Comparing SVTs

[SactoBass]

Originally Posted by jgroh

Well, to throw in another two cents from an anonymous interweb source (me...) Ive played bass for 26 years now, and up until about 3 months ago, that whole time was through solid state heads. I played in my previous band with a Markbass LMII which is 500 watts, into a Ampeg 410HLF cab, with a Sansamp VT bass pedal, then a Sansamp RPM in front of it. I was happy with that setup...still have it actually, and loved it at 3 am!

However, I finally decided to get a SVT-CL. HOLY CRAP! Not only does it sound awesome, it IS louder! I dont know the technical reasons, and I am not a tube snob by any means, as evidenced by the previous 26 solid-state years. People will say you are hearing an EQ bump at this or that frequency and thats why it seems louder, but I couldnt imagine it through an 8x10. Anywhooo...carry on!

40 years of playing here. And I have had so many different bass rigs over the years, it's actually embarassing! And I have finally come to grips with the fact that the only way for me to get that tone is via an all-tube amp with heavy iron transformers going into a sealed cab. Sure, my Ampeg SVT-II non-pro is a whopping 85 pounds, and my Bergantino NV610 is 100 pounds, but schlepping it is the price I choose to pay for having that sound.

All IMO/IME, of course!

Others choose differently, which is cool too!

[prd004]

And allow me to quell any notion that a 300 watt SVT may not be loud enough.

I play in pretty loud band. Heavy, Bonham-esque drumming, two guitars, one Marshall 100 watt and one Mesa 100 watt. Not ears bleed loud, but pretty damn loud.

I wanna be heard, not just low end boom, I want the notes the clear and present. I play intricate lines, counter melodies and I want to be heard through all the other.
I use a VR through a 410 and I never turn the volume past 9:30 and if you know this amp, off at 7:00!!!!!!!
And again we are talking 410!

You will never lack volume with an SVT

[thedudebrah]

Originally Posted by SactoBass

That's a good vote!

And between the CL and VR, the VR wins big time tone-wise (I have owned both).

I have also owned both. I had the CL first and decided I wanted to try out the VR so I sold the CL to make the switch. After a year of playing through the VR, I'd never go back. I played a CL in Sam Ash last weekend and was really really unimpressed actually. It seemed to have a lot less "character" than my VR has, but that's just my ears.

[SactoBass]

Originally Posted by thedudebrah

I have also owned both. I had the CL first and decided I wanted to try out the VR so I sold the CL to make the switch. After a year of playing through the VR, I'd never go back. I played a CL in Sam Ash last weekend and was really really unimpressed actually. It seemed to have a lot less "character" than my VR has, but that's just my ears.

That matches my tonal experience. The VR is a friggin tone monster!

[two fingers]

Originally Posted by SactoBass

Two fingers: you sure are correct about that!! 99% of the audience has no clue. And to be completely honest and candid, I don't really care about those four guys in the audience either (but please don't tell them that...I wouldn't want to hurt their feelings.) But IMHO there is one other person to consider, and that person is me. If I am totally digging the tone coming out of my rig that is right behind me on stage, I am happier! And for me, that's what is important to me.

I don't totally disagree with you. But here's the thing. The OP already has enough money to get an amp. And the pro series SVT amps are really nice. Plus, to seamlessly go back and forth between overdrive and non overdrive tones, he's going to have to hang on to the RBI anyway. With all that in mind, it just seems simpler to get a rack-mounted SVT and stick it in the rack with the RBI. And it will sound GREAT. Plus, he'll have that "extra power" that was on his original list of requirements to begin with. If he were to need a tube job a few months after getting it, he would have to SAVE UP to get his amp fixed. It just makes no sense to go that route.

It also seems as though the guy's budget is kind of tight if he is having to save up for gear. That being said, I would argue that an all-tube head (ESPECIALLY USED) is a really bad idea. Once he buys that used head, there's no telling when several hundred dollars worth of tubes could go bad. If he is having to save up a few extra months just to get one to begin with, he probably doesn't need to own an all-tube head as his only rig. They take MONEY to fix when something goes bad.

If "that sound" was his ONLY requirement, and NOTHING ELSE, I would say go for it. But budget, reliability (being that he doesn't have a backup), and constantly switching back and forth between clean and overdrive tones point me in the direction of a rack-mounted, newer, less expensive to maintain pro series SVT. Telling him to save up and get a vintage, or reissue SVT is like telling someone who is tight on funds to save up and get a classic Corvette in stead of a newer car he can already buy. Of course the newer car wouldn't be as cool as a classic Corvette. But the Corvette just doesn't make sense.

[SactoBass]

Originally Posted by two fingers

I don't totally disagree with you. But here's the thing. The OP already has enough money to get an amp. And the pro series SVT amps are really nice. Plus, to seamlessly go back and forth between overdrive and non overdrive tones, he's going to have to hang on to the RBI anyway. With all that in mind, it just seems simpler to get a rack-mounted SVT and stick it in the rack with the RBI. And it will sound GREAT. Plus, he'll have that "extra power" that was on his original list of requirements to begin with. If he were to need a tube job a few months after getting it, he would have to SAVE UP to get his amp fixed. It just makes no sense to go that route.

It also seems as though the guy's budget is kind of tight if he is having to save up for gear. That being said, I would argue that an all-tube head (ESPECIALLY USED) is a really bad idea. Once he buys that used head, there's no telling when several hundred dollars worth of tubes could go bad. If he is having to save up a few extra months just to get one to begin with, he probably doesn't need to own an all-tube head as his only rig. They take MONEY to fix when something goes bad.

