b15s - sweet round tone or barky midrange?

joninc · #1 11-12-2010, 01:32 PM

hey all - i am new here and just posted this at the end of another thread but might be better as it's own thread.

i have a b15s that i have been trying to make sound good.

i have rented b15ns in the past for recording and LOOOOVE them- so buttery and round.

a year ago i traded some recording time with a buddy for his B15s thinking that it'd be similar in tone to the b15n's i had used in the past - just with more power.

so - after replacing all the tubes and the speaker - it's still not sounding round or atleast what i was hoping for. it has a very barky midrange that i am always fighting with. and it rattles like crazy if i turn it up much at all.

i had been trying to correct a perceived "problem" with the tone but maybe it's all working totally as it should and this is just the nature of the beast??

the only thing i haven't done yet is take it to a tech and see how the caps are - does this sound like an issue/problem that could be related to the electronics or again, is this just how these guys sound?

NecroticImbecil · #2 11-12-2010, 03:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by joninc

hey all - i am new here and just posted this at the end of another thread but might be better as it's own thread.

i have a b15s that i have been trying to make sound good.

i have rented b15ns in the past for recording and LOOOOVE them- so buttery and round.

a year ago i traded some recording time with a buddy for his B15s thinking that it'd be similar in tone to the b15n's i had used in the past - just with more power.

so - after replacing all the tubes and the speaker - it's still not sounding round or atleast what i was hoping for. it has a very barky midrange that i am always fighting with. and it rattles like crazy if i turn it up much at all.

i had been trying to correct a perceived "problem" with the tone but maybe it's all working totally as it should and this is just the nature of the beast??

the only thing i haven't done yet is take it to a tech and see how the caps are - does this sound like an issue/problem that could be related to the electronics or again, is this just how these guys sound?

maybe something here thats some help

Ampeg B15S: Anyone have one? Any comments?

JimmyM · #3 11-12-2010, 04:30 PM

rattles are usually something loose the cab itself. the latches are always a likely culprit, but everything can rattle on them, and i usually have to chase them down for days when i've bought them.

but barky midrange isn't something you get in them normally. what speaker do you have in it?

joninc · #4 11-13-2010, 12:50 PM

i put a delta emminence 15 in it.

the rattle is the head itself - not the latches or speaker.

joninc · #5 11-13-2010, 01:10 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JimmyM

but barky midrange isn't something you get in them normally. what speaker do you have in it?

that's what i originally thought but i came across this on here elsewhere and found it interesting:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bassflute View Post
twice the power (60 devastating watts), a bigger cab, more tone controls, and weighed a ******* TON if you had the optional Altec-Lansing (pre-JBL) speaker in it. BRUTALLY heavy, and the most awkward lift imagineable for one person. And for all that, you got a weak amp with fluffy, loose tone, barky, clanky midrange, no treble, and is barely able to keep up with a modern drummer, especially these days.

stiles72 · #6 11-13-2010, 01:15 PM

Only played one once - sounded just like this one:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Z_2-xRKDJJg

JimmyM · #7 11-13-2010, 06:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by joninc

that's what i originally thought but i came across this on here elsewhere and found it interesting:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bassflute View Post
twice the power (60 devastating watts), a bigger cab, more tone controls, and weighed a ******* TON if you had the optional Altec-Lansing (pre-JBL) speaker in it. BRUTALLY heavy, and the most awkward lift imagineable for one person. And for all that, you got a weak amp with fluffy, loose tone, barky, clanky midrange, no treble, and is barely able to keep up with a modern drummer, especially these days.

yeah, well bassflute plays a 5000w power amp for jazz casuals. great player, plays circles around most of us...not to be trusted where vintage ampegs are concerned

i don't know...i love b-15's. the b-15s is one i've never played so i can't give you any direct advice about getting a sound out of it. i'm surprised the mids are so prominent, though...the delta in the b-15n cab from that era is rather subdued in the mids in that cab. i figured it was more of the same with the b-15s cab.

oh well, maybe you don't like b-15's. happens.

joninc · #8 11-13-2010, 06:52 PM

i'd love to hear from somebody who knows both amps and can speak to the difference in tone between b15n and b15s.

pgk · #9 11-14-2010, 08:07 AM

i'd take it into a tech because something Definitely sounds amiss. it sounds that way with all tone controls halfway up and tone switches off? a proper S should have less prominent upper mids than a double baffle N and go deeper, definitely. a head scratcher without more info and/or pics.

