Demo: fEARful 15/6 vs Genz Benz UB 212T

[Musicman20]

Genz is preferred here.

[HolmeBass]

Originally Posted by guy n. cognito

I do like them. I just like other cabinets a little better.

Here's me at Halloween. What's behind me???



The OP posted about two cabs of which I have personal experience. He asked for opinions. I gave mine. I see no need to avoid these types of threads, simply because my preference may offend a handful of members. It's not trolling, or hate. It's opinion that different than yours.

Well two things- Firsy, I didn't really *ask* for opinions. I only offered a demo, and I admit I expected people to comment with their opinions, but my opinion is made up. I gigged with it tonight, and it was slamming. And second, I didn't accuse you of hating, although others have, in the sense of the now popular internet meme.

I called you and Will "deniers", which is a lot less strong than hate, and hopefully more accurate. Will has also recanted, I saw what you did. And I think the demo shows there are *excellent* commercial cabs to gig with.

You, Guy, are a denier in the sense that you deny that fEARful is the end-all and be-all of bass cabinets.

Originally Posted by guy n. cognito

I don't. I actually own the design (built by LDS) and gig it regularly. It's a great cab. It's not the end-all-be all, but its a great cab.

I am more in the other camp- in my opinion *it is* the end-all and be-all of bass cabinets, except for quiet acoustic / coffee house / winery gigs and the like (got my eyes on a Thunderchild for that... mmmmmmm...).

Originally Posted by willsellout

I don't know, because I can't find you...

LOLzz! I like the Canadian Waldo for Halloween Guy! Looks like a fun time, been a while since I gigged on Halloween. The LDS is stunning, I guess you use it for some gigs but not others? It would be interesting to hear you demo the two cabs with your bass (basses?), amp, eq preferences, just to hear more where you're coming from.

Originally Posted by Freddels

The GB 212neo is not the same as the Uber 212 that the OP was using.

Yeah someone referred to a vertical speaker alignment... not the same cab! That is not “Uber Bass” like the one I have.

http://www.genzbenz.com/?cid=96&fa=d...d=2391&sid=611

Originally Posted by derrico1

Thanks for doing this, Stuart. I've been wanting to hear those two cabs compared for a while now, and these side-by-side clips answered a couple of questions for me (esp. about the hi-end on the tweeterless 15/6 and also just how the high-mids stack up on these two cabs).

Heck JD, you can borrow it for a gig if you want!

Originally Posted by MSUsousaphone

Awesome demo, Holmes. Done very well. And I love that TAFM. MOAR FUZZZZZZZ!

Bruce!!! HELLZ YEAH moar fuzz!!! Should have heard the Hawk into the TAFM tonight, it was downright brutal.

The cab is working like a charm, well done sir- I say, “Well. Done! Sir!!”

[::::BASSIST::::]

For the record I deleted all my posts in this thread relating to guy n. cognito. From this point forward I am going to do my best to just ignore him. Life is too short and I am doing what I can to not get mixed up in these juvenile games.

[Duckwater]

Wow, awesome. I love the sound of both but that fEARful is just amazing.

[iualum]

Originally Posted by guy n. cognito

Comparing new to used prices.

Yes, but a new 15/6 can be had for that same price.

[lelandcrooks]

Originally Posted by guy n. cognito

But you still need clamps and appropriate tools. And, with the application of finish, you certainly aren't going to complete it in a few hours. And....if you have any issues with warping your time frame will go up substantially.

Just pointing out the apples-to-apples comparison.

Not a problem with the kits. I only use Baltic (now Russian as stated earlier) Birch. It's never out more than 1/16. Learned that lesson early on in the flatpack game. Shipped some Auraco flatpacks that were virtually unbuildable by the time they got there.

And it does take more than a few hours to complete. Though I can assemble one from the flatpack in about 15 minutes with a nailer, that's just the start.

[wcriley]

Originally Posted by slade

Then again, sound clips are useless according to Pamela the Pontificator

Hmmm....Maybe we had a communication problem in the other thread. I never said that internet clips were useless for comparing cabs (assuming they are recorded under exactly the same conditions). I said they are useless for evaluating the sound of a cab in the real world.

Signed,
Pope Pam

[jeff7bass]

I like them both but prefer the slightly darker, low mid burlyness of the Uber 212. Sounds more like a rock bass should IMO. Would really like to hear the fEARful 1212/6/1 though, which may be the perfect cab for the sound I like. Awesome demo Holmes. Gets my vote for best topic of the year!

[wcriley]

I would expect the 1212/6/1 to sound almost identical to a 15/6/1 except for that 'special magic" that comes from having 2 LF drivers. The two main differences that I see are:

1. The 1212/6/1 would handle more power, potentially making it louder.
2. The taller 1212/6/1 would get the sound up closer to your ears.

[smeet]

I finally got a chance to listen to the Soundcloud with a good pair of headphones. Nice demo, and it sounds much like my experiences with a 15/6/1, an Uber 410, and a Neox212t.

In person, the differences are emphasized. The clarity of the fEARful can be disturbing to some, and you realize how mid-cloudy most bass speakers are. I also understand why some may prefer the cloudiness.

I have plugged half the port on my fEARful, to get more of that low-mid emphasis, while retaining the clarity and the low bass. I use the great eq on my ShuttleMax 9.2 to add in all the growl and warmth I want on the tube channel, while the FET channel is more clean and linear sounding, like a PA. I can't get that range of tones through any other speakers that I've tried. I do understand that it's not for everybody, but I like it.

[::::BASSIST::::]

Don't let the apparent mid thing freak you out too much

To quote myself:

Its also noteworthy that the 15/6 is a real chameleon of a cab and can do anything from deep dub to face melting rock given adequate eq. It certainly is not a 'one trick pony.'

