AudioKinesis Cabs V!!!!

[anderbass]

Originally Posted by tombowlus

I certainly don't feel as if the Hathor has anything approaching uncontrolled in the low end. That being said, HPF's are very cool devices which can often be helpful. Of course, based upon my experience with the Hathor so far, I'm guessing that you'll have less of a need with the Hathor for an HPF than you might with most other cabs.

I agree, thanks Tom.

Originally Posted by tombowlus

Minor update. I used the Hathor again at practice last night (same band, same room, same bass - which was a Lakland Skyline Duck Dunn, btw). This time, I powered it with my Mesa/Boogie WalkAbout. The WalkAbout has a more low-mid rich tone than the Orange TB500, though there are some similarities. The WalkAbout is also more warm/round in the lower half of its range. The Hathor once again sounded great. I was able to dial in some rumbley, growly lows, but still retained good pitch definition and clarity.

My only beef so far is that when I carry the cab with the speaker facing me, the protruding grill would occasionally bump into me and flex. And before anyone else says it, I will admit that I am on the "husky" side, but my belly doesn't stick out that far, really. The easy solution, of course, is to carry it with the speaker facing away from me.

Cool, I've been very interested in hearing more of your reports about the Hathor. I'd particularly love to hear your direct comparisons to the TC115. I get the feeling thats going to be the Hathors biggest competitor...

I hear ya about toting with the grill facing you, but compared to my other cabs, its so easy to carry; thats about the only (very-insignificant) complaint I've noticed too.

At one of my bands rehearsal spots, I have to tote my gear quite a distance, plus up a narrow stairway to the second floor. I've been seriously thinking about installing an (over the shoulder) carry-strap. I think that'd be a very cool option for Duke to consider too...

[Chef]

So far, I'm realllly digging the TC212.
Nothing but living room time with it yet, but it'll get show time Friday.

I haven't a/b'd with the TC115 yet, but it feels like it's got more mids, which I personally like.
I believe it's capable of Big SPL; and the slap tone from my Sadowsky MV5PJ is ridiculous, for realz.

[anderbass]

Originally Posted by kringle77

Yeah, thats what Im banking on. I had to order a pair, just had to! Im expecting big things from a pair of hathors and it would be nice be able to just bring one to some of these small bars around here.

Originally Posted by kringle77

Oh, I understand eq pretty well and the loudness curve but, the nv610 doesn't start to develop it's sound until it gets up to at least medium volumes no matter how I eq it. At barely medium it is too loud for most small clubs but still may not be hitting just right. It's a big cab thing as far as Im concerned. They don't start to have any life until the drivers move alittle. Smaller cabs can get that sound at lower volumes.....ready for it......because they are smaller and can pushed alittle harder without having a kill zone in front of your amp that also causes the drums to vibrate across the dance floor.

10-4, I totally agree. I'll be looking forward to hearing how they work out for ya!

[tombowlus]

Originally Posted by anderbass

I'd particularly love to hear your direct comparisons to the TC115. I get the feeling thats going to be the Hathors biggest competitor...

Unfortunately, Phil Maneri still has my TC112AF and TC115AF, but having played both of those cabs in the same room with the same band as I have been using the Hathor, I think I have a bit of the feel for how they compare (though I still look forward to the direct A/B fairly soon). The biggest obvious difference is that the TC's are "clean machines," and the Hathor has an innate desire to growl. That doesn't mean that you can't get great overdriven tones out of the TC's (you can), and it doesn't mean that you can't get a killer clean tone out of the Hathor (you can). But the different cabs do have obvious competitive advantages along the lines of their primary design goals.

The ability to convey overdrive in a rich, complex, yet still coherent, fashion puts the Hathor almost in a league of its own. But it is also a very, very pleasing cab when just using a touch of "hair" or growl.

Another thing I've noticed is that the TC's seem like they might do a slightly better job of filling a room evenly, whereas the Hathor is more easily to hear when you are standing super close to it (especially with regard to the upper mids and high end).

