AVATAR cabinet: SINGLE 4 ohm cab solution?

ArturoOsito · #1 05-18-2013, 11:45 AM

Choosing an avatar box (yeah!!) and since they're non-returnable, I need all of your trusted experience. It's down to the b410 vs the tb153. The head will probably be a shuttle 9.2, and the musical style is reggae dance-rock.

Looking for subwoofer type reggae-dance sounds. No slapping, no fuzz, just big bottom end fingerstyle with some walking around and occasional arpeggios.

SO the question: the tb153 has a killer low-end sound, BUT I'm looking for a single 4ohm cab solution that could cover a variety of gigging situations. Which would point to the 410...but, will I be able to get big subwoofer tones out of it? Or is it a more treble-y box? I would hope I could EQ any sound, but will I be fighting the 410's nature?

Side note: I played a MARKBASS cmd102p, and the tone was huge and perfect. So apparently, tens can do anything...

ddhm · #2 05-18-2013, 11:58 AM

I get PLENTY of low end out of my Avatar 4x10 Neo. Your mileage may vary since that's a subjective thing.

It sounds like you might want a Markbass though?

ArturoOsito · #3 05-18-2013, 12:02 PM

Haha well, def an avatar cab. Line-x coating, better price...maybe a head though, but the shuttles/streamliners seem pretty magical...

jay loren · #4 05-18-2013, 12:42 PM

The Avatar 4X10 Neo (8 ohm version) has a huge sound. I used a Shuttle 9.0 with it, and it was loud. Not sure about the difference sound wise between the 4 ohm and 8 ohm version, though.

B-string · #5 05-18-2013, 01:03 PM

No difference in sound between a 4 ohm and 8 ohm cab, VERY VERY little difference from the power increase with a 4 ohm cab. You are MUCH better off having the ability to add a second 8 ohm cab as many that have not listened to this advice have found out.

**CL400Peavey** · #6 05-18-2013, 01:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by B-string

No difference in sound between a 4 ohm and 8 ohm cab, VERY VERY little difference from the power increase with a 4 ohm cab. You are MUCH better off having the ability to add a second 8 ohm cab as many that have not listened to this advice have found out.

+1

And with the Genz anp the OP is running he will be able to push an 8 Ohm 410 to just about its limits. Why limit yourself needlessly?

n1as · #7 05-18-2013, 01:11 PM

My B410 NEO was not as deep / full sounding as my Carvin BRX 10.2. The B410 had an midrange presence that added clarity and made the cabinet fairly bright sounding.

If you listen to the youtube demo videos from Avatar, you can see the difference in sound between the B410 and the TB153. I suspect the latter will be closer to giving you the sound you want.

- Keith -

**CL400Peavey** · #8 05-18-2013, 01:31 PM

If you do decide to go with the TB153 you should absolutely go with the 8 Ohm 3015lf as the woofer. It is more capable than the 4 Ohm version by far, and vastly more capable than the other woofer options Avatar offers.

ddhm · #9 05-18-2013, 02:59 PM

I'm using a Shuttle 9.0 and a 4 ohm 4x10. Both are new to me (so I'm sure I'm a bit biased) but it is the THUNDER! I can understand the idea of going with the 8 ohm stuff if you feel that you might want an additional cab though. I personally don't feel the need for that.

B-string · #10 05-18-2013, 03:07 PM

Yet.

**CL400Peavey** · #11 05-18-2013, 03:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ddhm

I'm using a Shuttle 9.0 and a 4 ohm 4x10. Both are new to me (so I'm sure I'm a bit biased) but it is the THUNDER! I can understand the idea of going with the 8 ohm stuff if you feel that you might want an additional cab though. I personally don't feel the need for that.

The point is, you would get just as loud with an 8 Ohm cab. The mechanical limitations are such that once you hit the 500 or so wattage point you are not really going to gain more volume out of the 410. So what is the point of limiting yourself to one cab? If you dont ever need the second cab, fine, dont use it. The option will be there should you ever want it though.

Troph · #12 05-18-2013, 09:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CL400Peavey

The point is, you would get just as loud with an 8 Ohm cab. The mechanical limitations are such that once you hit the 500 or so wattage point you are not really going to gain more volume out of the 410. So what is the point of limiting yourself to one cab? If you dont ever need the second cab, fine, dont use it. The option will be there should you ever want it though.

So I have a 4-ohm Avatar TB153. I sometimes wonder whether I should have gotten the 8-ohm if I were to do it all over again, since Dave will make them with the "mirrored" panel to stack two of them.

However, I have a Carvin BX500 which is stable to 2-ohms, and I also have a Crown XLS1500 which can drive two 4-ohm channels at 500 watts each.

With amps available like this, running two 4-ohm cabs is also a possibility. Unless I'm missing something.

B-string · #13 05-18-2013, 10:16 PM

I find it very interesting that the BX500 outputs 500 watts at 4 ohms Dynamic Peak: 1000w and 2 Ohms: limited at 500wRMS. I would take this as limiting the amps output at 2 ohms and losing Dynamic power.

Troph · #14 05-18-2013, 10:34 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by B-string

I find it very interesting that the BX500 outputs 500 watts at 4 ohms Dynamic Peak: 1000w and 2 Ohms: limited at 500wRMS. I would take this as limiting the amps output at 2 ohms and losing Dynamic power.

It's possible... I don't have two 4 ohm cabs to try it out.

lokikallas · #15 05-19-2013, 12:08 AM

jumbodbassman · #16 05-19-2013, 12:25 AM

what amp head are you using.,. if it has enough headroom why not go with a 8 ohm cab instead. IMHO you would not regret that down the road

ArturoOsito · #17 05-19-2013, 09:51 AM

I'm trying to decide between the GB shuttle 9.2 and the streamliner 900. Really the only thing stopping me from getting a STM is that supposedly it can sound muddy with the wrong cab or wrong room, and I can't have that haha.

Does anyone know which kind of cabs the STM doesn't "like?" STM 900 with a b410, would that be the best of both worlds or would they fight each other?

How much louder IS a 4ohm cab running at 900w than an 8ohm cab running at 500w?

Bass_Pounder · #18 05-19-2013, 10:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ArturoOsito

How much louder IS a 4ohm cab running at 900w than an 8ohm cab running at 500w?

Not even +3db (and that is *IF* the cab can even make use of the extra wattage)

Speaker ratings are thermal, not real world mechanical limits which are around 50% of the "thermal" rating.

B-string · #19 05-19-2013, 10:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bass_Pounder

Not even +3db (and that is *IF* the cab can even make use of the extra wattage)

Speaker ratings are thermal, not real world mechanical limits which are around 50% of the "thermal" rating.

^ This. Even if your cab has a "rating" of 1000 watts RMS, at bass frequencies you will only get clean reproduction at 400 watts if you're lucky. So sending additional wattage (by using a 4 ohm nominal load) will only produce more heat and distortion if not mechanical damage while the voice coils heat to the failure point.

spz8 · #20 05-19-2013, 11:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CL400Peavey

If you do decide to go with the TB153 you should absolutely go with the 8 Ohm 3015lf as the woofer. It is more capable than the 4 Ohm version by far, and vastly more capable than the other woofer options Avatar offers.

Why is this? I'm curious, as I would have chosen the 4 Ohm as a one cab solution paired with a 500 watt @ 4 Ohm head. Can you elaborate?