Another Guitar Center Rant

[Rockmusician]

Sorry for the long post, but I appreciate your help and opinions.

I am not usually one to beat up on Guitar Center. I have actually had more good than bad experiences. However, I stopped going there about 5 years ago when their new assistant manager offered me $500 for a 1976 Fender Precision. It wasn't the offer that bothered me. It was his attitude. He tried to convince me that they would only be able to get $700 for it even though he had a 1978 in much worse condition hanging on the wall with a price of $2,000. I left and sold in on Craigslist for $1,000 the same day.
Recently, I sold my GK rig with the intention of getting an Eden or an EBS rig. I found several used Eden 410 XLT's on Guitar Center's website. One was at a store located about an hour away. When I arrived, I couldn't find the cab. I asked for help. At that point a guy about mid 40's showed up and said he never heard of Eden. Here is how the conversation went:

GC Employee Mike: Are you the guy asking abount an Eden 410?
Me: Yes
Mike: What the hell is it? I have never heard of it.
Me: Eden makes high end boutique bass amps and cabs.
Mike: Eden? As in the Barbara Eden?
Me :Yes!
Mike: As in the garden of Eden?
Me: Yes!
Mike: As in E-D-E-N?
Me: YES!
Mike: Never heard of them, it must be crap!
Other GC Employee: Oh, yeah, they make bass stuff. We have a cab out back with a blown speaker. Would you like me to get it for you?
Me: NO!

So I leave an go to another GC about 1 1/2 hours further away. The assistant manager and I had exchanged several emails about the cab and he assured me that it was in great condition. So I make the drive. I get there and plug it in. It sounds good but I can tell that there is something wrong. I watch the speakers as I play and notice that the one on the bottom right is not moving. It has a blown speaker. So now I am 2 1/2 hours away from home and have nothing to show for it. I am obviously pissed but the assiatant at this store is extremely apologetic and says that he will do whatever it takes to make me happy. He is very bbusy and tells another employee to do whatever it takes to make me happy. The employee suggests SWR, Genz Benz, Ampeg and Mark Bass. I pass. They offer to get the bad speaker replaced and give me a deeper discount. But then the assistant manager acknowledges that if one speaker is bad, the others can't be far behind. I left my house at 11:30 and got home at 6:30. So I ended up spending the day driving around for nothing. In the meantime, I find an online seller with an Eden WT 800 and a 410 XLT cab. He claims that they are both in great condition and will sell them to me for $1,100. Then he sends me an email stating that the head is at the tech's shop so shipping could be delayed. There is also a local seller with an EBS Fafner head (the older discontinued model) , EBS Proline 210 cab and Proline 115 Cab that I can buy for $1,200. Not sure what to do. I love EBS but expansion is limited because it can run at 2 ohms but their cabs are 4 ohms which means I can only run 2 cabs. Eden cabs come in 4 or 8 ohm which means if I buy 8 ohm cabs, I can use four 410 cabs. My guitar player uses 2 Marshall 412 cabs on each side of the stage and I want to make sure I can be heard. Not sure if I should buy the slightly used EBS rig even though it is limited in terms of expansion or go for the Eden.

[IvanMike]

OK - let's forget guitar center for a second.

What Arenas are you playing?

None?

There is NO WAY your guitar player should be using 4 4x12 cabs. This is a waste of amplification. Guitar tube amps are meant to be played a certain volume to get "the sound". Almost every time this cab be done with a 20-30 watt 1x12 combo - honest.

[B-string]

Originally Posted by IvanMike

OK - let's forget guitar center for a second.

What Arenas are you playing?

None?

There is NO WAY your guitar player should be using 4 4x12 cabs. This is a waste of amplification. Guitar tube amps are meant to be played a certain volume to get "the sound". Almost every time this cab be done with a 20-30 watt 1x12 combo - honest.

Exactly! But there is no adolescent wood happening with a combo? Guitards

[IvanMike]

Yeah no wood.

My main GP uses some classic vintage fender amps most of the time.

The Vibroverb and the Bassman sound great - but are too LOUD for most places we play. Most times a Vibroluxe or a Deluxe is more than enough and are FRIGHTENINGLY LOUD.

Meanwhile I'm pumping 600 watts through a 15 and a 12. For large outdoor gigs double that.

