Building an Ampeg Heritage

[gwangi]

Originally Posted by hodgy

Well, yeah, that's the short version. An eloquent quote from Ryan, one of our media guys:

"The difference between made in the USA and assembled in the USA is a complicated legal matter. In this case the wood itself constituted such a major portion of the overall material (wood which is imported), that we could not outright say made in the USA. However, EVERYTHING that can be done to make these rigs is done here, in house, by Hodgy and his team. Thanks for giving us the opportunity to explain!"

I can't really speak to what goes on overseas, I've fixed a whole bunch of returned CLs and VRs, mostly from Vietnam and Korea and I DO know that the vast majority of root cause failures are not 'shoddy workmanship' or 'poor testing conditions'.

So Hodgy what is the particular wood being used for the Heritage 810 cabinets right now.

[Mastermold]

Originally Posted by JimmyM

Dang, really? I appreciate how straight up you're being with your info and opinions. Honestly, I don't have any complaints about the sound of the amps with the transformers you're using now, but when you use the word "significantly," I have to take notice.

WIFE: Another thousand dollars for special transformers?

ME: But Hodgy said "significantly," honey!

Yeah but what's "better" really? I like the words "warmer" and "bigger bottom" but messing with classic Ampeg tone is like messing with Coke's secret formula.

[JimmyM]

Originally Posted by Bassoballs

George Metropolous had a run of Heyboer OT's built to his spec that are a drop in replacement. He started modding his VR after talking to the AR guy a couple years back (before the Heritage line launched). The initial mods were the replacement of the OT, winged =c= 6550's, and NOS preamp tubes. We soon did the same mods to my 2-pro, and the AR guys amp. I'm not good at putting percieved sound into terms, but i'd say the overall tonality is more "musical", and the bottom end seems to be more defined and have more punch to it.

Oh yeah, that's right...you work at Metro Amps, right? So this must have been Chrys and not Stu, huh?

BTW, half of me believes as Mastermold, and the other half only hears the word "significantly"

[Bassoballs]

Originally Posted by Mastermold

Yeah but what's "better" really? I like the words "warmer" and "bigger bottom" but messing with classic Ampeg tone is like messing with Coke's secret formula.

When I think of classic Ampeg tone, I think of a vintage SVT. The modded VR's came closer to the sound of an original. We had three vintage models to use as reference.

[Tim1]

Oh dear oh dear oh dear.....significantly?......sIGniFIcantly?....SIG NIFICANTLY......?
Please don't start this guys.
I can see where it is going.
I know the track.
Oh dear oh dear oh dear

[JimmyM]

Originally Posted by Tim1

Oh dear oh dear oh dear.....significantly?......sIGniFIcantly?....SIG NIFICANTLY......?
Please don't start this guys.
I can see where it is going.
I know the track.
Oh dear oh dear oh dear

Agreed.

I'll tell you though, I already hear the VR as being so much like the originals that I'm not sure I would go for a new OT if I had a VR. But hearing the S word from people who know their SVT's probably better than I do makes me think there's something to it.

[JOE EDO]

Originally Posted by hodgy

I only got to play it for a few minutes, but our AR guy put Heyboers in his Heritage and it really was significantly... I dunno- warmer? Bigger bottomed? I'd love to A/B it with our normal builds. It sounds good enough that both Pearl Jam and Soundgarden have borrowed it to record with in the past few months.

Could I use this one (OT) in my Heritage and/ or Korean VR and will it yield the significant difference you all are hearing?

Mojotone Ampeg Style Transformers

[Red Planet]

Jimmy good to see you back.

Hodgy thank you for being honest. That goes a looooong way with me.

Heyboer transformers are a great value and a high quality product. To me they are just as good as Mercury but cost less.

This is a little OT but I had a bone stock Marshall JCM 800 reissue 2203 that I installed a Metro Amps hand wired board assembly into and it made a world of difference. The amp was great to start with but turned to magic after the Metro install. I took it to the first annual Gear Page Ampfest in Atlanta and it took home the gold. I was playing it through a JCM 800 4X12 with British made Greenbacks using a 52 reissue Telecaster. I could dime the amp with no hiss/noise roll the volume back on the guitar and play clean marine then roll it up and turn it into a fire breathing dragon.

I would absolutely love to have an SVT built like that and I think there is a market for it. Hand wired, high quality caps, good iron, you can't go wrong.

[hodgy]

Like I said, I only had the chance to mess with it for a few minutes, but I think Scott our AR guy (or Stu, as he is occasionally aliased) has another Heritage that he wants me to drop new Heyboers into. When he finally gets it to me, I'll do some sweep tests so I can tell you some 'technical' hoo-haw, and maybe try to do an A/B test. To me, it sounded a bit more like the VR. But tone is so subjective, isn't it?

