the C on your E-string will generate a higher ouput(signal) and might distort the pre-amp.
Did you try a different bass with your setup?
Did you also try to play with a light touch and then turning up the master level?

jeremynyc · #7 05-24-2011, 07:55 AM

I'm playing a 70s p bass with round wounds. Volume and tone are rolled full up. Eq on the amp is straight up and down at noon... So "flat" as can be.
The problem certainly lessens if I turn down the bass and the volume, but it seems like this cab should really be able to handle it.

As for the speaker creases or loose magnets I'd assume that's what the tech was looking for. He didn't find anything like that.
Maybe I just got a lemon? I certainly won't be buying another 410hlf. I actually did enjoy the 410he. I get so much low end from the svt-cl that the ports on the hlf are too much anyway. Not to mention that it seems like every club in America has their subwoofers right under the stage. I need tight bass... Not loose floppy bass.
Any 410 recommendations?
I'd use an 810 but it's too huge and heavy.

lbwdog · #8 05-24-2011, 08:00 AM

Does it fart on the surrounding notes on the same string (B,Bb,C,C#)?
Does it do it with the same notes on the A string?

jeremynyc · #9 05-24-2011, 08:06 AM

It's not the room. This happened every night in every room on a national tour. It's also not the bass... I've played 100s of gigs with that bass for the last 5years and never had that problem.
I will say that it also happens on the "c" on the A string but not as bad. The c on the e string is always a bit louder.
It would be pretty wild if it was the speaker cable!

lbwdog · #10 05-24-2011, 08:14 AM

So, no B,Bb,C#,D ? Just on C?
Sounds like something is vibrating in sympathy with that particular frequency then. I'd try tightening every screw on that cab, including the speaker mounts, crossover, handles, corners, etc. also try it without the grill in place.

allexcosta · #11 05-24-2011, 08:49 AM

Pairing an Ampeg SVT 410HLF

jeremynyc · #12 05-24-2011, 09:35 AM

It happens on the surrounding notes too, but not quite as much. Spoke to the tech again today he thinks te speakers are just underpowered for the head. I could spend $ replacing the speakers but I'd rather just buy a better cab. I do like the ampeg vibe though.
Not a fan of Eden or epifani at all. Aguilar is not so bad. Anyone try the ampeg pro neo 410? Has a higher power rating and is lighter which I like...

lbwdog · #13 05-24-2011, 08:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jeremynyc

It happens on the surrounding notes too, but not quite as much. Spoke to the tech again today he thinks te speakers are just underpowered for the head.

It still could be sympathetic vibration, since it manifests itself at a narrow frequency range. In my experience, drivers that fart from over excursion will do it more so as frequency goes lower.

I will say, I passed on the 410 HLF in favor of SWR Goliath III when I switched to tens in 2005. The main reason was, the HLF distorted and farted at a considerably lower volume than the G III.

Phendyr_Loon · #14 05-24-2011, 08:21 PM

I've had a 410 HLF fart out from jacking the gain up on a underpowered head. I was trying to compete with a 100w Marshall that my guitardist refused to turn down.

One time I saw all 4 drivers literally light up. I had the gain up a bit to high and as soon as the feedback started all four cones illuminated as if I had a lamp inside the cab. I though the cab was fried, I gigged it for 2 years before selling it.

Jeff Scott · #15 05-24-2011, 10:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Phendyr_Loon

One time I saw all 4 drivers literally light up. I had the gain up a bit to high and as soon as the feedback started all four cones illuminated as if I had a lamp inside the cab. I though the cab was fried, I gigged it for 2 years before selling it.

Uh, there is a lamp inside the cabinet. It is part of the horn protection system.

lbwdog · #16 05-24-2011, 10:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jeff Scott

Uh, there is a lamp inside the cabinet. It is part of the horn protection system.

AW, the story was better when the cones were on fire!!

jelwood · #17 05-24-2011, 10:09 PM

Have had this issue before, it was wolf notes with my bass. I know you've had that bass for a long time, but try a different one anyways. You will be surprised.

JimmyM · #18 05-25-2011, 12:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jeremynyc

It happens on the surrounding notes too, but not quite as much. Spoke to the tech again today he thinks te speakers are just underpowered for the head.

i don't. that's a pretty high power handling 410, and ampeg ratings are generally real world based.

georgestrings · #19 05-25-2011, 04:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JimmyM

i don't. that's a pretty high power handling 410, and ampeg ratings are generally real world based.

I agree with Jimmy - I've owned a couple of those cabs, and pushed them pretty hard with some 400-600 watt heads, and never had the OP's problem with them...

In all honesty, I'd question a tech's knowledge/ability if he told me that an SVT-CL was too powerful for the speakers in an SVT-410HLF... There's something else going on here...

- georgestrings

jeremynyc · #20 05-25-2011, 07:38 AM

It's not the bass, I've played it through so many different amps and I've NEVER had the same problem. I think it's something with the cabinet or maybe this particular run of ampeg cabs... I know they switch speakers in the same model as the years go by.
Thing is I've played other svt-cl and 410hlf stacks with the same bass in the same band (rental backline) and they don't do this either.
I guess it's comforting to know that most 410hlf are ok but i wouldn't buy another one or bother trying to repair this one especially if there's nothing "obviously" wrong with it. By the time I replaced all the speakers I might as well just get a nicer/better can anyway.