[Marko5657]

I thought my guitard with a fender twin and 12 SS peavey (for da stereo) was nuts… well, actually I still do, but damn…

That said, sorry for the OP, what a bad day.

[Rockmusician]

Originally Posted by IvanMike

OK - let's forget guitar center for a second.

What Arenas are you playing?

None?

There is NO WAY your guitar player should be using 4 4x12 cabs. This is a waste of amplification. Guitar tube amps are meant to be played a certain volume to get "the sound". Almost every time this cab be done with a 20-30 watt 1x12 combo - honest.

First of all, you have no idea who I am so you shouldn't even be making the statement you made. I have played at more than 3,000 shows. Been a technical advisor for concerts to raise money for victims of The Station Night Club fire in Rhode Island where 100 people lost their lives during a Great White show. I have also played at several benefits for victims of the terrorist attacks of 9/11 including several on an aircraft carrier for the sailors who protect our country. I have worked with Mark Farner ( formerly of Grand Funk Railroad), Rick Derringer, rTodd Rundgren, Christopher Cross, Alan Parsons, Jack Bruce, Tim McGraw, Steve Murphy (Trans Siberian Orchestra),John Cafferty and the Beaver Brown Band, The Walk Down Abbey Road Tour (look it up if you don't know what it is),appeared on national television and provided music for a Fox Sports Original Series. I was recently asked to join a band featuring a guitarist who has played with Rick Derringer and Lynyrd Skynyrd. By the way, I accepted and made it through the first rehearsal. I am currently vice president of a company that provides music to television, movies, websites, corporate videos and support for live performance. The largest audience I have played to is 25,000. What have you played lately?


And by the way, you didn't even address the issue in my original post.

[Downunderwonder]

Yeah, right.

[Nalte]

Even assuming you are playing for an audience of 25,000, your guitarist still doesn't need four 412 cabs. That's what the PA is for.

[spaz21387]

my guitarist runs 4' 4x12 cabs. I run a 2 channel bi amp 2 ohm per channel carvin head and 2' 2x15 cabs and a swr 6x10 and a random 2x10 and im still louder...

[Downunderwonder]

Apparently Kevin really is a bigshot shopping at GC, I stand corrected.

[B-string]

Originally Posted by Rockmusician

First of all, you have no idea who I am so you shouldn't even be making the statement you made. I have played at more than 3,000 shows. Been a technical advisor for concerts to raise money for victims of The Station Night Club fire in Rhode Island where 100 people lost their lives during a Great White show. I have also played at several benefits for victims of the terrorist attacks of 9/11 including several on an aircraft carrier for the sailors who protect our country. I have worked with Mark Farner ( formerly of Grand Funk Railroad), Rick Derringer, rTodd Rundgren, Christopher Cross, Alan Parsons, Jack Bruce, Tim McGraw, Steve Murphy (Trans Siberian Orchestra),John Cafferty and the Beaver Brown Band, The Walk Down Abbey Road Tour (look it up if you don't know what it is),appeared on national television and provided music for a Fox Sports Original Series. I was recently asked to join a band featuring a guitarist who has played with Rick Derringer and Lynyrd Skynyrd. By the way, I accepted and made it through the first rehearsal. I am currently vice president of a company that provides music to television, movies, websites, corporate videos and support for live performance. The largest audience I have played to is 25,000. What have you played lately?


And by the way, you didn't even address the issue in my original post.

With a resume like that you should KNOW better than to troll GC for used equipment. The largest I've played to is 150,000 in case you were going to ask and our lead used ONE Marshall stack for "show". The bottom 412 was not plugged in, the PA did ALL the work. Peace

[The1bassist06]

Originally Posted by B-string

With a resume like that you should KNOW better than to troll GC for used equipment. The largest I've played to is 150,000 in case you were going to ask and our lead used ONE Marshall stack for "show". The bottom 412 was not plugged in, the PA did ALL the work. Peace

Ac/Dc uses all there 10 of there Tube full stacks and Cliff uses 2 Ampeg 8x10s. And that is for a concert of like 200,000+ people . Just sayin.

[AwkwardLoudness]

You expect too much out of Guitar Center. Why would anyone drive that far to go GC?


As a guitarist, I sometimes play through a quad of vintage Hiwatt 4x12 cabs, but I always let the bassist use one of my rigs if I do that. I've always got something that will keep up.