Here is a clip of me playing thru my AoN 15/6 live outside with no PA support:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w3TTloptTMA&feature=plcp

Comparing my clip to the OPs recording of the 15/6 you can see how different these fEARfuls can sound.

[Nino D]

I thought the Ubber sounded better. Thats why I have one. I liked it better than any of the cabs I tried before i bought it.With the Streamliner 900 its great for rock and metal. But I would like to know which one would get louder with the same head.

[pickles]

Originally Posted by smeet

I finally got a chance to listen to the Soundcloud with a good pair of headphones. Nice demo, and it sounds much like my experiences with a 15/6/1, an Uber 410, and a Neox212t.

In person, the differences are emphasized. The clarity of the fEARful can be disturbing to some, and you realize how mid-cloudy most bass speakers are. I also understand why some may prefer the cloudiness.

I have plugged half the port on my fEARful, to get more of that low-mid emphasis, while retaining the clarity and the low bass. I use the great eq on my ShuttleMax 9.2 to add in all the growl and warmth I want on the tube channel, while the FET channel is more clean and linear sounding, like a PA. I can't get that range of tones through any other speakers that I've tried. I do understand that it's not for everybody, but I like it.

I bet that sounds good, 9.2s have great EQ.

[CL400Peavey]

Originally Posted by Nino D

I thought the Ubber sounded better. Thats why I have one. I liked it better than any of the cabs I tried before i bought it.With the Streamliner 900 its great for rock and metal. But I would like to know which one would get louder with the same head.

This depends on a lot of factors. The amp used/power available, frequency band in question....

There are very few cabs out there that can match a fEARfuls response below 100 Hz, or that have the same kind of power handling. As far as trye max spl goes the 15/6 will smoke a 212.

[thudfromafar]

Originally Posted by smeet

...and you realize how mid-cloudy most bass speakers are. I also understand why some may prefer the cloudiness.

I think that's a good way to put it.

[Nino D]

Where can you buy a fEARful cab ?

[Foz]

http://greenboy.us/fEARful/#builders

or build your own

http://greenboy.us/forum/index.php

most of the parts can be bought here

http://www.speakerhardware.com/categories.php?cat=138

[HolmeBass]

Originally Posted by slade

as the idiot who posted the original thread (that got shut down because it was going in the direction this thread is going) I say a big THANK YOU!! Nice work man! Such obvious differences in these two cabs, and coupled with your review it is very helpful and, dare I say, informative.
Don't let people sitting back analyzing rooms, mics, blah blah set you off- if you're a real player, who's gigged for years, recorded for years, etc- you already know these things. Sitting here in my studio, listening to your recordings through my 20 20s reveals some stuff, regardless of your room and mics (especially with regards to your opinion/review).
This thread will probably be shut down soon, but either way, thanks again for taking the time to record and review- I for one found it informative and a lot more interesting than the bickering that seems to be so common here....
Then again, sound clips are useless according to Pamela the Pontificator
you done good son, and thanks again....

You are welcome. I had thought about what you said, so I decided to try it and see. But I think of this demo as really being the first step in a process of exploration. There are technical deficencies with my recording, no getting around that.

Originally Posted by pickles

Would also love to hear a repeat with that 70s jazz you have listed in your profile and some good compression. Fearful could shine there.

My SM 9.2 just doesn't play very well with my J-bass. Now the the Streamliner, oof the jazz was amazing through that. But the SSD is my player right now, so I bought the amp that made it shine. If you want mids, that Jazz has them in abundance, but then you run both pups full up and there is a scoop- sort of like not much left at that point. I could drive both cabinets with one of my Eden heads, that would be more fair for the Jazz, and I may try just that.

Originally Posted by wcriley

Hmmm....Maybe we had a communication problem in the other thread. I never said that internet clips were useless for comparing cabs (assuming they are recorded under exactly the same conditions). I said they are useless for evaluating the sound of a cab in the real world.

Signed,
Pope Pam

See "process" above, but I agree that for evaluation of how a cabinet will sound with your bass, amp, band, and EQ preferences it is absolutely lacking. Even for comparison, while it is better, it still is only a piece of the picture. Take something as simple as a person playing a Smith and running the tweeter full up on the Genz: that is going to get completely different results. Of course that person would/should run a 15/6/1, not a tweeterless fF, but right there is a huge difference entirely outside the scope of this demo.

BASSIST, thanks for posting that YouTube. I don't know how you EQ'ed your amp, but that was a good sound for the song. I will say that in the band mix I end up sounding very bassy, the mids help with articulation but don't stick out at all, really.

As for which cabinet gets louder, it's tricky. The GB is a 4 ohm cabinet with a thermal rating of 600 W. The fF is an 8 ohm cab with a thermal rating of ?? - I figured 800 W at least. My SM 9.2 is only going to push it to ~500 W though, but I'll tell you this, with the SM 9.2 I am never going to be able to turn either of those boxes up all the way. I don't play music that loud.

So anyway this demo is another brick in the wall rather than the complete home of cabinet choosing. But I thank everyone for their thanks, and am encouraged to try another demo soon, maybe try close micing and getting a better match in recording levels right off the bat, and try some different basses.

[::::BASSIST::::]

It was a gk mb500 and my standard eq for that amp with that cab was 10:00 for both treble and high mid, low-mid 12:30 - 1:00 and everything else flat. Thats with a J bass with very old flats and the tone pot rolled half off.

[scottfeldstein]

Originally Posted by ::::BASSIST::::

It was a gk mb500 and my standard eq for that amp with that cab was 10:00 for both treble and high mid, low-mid 12:30 - 1:00

Sounds about flat to me for that amp.