Bass driver options other than Eminence?

bobby1781 · #1 07-14-2010, 01:01 PM

I just started playing bass about 4months ago. I have never played an instrument and just wanted to learn. Unfortunately, I came out of the whom with G.A.S. in every single interest I have. Needless to say, bass has become no different.

I do everything overkill, I love physics and technology and therefor end up with things that are cool as ****, but way better than my skill level.

I would consider myself somewhat of an audiophile (I think all audiophiles are self proclaimed anyways as no two people have the same ear shape or preferences) When I was in college I worked with very hi-end home and car speakers, JM Labs, Revel, Dynaudio, and for what I could afford always placed the value of relatively cheaper Paradigm speakers near the top for me.

Bored of reading yet? My point is, I know that at the end of the day, practice, practice, practice, work on technique, skills etc. is far more important than any gear I will buy. I know that if I were to use a Mesa Powerhouse in my bedroom that I would just hear my lack of skill at incredible accuracy and volume

BUT: I DON'T CARE. My passion that grows daily for playing bass doesn't quench my passion for all the gear and technology too.

I want to build a bass cabinet as I have built many enclosures and have a good understanding of how to apply T/S parameters.

I have searched and researched and look everywhere, but who is making drivers besides Eminence? I know Celestion makes bass speakers, but they seem very hard to locate for purchase. In all of the amp cabs Ive researched, it seems the company's use custom self named drivers in the cheaper models, and in all the more expensive ones I see they list Eminence or at least a custom variation of the Eminence drivers with longer throw or larger coils and so on. I want to build a cab without a horn and use a 4"-6" driver for the higher frequiences. I always loved the upper roll-off of a phase plug driver. Dont pay too much attention to the amounts of drivers because I am at such a theoritcal stage still since I havent found a company to even consider specs, but I was thinking something like: 2x12" 3x6" 1x4", 1x15" 3x10" 1x4": 2x12", 4x8", 2x6". See? all over the board. Well eminence does not make bass drivers under 10". Thats fine because I guess we are no longer even talking about low frequencies so do I just use smaller guitar speakers up there? I have ran the searches on using home speakers/car speakers. I get the effeciency part however, these is not crazy tech here. The cheapest speaker and the most exensive speaker is still just some current flowin through some wire moving a cone to move air. If I selected for example an 8" paradigm driver or the dynaudios that have those silly 3" voice coils on 8" drivers and am running them from 800-5000hz whats wrong? Am I missing something huge here?

I am sure the savvy people will respond with reasons why it isnt done that way... so my final question: Then what other companies are making amp cab specific speakers to look into? I would love to find a line that allowed me to create this 3-way system with cones using the same material so that you cant hear the speakers and the crossovers, you just hear the sound of the bass. I cannot stand when a speaker sounds like a tweeter and a mid with a subwoofer...I want to hear music not speakers. When I play my bass, I want to hear my bass not a tiny high pitched sound from my metal fret and than a boom from my E. Alright, I guess I should go back to work and quit wasting everyone's time with my novel

BTW, this is my first post, but I love this site, and ready so many of your responses and questions love the feel of the TB community. Thanks for reading and input.

JimmyM · #2 07-14-2010, 01:14 PM

do a search on fearful and bill fitzmaurice cabs.

as for eminence, they're great speakers and your best bet in america. there are other great makers out there, but eminence makes great speakers that are reasonably priced, plus they give up the complete specs so they can be matched to the cabs (celestion doesn't) so most folks use them.

KramerBassFan · #3 07-14-2010, 01:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JimmyM

do a search on fearful and bill fitzmaurice cabs.

as for eminence, they're great speakers and your best bet in america. there are other great makers out there, but eminence makes great speakers that are reasonably priced, plus they give up the complete specs so they can be matched to the cabs (celestion doesn't) so most folks use them.

And they don't change some aspect of the driver every few months or so and never even acknowledge it like certain others do.

honestjohnny · #4 07-14-2010, 01:40 PM

What Jimmy said plus usspeaker.com

B&C, Beyma, 18Sound and several other companies make sub-10" speakers, even Eminence makes a 6 and an 8 worth looking at. They are all mid, mid-high drivers though. And really if you're going to use a mid or mid-high, then you might as well use a larger diameter, high excursion woofer and set the x-over where it starts to drop off. Which is what GB's fEarful and BFM's Omni's do. Cheers!