and what jimmy says about lo-po rigs: some people "get" them, some don't. i've never (so far) owned anything more powerful than a 60watt head and gigged them from clubs to festival stages. with the right cab(s) it's all i've ever needed, and mic it up or take a di only if need be. and btw i do not like a lot of dirt in my tone, i strive to keep things clean as possible. i get into trouble sometimes sure, but it's nothing a second cab would'nt cure. for me the tone is worth it, as are the frequent surprised looks. the way i see it, volume wise a big amp with a master volume set to only 3 or 4 is the same thing as a good lo-po head without a master; they're only Really using maybe 50 to 100 out of the 500 or more they have on tap for the majority of their gigs, whether they realize it or not. they think you "need" more power but you really don't ime. headroom's a great thing and all, and sure i wish i had more sometimes. but i like what i like and have never heard a complaint that i'm not loud enough. this stuff is not for guys who are weight conscious either, ya gotta grunt a little for that tone. old fashioned? you betcha. jmo and ymmv of course, but us lo-po guys gotta stick together!

kringle77 · #10 11-14-2010, 08:21 AM

That speaker probably has some bark to it. The kappalite 3015 would probably be really good. It has even response and sounds really good full range. I played/owned several cabs with the 3015.

MAMMOTHvolume · #11 11-14-2010, 11:36 AM

turn the bass and treble up to cut the midrange

stiles72 · #12 11-15-2010, 08:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by joninc

i'd love to hear from somebody who knows both amps and can speak to the difference in tone between b15n and b15s.

Going from memory here...

The "S" I played through had a Thiele cab (bottom shelf vented) compared to the 8 cigar shaped front ports on my '63 "N". The "S" moved more air, and had a deeper sound which mine doesn't quite do. Reminded me of my Fender BXR 300C. The "S" did however sound very similar to a 70's B15N which is a different configuration than the 60's model.

The "S" also had a response knob (I think it was labled bass/flat/guitar) which if I recall, acted sort of like the ultra lo/hi settings on anSVT or 70's B15N. I played it on the bass setting, and would guess it's a mid cut around 600 or 800. On the 60's B15 you only have bass and treble, no ultra lo/hi and there is no mid scoop to the sound - all frequencies present and accounted for.

So compared to a 60's B15, the "S" was deeper, boomier, warmer, and compared to a 70's B15 about the same- just more juice under the hood.

stiles72 · #13 11-15-2010, 08:56 AM

Also - what bass and strings are you using with the amp? That makes a big difference too...

joninc · #14 11-15-2010, 12:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pgk

i'd take it into a tech because something Definitely sounds amiss. it sounds that way with all tone controls halfway up and tone switches off? a proper S should have less prominent upper mids than a double baffle N and go deeper, definitely. a head scratcher without more info and/or pics.

this is a b15s - there are no rocker/tone switches. just a toggle between bass/flat/guitar and 2 channels with volume/trb/bass.

the bass channel is like taking everything above 1 k out completely. no treble at all. like total dub tone.

the middle toggle is probably the best but has too much mid.

the guitar channel is tinny.

i am using a fender roadworn p bass and an epi violin bass with this.

Quote:

MAMMOTHvolume turn the bass and treble up to cut the midrange

actually - just tried out MAMMOTH's advice - best sound so far- pretty good actually! thanks!

Sartori · #15 11-15-2010, 01:16 PM

If the bass channel is too bassy, and the guitar channel is too trebly, why not play both channels?

joninc · #16 11-15-2010, 01:22 PM

you have to select 1 channel - it's a toggle switch - not separate inputs.

see the left toggle -

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...m=140474442900

Sartori · #17 11-15-2010, 01:33 PM

Ah, damn, that sucks.

beans-on-toast · #18 11-15-2010, 01:40 PM

You can have a tech apply a reversible mod to the amp. You can change the switch setting to three useful bass settings. I figure Flat must be a bypass.

Other possibilities here Official Ampeg Portaflex Club Part III: Don't Stop 'Til You Get Enough .

throbbinnut · #19 11-15-2010, 06:21 PM

I'd be willling to bet that the Bass/Flat/Guitar multi-contact switch has some switches that aren't making good contact, and that is why it's not sounding right. Those 70's rocker switches get flakey after 30+ years, and if one of those connections isn't making up, your sound is going to be hokey.

Chris

pgk · #20 11-15-2010, 06:35 PM

[quote=throbbinnut;9990025]I'd be willling to bet that the Bass/Flat/Guitar multi-contact switch has some switches that aren't making good contact, and that is why it's not sounding right. Those 70's rocker switches get flakey after 30+ years, and if one of those connections isn't making up, your sound is going to be hokey.

yep, absolutely could be