Joe Edo- I don't have a clue, sorry! Are those for vintage SVTs or current CLs and VRs? Doesn't look like our wire config on the picture of the PT.

Red Planet- I totally agree, but cost, sales, production, blah blah business, etc... all the things I hear when bringing up my crazy ideas about doing custom shop type stuff.

Gwangi- I don't know. I DO know it's not the crap fiberboard that was in my 90's 8x10.

[beans-on-toast]

Originally Posted by Bassoballs

George Metropolous had a run of Heyboer OT's built to his spec that are a drop in replacement.

It would be interesting to know if there is more iron in the replacement Heyboer SVT transformers. This could help with the low end and tone.

Can you say what the weight of the Heyboer vs the VR transformer is?

[Mastermold]

Originally Posted by hodgy

...

Red Planet- I totally agree, but cost, sales, production, blah blah business, etc... all the things I hear when bringing up my crazy ideas about doing custom shop type stuff.

...

I like your crazy ideas, and I suspect most guys here would too. As a consumer, when I buy a Heritage SVT my expectation is I'm getting the best amp Ampeg knows how to make, no holding back, the best possible ingredients, etc.

[rodl2005]

Slightly off track for a sec..... If the Heritage 810's parts & build quality is ......... thus....... good, then how does the latest Chinese SVT 810 cab stand up?
I can see the specs, but how does it stand up- tone wise, volume handling, build re road/regular use etc..... Real world?

[Mastermold]

Originally Posted by rodl2005

Slightly off track for a sec..... If the Heritage 810's parts & build quality is ......... thus....... good, then how does the latest Chinese SVT 810 cab stand up?
I can see the specs, but how does it stand up- tone wise, volume handling, build re road/regular use etc..... Real world?

Well the tolex is more durable ...

[JimmyM]

Originally Posted by rodl2005

Slightly off track for a sec..... If the Heritage 810's parts & build quality is ......... thus....... good, then how does the latest Chinese SVT 810 cab stand up?
I can see the specs, but how does it stand up- tone wise, volume handling, build re road/regular use etc..... Real world?

I use new 810e's and 410's a lot, and they all look fine and durable and they sound the way an 810 should as far as I'm concerned. YMMV but I think they sound excellent. That said, I haven't tried a Heritage 810e yet.

[will33]

Wow. Not much of substance to add here other than to say Hodgy, you seem like a righteous dude, man. I really like your matter of fact, tell it like it is attitude. Seeing the "American series" SVT's being basically involving putting togther foreign assembled complete modules kinda confirms a hunch, maybe a little disappointing to see it for real, but then again, having someone such as yourself with their fingers in the works, kinda gives ya a warm/fuzzy.

Thanks for posting this, man.

[JimWasHere]

Originally Posted by JimmyM

That said, I haven't tried a Heritage 810e yet.

I still haven't heard of anyone A/Bing a current Heritage 810 and a current 810e. I would very much like to.

Originally Posted by will33

Not much of substance to add here other than to say Hodgy, you seem like a righteous dude, man. I really like your matter of fact, tell it like it is attitude.

In the other thread I mentioned how it seemed almost like you would be more comfortable putting together amps than making a video. I absolutely meant it as a compliment. I can count on one hand how many times I've seen folks as direct about their product as you have been, and I appreciate that. I wish all of Ampeg was more like you

[rodl2005]

Originally Posted by JimWasHere

I still haven't heard of anyone A/Bing a current Heritage 810 and a current 810e. I would very much like to.

+1

[coreyfyfe]

Originally Posted by beans-on-toast

It would be interesting to know if there is more iron in the replacement Heyboer SVT transformers. This could help with the low end and tone.

Can you say what the weight of the Heyboer vs the VR transformer is?

I couldnt find the info on the heyboer website but they say they sell through mojotone and looking around on mojotone they list the SVT replacement OT at 20.1 lbs. Not sure of the weight on current production SVT transformers. Fliptops has the oem CL and vintage replacements in stock but no weight details. Would be interesting to know.

[Bassoballs]

Originally Posted by beans-on-toast

It would be interesting to know if there is more iron in the replacement Heyboer SVT transformers. This could help with the low end and tone.

Can you say what the weight of the Heyboer vs the VR transformer is?

The big difference between a stock and the Metro/Heyboer OT is the amount of laminates used in construction. The Heyboer has 2 to 3 times as many laminates. I believe the quality and consistency of the material used is more important than the actual weight. I've never weighed them, but out of curiousity I will.

[JGR]

FWIW, the USA made replacements Fliptops sells are Heyboer.