NoGraveConcern · #5 07-14-2010, 01:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bobby1781

something like: 2x12" 3x6" 1x4", 1x15" 3x10" 1x4": 2x12", 4x8", 2x6".

If you want a multi-driver pro-sound cab you would use a low frequency driver + a mid driver + a horn tweeter. One of each, not 2 + 3 + 1. With a proper crossover and drivers that are well matched in sensitivity this takes advantage of the useable range of each to give you a flat response on axis and nearly identical off axis.

The fearful plans outline using the best 15 for the money for a LF driver, which happens to be an Eminence, plus the best match for that 15 in mid drivers at any price, which happens to be a 6.5” mid made by 18 sound, plus an optional compression driver and waveform. Do a search. Check it out.

JimmyM · #6 07-14-2010, 02:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NoGraveConcern

If you want a multi-driver pro-sound cab you would use a low frequency driver + a mid driver + a horn tweeter. One of each, not 2 + 3 + 1. With a proper crossover and drivers that are well matched in sensitivity this takes advantage of the useable range of each to give you a flat response on axis and nearly identical off axis.

The fearful plans outline using the best 15 for the money for a LF driver, which happens to be an Eminence, plus the best match for that 15 in mid drivers at any price, which happens to be a 6.5” mid made by 18 sound, plus an optional compression driver and waveform. Do a search. Check it out.

two slight corrections...you actually can use multiple drivers for each freq band as long as the cab is designed for it. fearful's got a really cool 1515/6 cab that tb user foz built. and bill fm always recommends using multiple piezo drivers in a cab if you want that ultra high end and use piezos (i believe he recommends at least 4). multiple drivers smooth out the tones and give you a nice low end boost as well.

the other slight correction is you're never going to get straight line flat out of a cab no matter how well it's designed. best you can hope for is kinda sorta close.

mccartneyman · #7 07-14-2010, 02:38 PM

Just a question: 40 years ago everyone loved JBL & EV for bass. Are they still players in today's market?

JimmyM · #8 07-14-2010, 02:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by mccartneyman

Just a question: 40 years ago everyone loved JBL & EV for bass. Are they still players in today's market?

not for raw drivers.

billfitzmaurice · #9 07-14-2010, 02:52 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JimmyM

not for raw drivers.

JBL and EV no longer sell their upper end drivers other than in their own cabs, and have dropped out of the electric bass cab market entirely.

bobby1781 · #10 07-14-2010, 02:55 PM

Thanks all for the suggestions, I am off to check into the recommendations. And if Eminence is one of the best choices I have no problems using them, I was just a bit confused as to why there didn't seem to be any others. Thanks for the fast input!

mccartneyman · #11 07-14-2010, 03:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by billfitzmaurice

JBL and EV no longer sell their upper end drivers other than in their own cabs, and have dropped out of the electric bass cab market entirely.

Oh my. I remember when the D140 & K140 were the speakers top have, although I finished my 15" playing days with EV.

NoGraveConcern · #12 07-15-2010, 05:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JimmyM

two slight corrections...you actually can use multiple drivers for each freq band as long as the cab is designed for it. fearful's got a really cool 1515/6 cab that tb user foz built. and bill fm always recommends using multiple piezo drivers in a cab if you want that ultra high end and use piezos (i believe he recommends at least 4). multiple drivers smooth out the tones and give you a nice low end boost as well.

the other slight correction is you're never going to get straight line flat out of a cab no matter how well it's designed. best you can hope for is kinda sorta close.

Right, poorly worded, but I was trying to put emphasis on choosing a mid that matches well with the lf and not just three of these and two of those, add salt to taste and bring to a boil.

With a one lf, one mid, one hf setup you have three 8 ohm drivers that can be crossed over to cover the frequency spectrum with optimal response and dispersion. This would be a better direction than the OP's suggested multiple size lf drivers mixed with--to my knowledge--nonexistent paper coned hf drivers or a lf driver mixed with multiple sized mid drivers.