Eden WT-550B arriving soon

[bassguppy]

I have arriving an Eden WT-550B early next week.

I've been contemplating picking up another cab in order to utilize the full (750 watts) or near full power of the amp. I already have a 4ohm Epifani UL410 (early Series 2).

Should I add a Epi UL210? UL212? Maybe another 410? 4 or 8 ohm? I have also considered picking up a pair of Epifani 310's for their smaller footprint and although the Epi 410 is light it is a little bulky but manageable for my 4 door sedan (wont fit in the trunk).

[babebambi]

Well, to have the absolutely most amount of power from the WT550, you will want to add exactly the same cab you have now, which is another UL410 4ohm. But it will be impossible to fit both cabs into a sedan...


I would think about adding a UL210 8ohm, before considering the 2x UL310; unless the smaller footprint is very important to you. Also the 310 sound significantly different to the 410. I actually can't remember how the 210 sound...

[Rick Auricchio]

Two things:

1. Doubling the power isn't important; it's only 3dB louder, hardly worth it. The second cabinet, however, will make more of a difference in loudness.

2. Why not wait till you try the amp to see if you really need another cabinet?

[bassguppy]

Originally Posted by Rick Auricchio

Two things:

1. Doubling the power isn't important; it's only 3dB louder, hardly worth it. The second cabinet, however, will make more of a difference in loudness.

2. Why not wait till you try the amp to see if you really need another cabinet?

A number of gigs I do are without PA support and are outdoors. I find more times than not "wishing" I had another cabinet just to push a little more volume out.

Currently I have a Crown XTi1000 bridged (1400 watts) but on occasion I am pushing the cab more than I would like and would rather add another cab than really push the 410 at more than my comfort level.

[Rick Auricchio]

In that case, your best bet would be another matching cab. They'll both produce the same output and match nicely.

[babebambi]

Originally Posted by Rick Auricchio

Doubling the power isn't important; it's only 3dB louder, hardly worth it. The second cabinet, however, will make more of a difference in loudness.

interesting thought ...
and do you know with the same power level, how much louder it will be with a second identical cab? that's right +3dB ...
hardly worth it? I don't know ...

[Bluesbob]

Originally Posted by Rick Auricchio

In that case, your best bet would be another matching cab. They'll both produce the same output and match nicely.

Originally Posted by babebambi

interesting thought ...
and do you know with the same power level, how much louder it will be with a second identical cab? that's right +3dB ...
hardly worth it? I don't know ...

A good solid-state power amp should double its' power when the load impedance is halved. In other words, with the WT550, it puts out 300 watts at 8 ohms, which should double with a 4-ohm load to around 600 watts, and then again to 1200 watts into 2 ohms. In real life, there are few amps that can do this, and none of them are cheap.
But the WT 550 puts out about 550 watts at 4 ohms, which is close to doubling. Anyway, if you have an 8-ohm 4X10 cab, at 300 watts, then you have four 10-inch speakers, with each speaker being driven by 75 watts. If you add another identical 8-ohm cab, then the output of the WT550 increases to 550 watts. Now you have eight 10-inch speakers, and each speaker is being driven by almost 70 watts. Not quite 6 dB, but so close that it might as well be. This will result in a large increase in perceived volume, although not twice as loud.
However, if you were to use two 4-ohm 4X10 cabs, the output of the WT550 only increases from 550 to about 750 watts, nowhere near doubling in power. So almost all of the perceived increase in volume would be from the extra speakers, and not from the extra watts. In other words, four 10-inch speakers, with each being driven by nearly 140 watts, as opposed to eight 10-inch speakers, with each being driven by around 90 watts.
I love my WT550, but I have a WT800B for mutiple cab set-ups. I agree that the WT550 and a single 4-ohm 4X10 should be all the stage volume (and enough for small-to-mid-sized venues) you'll need, providing the cab's efficiency ratings are decent, which I believe is true in the case of the Epifani UL410.
Good luck with the Eden and let us know how things go.

[Ryan L.]

I've been using my WT550B into an 8 ohm 210XLT and a 4 ohm 410XLT. I originally bought the setup with the intentions of buying a seperate power amp to run the 410, and power the 210 with the 550.

After owning it for quite a few months, and playing many, many gigs with this setup (including outdoor shows), I can safely say that I have no need for a seperate power amp. The little 550 really has NO trouble powering the 2 cabs. Absolutely love this setup.

[NoHomework81]

I love my WT550! I've had mine for 6 years. It's the only piece of equipment that I've owned that long; everything else has been traded/sold/replaced. It's built like a tank and it sounds great. I know you will like it! I concur that 2 matched cabs would likely give you great results. Either 2 410's or 310's would be an excellent combo!

[Bluesbob]

Originally Posted by Ryan L.

I've been using my WT550B into an 8 ohm 210XLT and a 4 ohm 410XLT. I originally bought the setup with the intentions of buying a seperate power amp to run the 410, and power the 210 with the 550.

After owning it for quite a few months, and playing many, many gigs with this setup (including outdoor shows), I can safely say that I have no need for a seperate power amp. The little 550 really has NO trouble powering the 2 cabs. Absolutely love this setup.

