DADG on an Ampeg 210AV at live levels?

[recreate.me]

Hello eveyone!

I recently sold my 410HLF in hopes of getting a smaller amp for smaller venues. Our band plays shows at places with max capacity around 100, the 410HLF was overkill in my eyes and came off really boomy..

So, i play in a punk/folk/pop 4 piece www.myspace.com/frontiersisaband and so far all of our songs have me tuned to DADG.

I have had smaller cabs and they have all farted out on the Low D string during shows which is why i bought the HLF.

Now i am looking at an Ampeg 15" or the 210av, which is less likely to sound like flatulence at live show volumes?

I use either a fender 62RI Jazz or Road Worn P, with rounds through a 70s Traynor YBA 3 custom special (the one with the master volume and volume) I tend to rock the gain just above break up with a pick.

Thanks for the read and the help!

[Sartori]

I'd never use that tuning, but as long as you're not overpowering the cab, I see no reason why it wouldn't work.

[recreate.me]

Thats the issue, is in the past the low D string seems to send to much low end and the speaker farts. It will be fine at home and low levels but for a show if i keep up my band it hasn't worked.. I didnt want to buy one of those cabs and have it fart... I was hoping someone with either of them could maybe test it out, or has already done it.

My head is 150W tube, so theoretically i shouldn't over power a 200W cab, but when you add in the bass levels and that dropped D string it changes

(the tuning wasn't my idea our singer/guitarist prefers it)

[Sartori]

Every time I've played with a band that tuned to a drop tuning like that (with the lowest two strings separated by a 5th rather than a 4th), I've just tuned to the lowest note standard (for example, DGCF rather than DADG).

But that's neither here nor there.

Lows can be power hogs, but given 150 watts into a 200 watt cab, you should be all right. Just don't boost the lows too much. Low mids can be used to fatten up the sound as well, and don't take as much power, and are easier on speakers.

[recreate.me]

Would an Avatar 212 be a better choice? (I have been offered one in a trade for a MIM Precision bass) I have heard they handle lows better, but i can't really find much on there sound. Any comments on them ?

[JimmyM]

it might be a better choice. the 210av is a sealed 210 designed to sound like a small version of the 810e. i love it, but i don't know if that's what you're looking for. the avatar 212 is made with neos, which give it more power handling, and it's ported, which some consider to be better for lows. not that D is all that low, but the avatar will probably be more of a difference splitter between hlf and the 210av.

[Son of Bovril]

although drop D and tube amps do both place higher demands on a cab's low end, I think that the problem is more the fact that you are running the cab at it's limit that is causing it to fart. I can easily get my ampeg 210 to fart at high volume with a SS amp and standard tuned 4-string even with absolutely no bass boost. it's simply a matter of asking too much from the cab...

the only real way to overcome this is by getting more speakers. there may be some 210's like the eden XST that will handle the low end better but in the long run you are getter off getting a bigger cab, or two smaller ones

[recreate.me]

I used to use an ampeg 810 Classic and loved the sound, so i got the HLF for a better size, and it was way to boomy, and still seemed like overkill. I was hoping the 210AV would be the prefect fit here. This Avatar came along out of no where, it would be cheaper then the 210 and lighter and smaller then the 410hlf, but NOT an ampeg.

Can anyone comment on the difference between the sound of the 210av and a Avatar cab? Could a VT bass pedal remedy this ampeg colour lust i am having ?

[BassmanPaul]

IMO you cannot gig with a 2x10 with regular tuning let alone dropped. I always use a pair (Acme B2s) and they handle my six string without a hassle even when dropping the B to A. Small rigs are fine but if they cannot handle the requirements of the gig they are inadequate and will eventually fail. I stack my pair vertically which allows better dispersion, gets speakers closer to my ears and lifts my amp so that the controls are easily accessed. it's much better to have 4x10s and think you can get away with two than to have 2x10s and NEED four!

[stiles72]

I'm not a 10's person, but I do think the VR Micro Stack is a great sounding little rig that can get a nice round tone out of it. The reason I don't like most cabs with 10"s is that they fart too much unless I don't push the bass knob - which doesn't work for me since I like a big low end with a notched mid and flat highs. If you think the 410HLF is too boomy, then you'll probably think an Ampeg 15 is too boomy also. If you want to go Ampeg, I'd give the 210AV a shot. If it's not enough - you could always add a second one stacked vertically which would be cool too.

[Chef]

The 210AV is neither loud, nor tuned low; but if you like a sealed cab sound it's nice.

It's probably not at all what you want, reading your first post.

[rmkesler]

Originally Posted by stiles72

I'm not a 10's person, but I do think the VR Micro Stack is a great sounding little rig that can get a nice round tone out of it. The reason I don't like most cabs with 10"s is that they fart too much unless I don't push the bass knob - which doesn't work for me since I like a big low end with a notched mid and flat highs. If you think the 410HLF is too boomy, then you'll probably think an Ampeg 15 is too boomy also. If you want to go Ampeg, I'd give the 210AV a shot. If it's not enough - you could always add a second one stacked vertically which would be cool too.

I would think you would have to stack two of the 210AV with the YBA-3. Isn't it a 4 ohm head and the 210AV's are 8 ohm cabs?

[Wes Whitmore]

Sealed is usually less efficient than ported, 2 10s are quieter than 4 10's. You will need to make up for it with more speaker cabs, or a 2x10 that can take a bunch of power.

[recreate.me]

Originally Posted by rmkesler

I would think you would have to stack two of the 210AV with the YBA-3. Isn't it a 4 ohm head and the 210AV's are 8 ohm cabs?

Yeah the YBA is 4 ohm, man i wish i'd have talked to you last year when i bought it i thought it was 8ohm so i ran 8 ohm cabs.. They all worked out fine so i'm not really concerned with that little slip if i go to another 8 ohm.

Really all that would happen is that the head would push the speakers harder.

I'm starting to think the 210av is what i want to have, but it won't work. What i need is an 810 but that won't happen. So right now the best i can do is this Avatar 212 Neo. Its tolexed, and i can trade an unused MIM p bass... seems like a deal ?

[rmkesler]

Originally Posted by recreate.me

Yeah the YBA is 4 ohm, man i wish i'd have talked to you last year when i bought it i thought it was 8ohm so i ran 8 ohm cabs.. They all worked out fine so i'm not really concerned with that little slip if i go to another 8 ohm.

Really all that would happen is that the head would push the speakers harder.

I'm starting to think the 210av is what i want to have, but it won't work. What i need is an 810 but that won't happen. So right now the best i can do is this Avatar 212 Neo. Its tolexed, and i can trade an unused MIM p bass... seems like a deal ?

I assure you there are people that know a whole lot more about this stuff around here than me. I come from the Garanimals school of amp/cab pairing.

[shoot-r]

Originally Posted by recreate.me

Would an Avatar 212 be a better choice? (I have been offered one in a trade for a MIM Precision bass) I have heard they handle lows better, but i can't really find much on there sound. Any comments on them ?

Don't be afraid of going with a Avatar cabinet.
Avatar uses the same speakers and horns as does most of the brand-name bass cabinet manufacturers use.
I went from high dollar, brand name bass cabinets to two Avatar Neo 210 cabinets that I use as a vertical 410...I couldn't be happier!