I hope to get those cabs back soon, though, and I'll update when I do.

[kringle77]

When using the pair, I plan to stack them vertical to get the best dispersion but, also, if I want more low end pound to put them both on the ground, splayed outward alittle. Yeah, I know that crossfiring is supposed to be better but, I've done both ways and find that crossfiring creates a dip in the 800hz range that guts your tone alittle. Splayed outward creates more lobes but, when your body is in front of the cabs and then the crowd is in front of your cabs, this matters very little. Splayed out, I find the mids to actually sound better overall and if one cab is being blocked, the other may not be at the time, giving you a fighting chance of getting your sound out there. Im talking small bars where 50 people make it an alright crowd and 100 is packed and people start spilling outside. I'll get to experiment though. I estimate and hope to get the cabs by around christmas, hopefully before.

[Bmorefoozler]

Maybe if you ask Duke early enough he can turn your mids sideways, making the cab favor a sideways orientation. This "might" make them mroe stackable. I thought of this after weeing Anderbass's pictures with a wide tube head on top and his answer was that it was feasible. Since you are actually buying them he may just do it for you if you desire.

[DukeLeJeune]

Originally Posted by tombowlus

The ability to convey overdrive in a rich, complex, yet still coherent, fashion puts the Hathor almost in a league of its own. But it is also a very, very pleasing cab when just using a touch of "hair" or growl.

Thank you sir! That is extremely encouraging!

Originally Posted by tombowlus

Another thing I've noticed is that the TC's seem like they might do a slightly better job of filling a room evenly, whereas the Hathor is more easily to hear when you are standing super close to it (especially with regard to the upper mids and high end).

This sounds right to me. The 4" cones in the Hathor cab don't have the wide, uniform coverage that I'm able to get with the constant-directivity horn in the Thunderchild cabs. On the other hand, the cones obviously do a better job with overdrive. So it's a tradeoff (gee, that never happens, right??).

Originally Posted by Bmorefoozler

Maybe if you ask Duke early enough he can turn your mids sideways, making the cab favor a sideways orientation. This "might" make them mroe stackable. I thought of this after weeing Anderbass's pictures with a wide tube head on top and his answer was that it was feasible. Since you are actually buying them he may just do it for you if you desire.

Sorry, but it's just not practical to turn the mids on their side on a special-order basis. That's one disadvantage to my dual-mid format, relative to the single-mid format used by some other designers. With the Hathor 1544 on its side you'd still get midrange dispersion in the horizontal plane comparable to what you'd expect from an 8" cone, but that is inferior to what my competitors can deliver from a 6" cone. And unfortunately the little 4" cone isn't loud enough for me to get by with just one.

[Bmorefoozler]

Originally Posted by DukeLeJeune

Sorry, but it's just not practical to turn the mids on their side on a special-order basis. That's one disadvantage to my dual-mid format, relative to the single-mid format used by some other designers. With the Hathor 1544 on its side you'd still get midrange dispersion in the horizontal plane comparable to what you'd expect from an 8" cone, but that is inferior to what my competitors can deliver from a 6" cone. And unfortunately the little 4" cone isn't loud enough for me to get by with just one.

Don't be sorry... I'm just the peanut gallery over here.

He can still just flip his top cab on it's head and have them line up to provide EVEN BETTER dispersion. He just mentioned possibly setting them on the floor and crossfiring them, and I thougth it might be possible to lay them sideways for a little better floor coupling then the tall stack. And as you say, he still can do that. Based on his EXTENSIVE experimenting that I have followed, dispersion characteristics of an 8" driver should certainly be acceptable for him, as he is used to a side by side 10" loaded cab.

[rpsands]

In my opinion the TC115 sounds as good or better with OD than the Hathor. Just this man's opinion though.

(Used it ranging from full on tube amp dirt to fuzz pedal to modeled dirty SVT, lots of varieties).