It's not surprizing that the WT550 can carry that rig so well. The two cabs are balanced as far as their output efficiency, and the WT550 puts out about 660 watts at the combined 2.6-ohm load. Each speaker of what is essentially a 6x10 (or three 8-ohm 2X10 cabs, if you want to look at it that way) receives about 110 watts. This is ideal.
Plus, the modularity of this rig is perfect - 2x10 powered by 300 watts with 150 watts per 10-inch, 4X10 at 550 watts with around 140 watts per speaker (but twice as many speakers and twice the cone area) and 6X10 at 110 watts per speaker (times 6!). All depending on what you need for the gig.

[Ryan L.]

Originally Posted by Bluesbob

It's not surprizing that the WT550 can carry that rig so well. The two cabs are balanced as far as their output efficiency, and the WT550 puts out about 660 watts at the combined 2.6-ohm load. Each speaker of what is essentially a 6x10 (or three 8-ohm 2X10 cabs, if you want to look at it that way) receives about 110 watts. This is ideal.
Plus, the modularity of this rig is perfect - 2x10 powered by 300 watts with 150 watts per 10-inch, 4X10 at 550 watts with around 140 watts per speaker (but twice as many speakers and twice the cone area) and 6X10 at 110 watts per speaker (times 6!). All depending on what you need for the gig.

Yeah, it's really ended up working out great for me. I do admit, I was VERY skeptical about the 550 powering both cabs, but man was I proven wrong! And the fact that I basically have 3-rigs-in-one with the two cabs is a huge bonus.

This setup, combined with my Roscoes, is literally tonal heaven for me.

[Gordon of Eden]

I use my WT400 for larger and outdoor venues. Even when running 1 cab (8 ohms) it puts out enough volume for me but with 2 cabs running at 4 ohms that amp is really in the zone! It may be just a 3db increase but I feel that's not the point.
The amp likes to run at 4 ohms. The tone opens up and really breathes, there seems to be considerably more headroom and I just feel I can run at a much higher volume if need be.

Maybe its the extra cab giving the illusion of more power/volume etc. but I feel the extra 3db makes a huge difference.

[babebambi]

I just want to point that with SS power section driving a second additional cab, it's not an either-or case ... where one only increase current thus power / or one only increase the cone area and thus efficiency ...

Usually both applies when doubling the cab; power is up as well as efficiency.
So SPL increase between 3dB and 6dB, usually closer to 6dB.

[rbonner]

Originally Posted by Rick Auricchio

1. Doubling the power isn't important; it's only 3dB louder, hardly worth it. The second cabinet, however, will make more of a difference in loudness.

What? it's only three DB louder..? What if we changed how many DB it was to DOUBLE POWER and it is now 300,000DB. Now it is a lot louder?

Decibels is just a number, because that number is only three doesn't mean its insignificant; it's a doubling of power.

3DB can make a huge difference in volume especially if you are sending that to an additional speaker cabinet.

It can also take a Ho-hum rig that can't whomp it's speaker cab well and turn it into a monster.

If you took a vehicle with 200HP and upped it by 3DB hahahahaha you'd have 400 HP.

If you had a 300 pound bear standing on your chest eating your eyeballs and you increased him by 3DB, you'd have a 600 pound bear standing on your chest.

Don't ever think a 3DB improvement in power is not substantial just because the number is only "3".

BOB

[johnk_10]

Originally Posted by rbonner

What? it's only three DB louder..? What if we changed how many DB it was to DOUBLE POWER and it is now 300,000DB. Now it is a lot louder?

Decibels is just a number, because that number is only three doesn't mean its insignificant; it's a doubling of power.

3DB can make a huge difference in volume especially if you are sending that to an additional speaker cabinet.

It can also take a Ho-hum rig that can't whomp it's speaker cab well and turn it into a monster.

If you took a vehicle with 200HP and upped it by 3DB hahahahaha you'd have 400 HP.

If you had a 300 pound bear standing on your chest eating your eyeballs and you increased him by 3DB, you'd have a 600 pound bear standing on your chest.

Don't ever think a 3DB improvement in power is not substantial just because the number is only "3".

BOB

+1

you go Bob!

[Bluesbob]

Originally Posted by Gordon of Eden

I use my WT400 for larger and outdoor venues. Even when running 1 cab (8 ohms) it puts out enough volume for me but with 2 cabs running at 4 ohms that amp is really in the zone! It may be just a 3db increase but I feel that's not the point.
The amp likes to run at 4 ohms. The tone opens up and really breathes, there seems to be considerably more headroom and I just feel I can run at a much higher volume if need be.
Maybe its the extra cab giving the illusion of more power/volume etc. but I feel the extra 3db makes a huge difference.

This is an excellent example of what happens when the impedance is halved, while adding more speakers. You're right about the increase being 3 dB from the extra cone area (assuming an identical cab), but you forgot to add the increase in wattage you get from the WT400, which increases its' output from 240 watts at 8 ohms to 400 watts at 4 ohms. Together, you're seeing an increase of around 5 dB, which is a significant increase in perceived volume (and/or headroom). 3dB can be defined as a noticable increase in volume/headroom.
I like the analogy to the 300 lb. bear above. Now a 3dB increase in power may seem like a lot (300 to 600 lbs.), but the perceived increase in volume, while noticable, is not close to being twice as loud. The question is ; How much stronger does the bear become when he gains the extra 300 lbs.? At 3dB, you may be still able to fight him off, just not as long. At 5dB (or more), you're lunch!