Originally Posted by Nalte

Even assuming you are playing for an audience of 25,000, your guitarist still doesn't need four 412 cabs. That's what the PA is for.

Not all of us play at locations that have a PA system. Certain styles that I play such as noise rock and shoegaze must be super loud whether it's 30 people or 500 people in the audience. With a quad of 4x12 cabs, i.e. two full stacks, I can control the left-right panning and ping pong delay effects. Most sound men won't work with me on that stuff.

[erock138]

Our guitarist uses a 25W blues junior combo. Played for 14,000 people. And BTW, you should really just make a separate thread letting everyone know what you've done, since you want to fill up this thread for it. anyways, A LOT of bands have fake stacks, they don't use but one of them. There isn't a point unless you want ridicuously loud stage volume.

[azureblue]

I guess a couple of questions need to be answered:
1- a reason for preferring Eden?
2 - What didn't you like about your GK?

If you're trying to keep up with 2 4-12 stacks, you'd probably be better off with at least one 8-10 or maybe 4 12". For appearance's sake, a pair of SVT 810's will look way better than one little 4-10 box. or maybe a pair of the Acoustic 360 bottoms.

A 2-10 and 1-15 won't cut it. Been there tried that.

Doing a bit of Math, you could get 2 of the GK MB212 combos (at 38lbs, 500 watts and 2- 12" each) for prob $650 each at discount, and have a rig that weighs total a little over 75 lbs.... GK may even have the MB212 slave cabs ready by now, so you just use one combo as the preamp, and xlr to slave. If you're interested, give GK a call.

My personal opinion is that there is better out than Eden. I tried Eden way back when I moved out of a rack system that I pushed 4 Gauss 15's with, went with SWR with 2 4-10 SWR, instead, then down to 2-10 and 1-15, then went to GK MB212 I have now. That is a very surprising combo when it comes to volume. But your mileage may vary...

[The1bassist06]

Originally Posted by erock138

Our guitarist uses a 25W blues junior combo. Played for 14,000 people. And BTW, you should really just make a separate thread letting everyone know what you've done, since you want to fill up this thread for it. anyways, A LOT of bands have fake stacks, they don't use but one of them. There isn't a point unless you want ridicuously loud stage volume.

A read in a guitarworld magazine I think it was that they all are real stacks that are on and running. They are one of the loudest bands ever. I seen them live and I would definately say they are. 130Dbs
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Loudest...the_world#1972

[Marko5657]

Lol @ loud stage volume with all the education and technology we have today.

Old-school deaf rocker guys and young foolish kids who don’t think ahead.

I hope the OP at least got paid for some of those gigs.

[will33]

Originally Posted by Rockmusician

First of all, you have no idea who I am so you shouldn't even be making the statement you made. I have played at more than 3,000 shows. Been a technical advisor for concerts to raise money for victims of The Station Night Club fire in Rhode Island where 100 people lost their lives during a Great White show. I have also played at several benefits for victims of the terrorist attacks of 9/11 including several on an aircraft carrier for the sailors who protect our country. I have worked with Mark Farner ( formerly of Grand Funk Railroad), Rick Derringer, rTodd Rundgren, Christopher Cross, Alan Parsons, Jack Bruce, Tim McGraw, Steve Murphy (Trans Siberian Orchestra),John Cafferty and the Beaver Brown Band, The Walk Down Abbey Road Tour (look it up if you don't know what it is),appeared on national television and provided music for a Fox Sports Original Series. I was recently asked to join a band featuring a guitarist who has played with Rick Derringer and Lynyrd Skynyrd. By the way, I accepted and made it through the first rehearsal. I am currently vice president of a company that provides music to television, movies, websites, corporate videos and support for live performance. The largest audience I have played to is 25,000. What have you played lately?


And by the way, you didn't even address the issue in my original post.

Tell us more about yourself. Is there anything about yourself you would like the public to know? We haven't yet heard enough about you. What are your thoughts about yourself as a whole and your place within yourself? This tit ran dry....try the other one......you sir, are an ass.

[modulusman]

Buy Genz Benz and call it a day.

[JimmyM]

I think an "I do really big shows with major rock bands of the 70's and 80's who use big rigs" would have sufficed.