Bass drum through my rig

Warmuth · #1 02-13-2013, 06:23 AM

So my drummer is not happy how his kick sounds when it's run through our pa. We run all instruments and vocals through the pa and our guitar player runs the sound and expresses zero interest in fixing the issue. The drummer wants to try running his kick through my rig so I need some advice before I potentially blow a cab over it.

My setup now is a gk1001 through a gk neo412. I use it as my stage monitor and my signal goes to the board pre eq and is mixed into the pa. Can that cab handle a kick? We don't play too loud, standard rock in a bar volume but the drummer can tend to play fairly hard. Is it worth trying to do it this way? The pa is the best solution but I'm trying to avoid all out war between the guitarist and the drummer over it.

johnpbass · #2 02-13-2013, 06:26 AM

Not a good idea, IMO. You'd be trying to EQ two different instruments in one amp. Your guitar player needs to fix it or else maybe you and your drummer could work together to EQ the kick in the PA.

DieterVDW · #3 02-13-2013, 06:34 AM

The foremost problem that needs fixin' here is the band dynamics it seems ...

Steve Dallman · #4 02-13-2013, 06:35 AM

I did this for years. I triggered the bass drum using an Alesis D4, and put that into the second channel of the bass head I used back then. I got very used to hearing the kick with my bass, plus if we played a job with a big PA and a sound man, I'd send a PA feed of the bass and kick mixed. No turning the kick up, and drowning out the bass.

I was running a bi-amped rig with two 18's and eight 8's. These days, if we don't have decent PA support, I put the kick into a 150 watt head and a small 10in car type sub which is on stage with us. I still use the D4. There are kick samples that sound excellent, yet don't stress the speakers. Plus, no mic feedback. With PA support we get great, consistent results.

AdamR · #5 02-13-2013, 06:36 AM

If you have a decant PA I dont understand why you dont just give the drummer extra bass in his monitor ? How about a small combo amp right behind him ? Or a 1-12" cabinet ?

ric stave · #6 02-13-2013, 06:37 AM

Does your PA have subs? That's what they are there for. I say 'nay' on putting the kick thru your rig - not a good idea.

alembicguy · #7 02-13-2013, 06:54 AM

Yikes! If your running everything thru your PA now, somebody needs to learn how to mix a decent kick drum sound into that mix, unless your PA is insufficient there shouldn't be a problem. From my point of view if it was me there would be no way I would run that thru my bass rig, I can't even imagine the clipping that would cause along with the bass.

Steve Dallman · #8 02-13-2013, 06:57 AM

I wouldn't do it these days, despite having done it in the years past. Tell him if he wants the kick in a bass amp, just buy one himself.

bigsnaketex · #9 02-13-2013, 06:57 AM

I would council against doing this - I've seen it done but it's just not a good idea.

punkinfantry · #10 02-13-2013, 06:59 AM

If he wants more kick, talk to the venue's sound guy. Don't blow your speakers.

**CL400Peavey** · #11 02-13-2013, 07:01 AM

I have run kick though my rig, but my cab isnt anything you will find in GC.

But...

I run my pre in to a small mixer, and anything else there as well. Then send that through a HPF and into a power amp.

Warmuth · #12 02-13-2013, 07:03 AM

Thanks for the advice. Our pa can clearly handle it ,our guitarist hates drums apparently. It's readily apparent in recordings that the drums are buried. Jimmies will just have to be rustled over this one.

**CL400Peavey** · #13 02-13-2013, 07:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Warmuth

Thanks for the advice. Our pa can clearly handle it ,our guitarist hates drums apparently. It's readily apparent in recordings that the drums are buried. Jimmies will just have to be rustled over this one.

Yep. Just through down the, "Rhythm section is the most important part of the music, your geetar is just icing on the cake!" gauntlet.

Melik · #14 02-13-2013, 07:44 AM

You do mostly small venues? Your drummer tends to play hard? I don't see the problem here.. is it about the sound that he gets to his monitor or the sound that goes to audience that he doesn't like?

dmac1961 · #15 02-13-2013, 07:46 AM

It's really not that hard to get a good kick sound through the PA, the guitarist needs to make the effort. Running the kick through your amp would require a conversion of the mic signal to instrument level, then the DI output would contain both kick and bass, making it more of a nightmare for the sound guy. Tell your guitarist to get off his arse.

Nashrakh · #16 02-13-2013, 07:52 AM

Unless your drummer plays electric drums, I fathom your band is too loud in its entirety. You say you play small venues, imo there is no necessity to run the drums through your PA at all if he hits as hard as you say.

I would advise you to work on your band sound, to me it doesn't sound thought out that well especially with the guitar player busting his chops and stuff.

1958Bassman · #17 02-13-2013, 07:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Warmuth

So my drummer is not happy how his kick sounds when it's run through our pa. We run all instruments and vocals through the pa and our guitar player runs the sound and expresses zero interest in fixing the issue. The drummer wants to try running his kick through my rig so I need some advice before I potentially blow a cab over it.

My setup now is a gk1001 through a gk neo412. I use it as my stage monitor and my signal goes to the board pre eq and is mixed into the pa. Can that cab handle a kick? We don't play too loud, standard rock in a bar volume but the drummer can tend to play fairly hard. Is it worth trying to do it this way? The pa is the best solution but I'm trying to avoid all out war between the guitarist and the drummer over it.

Let me guess- the drummer thinks he needs a huge kick drum too, am I right? That's the last thing that's needed when the PA handles all of the instruments.

If the guitar player is going to manage the PA, he needs to learn how and the rest of you need to do the same. If your bass is already occupying the low end, adding a huge kick drum is the worst thing possible. Speakers WILL blow and fingers will be pointed.

staindbass · #18 02-13-2013, 07:52 AM

i dont think you should give up the headroom in your amp (and clutter your sound) and run it harder because the bands pa wont do what the drummer what wants to hear. the one who is whining should buy the subs

1958Bassman · #19 02-13-2013, 07:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CL400Peavey

Yep. Just through down the, "Rhythm section is the most important part of the music, your geetar is just icing on the cake!" gauntlet.

How many times have you heard someone whistling or humming the parts played by the rhythm section as they drive or walk? Unless they play drums or bass, probably NEVER! They hum or whistle the MELODY.

"Just stand there and look pertty".

beans-on-toast · #20 02-13-2013, 08:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Warmuth

So my drummer is not happy how his kick sounds when it's run through our pa.

You have start with a good source. There are a lot of options for micing a drum. Look at how the kick is being mic'ed and how that can be changed. Try a different mic. There is the possibility of more than one mic, one inside and one outside each dealing with a different frequency range. Padding inside the drum. Different tuning.