If "that sound" was his ONLY requirement, and NOTHING ELSE, I would say go for it. But budget, reliability (being that he doesn't have a backup), and constantly switching back and forth between clean and overdrive tones point me in the direction of a rack-mounted, newer, less expensive to maintain pro series SVT. Telling him to save up and get a vintage, or reissue SVT is like telling someone who is tight on funds to save up and get a classic Corvette in stead of a newer car he can already buy. Of course the newer car wouldn't be as cool as a classic Corvette. But the Corvette just doesn't make sense.

For the OP's particular situation, that would work. (assuming, of course, that he agrees).

I believe the many posts in this thread will help the OP make an informed decision. Once again, Talkbass wins the day!

[two fingers]

Originally Posted by SactoBass

For the OP's particular situation, that would work. (assuming, of course, that he agrees).

I believe the many posts in this thread will help the OP make an informed decision. Once again, Talkbass wins the day!

Agreed. Either way, he can't lose.

[SactoBass]

Originally Posted by two fingers

Agreed. Either way, he can't lose.

True dat!

[Sartori]

Originally Posted by SactoBass

Two fingers: you sure are correct about that!! 99% of the audience has no clue. And to be completely honest and candid, I don't really care about those four guys in the audience either (but please don't tell them that...I wouldn't want to hurt their feelings.) But IMHO there is one other person to consider, and that person is me. If I am totally digging the tone coming out of my rig that is right behind me on stage, I am happier! And for me, that's what is important to me.

+1

Sure, the audience doesn't care... but I do. And who am I playing for, if not myself? The reason we play bass is for enjoyment.

[Floyd Eye]

Originally Posted by Sartori

Jimmy's pretty cool. I don't think he cares that much what other people are playing, though.

He has said these exact words to me more than once. You're right though, Jimmy is pretty cool.

[Floyd Eye]

No doubt the budget is tight, but if I opt for an all tube SVT it will not be my ONLY amp. I will have a back up ( I ALWAYS have a back up). I am wondering though, there are people saying I should get a hybrid and keep the RBI. Why? If I keep the RBI, what's the difference what amp I have pushing it?

You guys are right though. All the information I need is in this thread, I just have to make up my mind and keep saving my gig money.

[Jim C]

Regardless of SS vs. Tube; 300 watts and a 1x15 could not make enough SPL and clean volume (for me) with 2 gtrs, keys, drums, rock band.
It does work pretty well with an efficient 2x12 and of course kills with a 4x10 or 8x10.

So, aside from the tube debate, it does take a well matched cab to make for a good rig IMO/IME.

[Bmorefoozler]

Originally Posted by Floyd Eye

Sure wish I could try them all out. I'm second guessing myself now. It would be awhile before I would be able afford the CL and it seems like I'd be as well off just sticking with the RBI as getting one of the hybrids.

renting an all-tube SVT for a show would be a great way to ensure it IS what you want, and shouldn't be prohibitively expesnive or too hard to find, depending on where you live.

[Floyd Eye]

Originally Posted by Bmorefoozler

renting an all-tube SVT for a show would be a great way to ensure it IS what you want, and shouldn't be prohibitively expesnive or too hard to find, depending on where you live.

This is a great idea. I live very near the St. Louis metro area so I'm sure I can find one to rent somewhere.

I already have the 810 and it kills. My drummer has a very large kit and we close mic it in it's entirety. My guitar player has a 120 watt tube amp and a full stack of 4x12s ( we only use one) which we also mic. I absolutely never have a problem getting enough power out of my rig. In fact, I'm not even using half the power out of my amp as it is. I run direct out of my RBI to the board.

It is pretty likely I am going to land on an all tube SVT CL or VR. I think you guys who said that this is the tone I am after are correct and I see little point in wasting any money on anything else. I appreciate all the opinions and advice, you guys have been extremely helpful.

I look forward to the day when I post a "NAD" thread to show off my bad ass new SVT rig.

Thanks guys.

[JimmyM]

Originally Posted by Floyd Eye

He has said these exact words to me more than once. You're right though, Jimmy is pretty cool.

Jimmy's a dick.



Anyway, I do think that tubes am the way to go if you want total awesomeness. Good choice...maybe we can share a NAD thread soon...getting a Heritage SVT rig very soon as well

[Floyd Eye]

Originally Posted by JimmyM

Jimmy's a dick.



Anyway, I do think that tubes am the way to go if you want total awesomeness. Good choice...maybe we can share a NAD thread soon...getting a Heritage SVT rig very soon as well

About time you showed up dude. lol



Does this mean you will have one for sale? You know, all cheap to help a brother out and everything. lol

[JimmyM]

Originally Posted by Floyd Eye

About time you showed up dude. lol



Does this mean you will have one for sale? You know, all cheap to help a brother out and everything. lol

Yes, I will be happy to sell my 69 original-run SVT that used to belong to the organ player for Iron Butterfly cheap.

BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!

Oops...sorry! But seriously, I was out for a week with my band on our yearly cruise and had no internet.

[Floyd Eye]

Originally Posted by JimmyM

Yes, I will be happy to sell my 69 original-run SVT that used to belong to the organ player for Iron Butterfly cheap.

BWAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!

Oops...sorry! But seriously, I was out for a week with my band on our yearly cruise and had no internet.

Can't blame a guy for trying.

Did you have withdrawals? lol

[JimmyM]

Originally Posted by Floyd Eye

Can't blame a guy for trying.

Did you have withdrawals? lol

HAHAHA! The only withdrawals I had were not being able to listen to Howard Stern.

[Floyd Eye]

Originally Posted by JimmyM

HAHAHA! The only withdrawals I had were not being able to listen to Howard Stern.

lol

Well, welcome back to civilization my brother.