[kringle77]

Duke, it seems like basically the woofer can be run fullrange and the mids are probably highpassed. If the cab was turned sideways, wouldn't you have a 23" sound source and therefore very little horizontal dispersion?

[Bassist30]

Originally Posted by nostatic

I've been in sonic transition the past year. Part of it is retooling my playing studying with Anthony. The other is settling in with my Rob Allen/Fodera combination. The Foderas are brutally honest instruments and while that took awhile to adjust to, now I'm wanting something similar in an amp. The balance though is that I don't want it too pure - it needs some edge here and there. I had a TC112 for awhile and it was a bit polite in the mids for my taste, but I also didn't really push it around with EQ much. The upper mid eq point on the Puma is perfect for getting a bit of gank into the sound.

That said lately I've been (poorly) copping a bit of an Anthony Jackson vibe, and have been using chorus on tunes to good effect. Having the sound a bit more towards the studio monitor end helps that work in the bands where I'm using that. For the Steely Dan thing and live band karaoke - not so much. My hunch is that Blue Soul + TC212 would be a huge sound, but probably not enough mid punch for my taste. Puma + TC212 should be just about right.

Wow didn't know Jackson was giving lessons. Lucky Man.

[nostatic]

Originally Posted by Bassist30

Wow didn't know Jackson was giving lessons. Lucky Man.

Different Anthony. I study with Anthony Wellington (www.bassology.net). I just learn from AJ from afar

[rpsands]

Originally Posted by kringle77

Duke, it seems like basically the woofer can be run fullrange and the mids are probably highpassed. If the cab was turned sideways, wouldn't you have a 23" sound source and therefore very little horizontal dispersion?

I would expect that the mids are phase shifted by the crossover components enough that they wouldn't cancel destructively but I don't know for sure.

[KJung]

Originally Posted by rpsands

I would expect that the mids are phase shifted by the crossover components enough that they wouldn't cancel destructively but I don't know for sure.

Taking a break from cooking, cleaning, cocktailing and 'family-ing'.

Had to get a quick dose of phase shifted crossover component' talk to bring me back to reality!

Happy Thanksgiving RP and all

[DukeLeJeune]

Originally Posted by kringle77

Duke, it seems like basically the woofer can be run fullrange and the mids are probably highpassed. If the cab was turned sideways, wouldn't you have a 23" sound source and therefore very little horizontal dispersion?

I'm not sure exactly how their patterns would combine in the region of overlap with the cabs sideways. You'd have a relatively wide-angle source alongside a relatively narrow-angle source... I think it would be better than one would expect from a 23" wide source.

[kringle77]

It was just a curiousity thing. Im sure they will sound great no matter how I place them. The fact is, after all the experimenting I've done with my sealed cabs, I just wanted some great speakers where someone else (way smarter than me) has done all the smart work and done it better than most anybody else could. Sometimes it's nice just to have a cab where Im not wondering "what if" because, I know that it's been done the best way already. Saves alot of money too! I wondered to myself "if I was going to buy a cab, at any price, that would fit my tone goals, what would it be?" I looked at everything. The hathor fit all the requirements. Im really looking forward to getting them.

[rpsands]

I think the Hathor is probably the closest thing I've heard to your tone yet, but if I were you I might hold out for that 15/12 cab with the guitar 12

[kringle77]

Yeah, Im pretty interested in that one too. But, it's not ready yet. Although, if Duke wanted a beta tester, I'd be a good guy for that. I AM the guy who needs to be convinced that you can get a sealed cab sound with a ported cab and that you can get that guitar amp sound without a guitar amp.

[Bassist30]

Originally Posted by nostatic

Different Anthony. I study with Anthony Wellington (www.bassology.net). I just learn from AJ from afar

Another Great Bassist.

[tombowlus]

Originally Posted by KJung

Taking a break from cooking, cleaning, cocktailing and 'family-ing'.

Had to get a quick dose of phase shifted crossover component' talk to bring me back to reality!

Happy Thanksgiving RP and all

LOL! Gotta love TalkBass...