fEARful 12/12/6

[Holliwood]

KK

After Xmas I'm getting a new cab, or cabs.

I'm 90% settled on the 12/12/6.
My only reservation IS:

Will it be loud enuf for me?
I know it's a great efficient cab but will it have the needed volume with just 2 drivers?
Will it be as loud as say an Ampeg 410 HLF or 2 212" stacked vertical?

Amp is 400W@4ohm.

P.S. I'm not in a place where I can quickly sell the 12/12/6 if it doesn't suit me.

[jeff7bass]

Tremendous stage volume is overrated for most gigging bassists, IMO. Because of the vertical configuration of that cab and its use of high quality speakers and materials, I doubt you’ll even push it to its limits let alone exceed them. Combined with a powerful/flexible head it should work. I have GAS myself for that cab.

[Holliwood]

Originally Posted by jeff7bass

Tremendous stage volume is overrated for most gigging bassists, IMO. Because of the vertical configuration of that cab and its use of high quality speakers and materials, I doubt you’ll even push it to its limits let alone exceed them. Combined with a powerful/flexible head it should work. I have GAS myself for that cab.

I know I won't bottom out the drivers with my 400W but I have to compete with a Bonzo wanna be and 2 sets of Marshall stacks so I'm gonna have to move a fair amount of air.

[BurningSkies]

A 1212/6 is as loud as a 810, but if you're going up against double Marshall stanks and stupid volume, you may wish to consider the 1515/66.

[Holliwood]

Originally Posted by BurningSkies

A 1212/6 is as loud as a 810, but if you're going up against double Marshall stacks and stupid volume, you may wish to consider the 1515/66.

If it'll push with an 810, then that's perfect.

I don't think any sane stage volume will require more than that.

Thx

[rpsands]

Overall sensitivity of the 1212/6 will be similar to a medium quality 4x10 (say an Ampeg 4x10HLF). But it'll extend lower, fuller in the mids, and take it all without complaint or distortion.

It will get about as loud or louder than an 8x10 when pushed, so upgrading amps is on the table if it's needed. Not very many 4x10s will get any louder when pushed beyond 400w.

[makohund]

I have one, and BurningSkies and rpsands are on the money.

If an 810 is loud enough for you, it would be too. But 400W probably won't be enough to get it there.

If you can treat yourself to a new amp too, you'll be golden. If not, the 1515/66 is capable of getting significantly louder, and is more sensitive. It can probably squeeze more volume out of 400W (an assumption on my part), and isn't that much more expensive. A smidge bigger and heavier.

That said, with enough power, mine hangs with big piles of guitarage and loud drummers just fine, at volume levels that require earplugs.

[BurningSkies]

Originally Posted by makohund

I have one, and BurningSkies and rpsands are on the money.

If an 810 is loud enough for you, it would be too. But 400W probably won't be enough to get it there.

If you can treat yourself to a new amp too, you'll be golden. If not, the 1515/66 is capable of getting significantly louder, and is more sensitive. It can probably squeeze more volume out of 400W (an assumption on my part), and isn't that much more expensive. A smidge bigger and heavier.

That said, with enough power, mine hangs with big piles of guitarage and loud drummers just fine, at volume levels that require earplugs.

Back in the ancient fEARful DIY days (aka up to a year ago), it was CHEAPER to make a 15/6 than it was a 12/6...because the 3012LF cost a decent amount more than a 3015LF. It was cheaper and more sensitive. That's one of the reasons you tended to see more of them around...unless the smaller/lighter part of the equation weighed more for a person, most people opted for the 15.

[Toastfuzz]

People don't make fEARful's themselves anymore?

I've been waiting all summer for the weather to turn so I could start working on these as my indoor project. What drivers are the most economical these days? I'm planning 2x 15/6's.

Originally Posted by BurningSkies

Back in the ancient fEARful DIY days (aka up to a year ago), it was CHEAPER to make a 15/6 than it was a 12/6...because the 3012LF cost a decent amount more than a 3015LF. It was cheaper and more sensitive. That's one of the reasons you tended to see more of them around...unless the smaller/lighter part of the equation weighed more for a person, most people opted for the 15.

[BurningSkies]

Originally Posted by Toastfuzz

People don't make fEARful's themselves anymore?

I've been waiting all summer for the weather to turn so I could start working on these as my indoor project. What drivers are the most economical these days? I'm planning 2x 15/6's.

They DO! But because now there are some great official builders and super convenient (and cost effective) kits for home assembly, the days of the bottom-up DIY seems to be fading.

I encourage anyone to take the job into their own hands...but I encourage them even more strongly to DONATE to Greenboy, since he's provided so much time and effort in developing and supporting the fEARful designs.

[makohund]

Originally Posted by BurningSkies

Back in the ancient fEARful DIY days (aka up to a year ago), it was CHEAPER to make a 15/6 than it was a 12/6...because the 3012LF cost a decent amount more than a 3015LF. It was cheaper and more sensitive. That's one of the reasons you tended to see more of them around...unless the smaller/lighter part of the equation weighed more for a person, most people opted for the 15.

Yep. I think that was one of the reasons the 1212/6 was quite a rare beast for a long time. It wasn't THAT much louder than a single 15/6, yet the cost was closer to a 1515/66. There was only MX21 and maybe one or two others before mine.

By the time I needed a cab and found these, the drivers were going up in price already, and the 12 & 15 were about the same I think.

I'm usually a DIY guy, but at the time I had too many other projects going already and no room for another, so I opted for a pro build. I don't regret either the cab choice (its a very nice size and more than I've ever needed for volume) or having it built.

I do still have some GAS though... I'd still like to try my hand at my own build someday, and lust over the various forms of dual 15s. It's ridiculous... I don't have any conceivable need for either, and am thrilled at what I have already. It's just the pure awesomeness of "MORE" that won't quit beckoning me.

[BurningSkies]

Originally Posted by makohund

Yep. I think that was one of the reasons the 1212/6 was quite a rare beast for a long time. It wasn't THAT much louder than a single 15/6, yet the cost was closer to a 1515/66. There was only MX21 and maybe one or two others before mine.

By the time I needed a cab and found these, the drivers were going up in price already, and the 12 & 15 were about the same I think.

I'm usually a DIY guy, but at the time I had too many other projects going already and no room for another, so I opted for a pro build. I don't regret either the cab choice (its a very nice size) or having it built.

I do still have some GAS though... I'd still like to try my hand at my own build someday, and lust over the various forms of dual 15s. It's ridiculous... I don't have any conceivable need for either, and am thrilled at what I have already. It's just the pure awesomeness of "MORE" that won't quit beckoning me.

I don't have the need right now, but I'd love to have a fEARful style PA, with a 15sub and maybe some of greenboy's new mini-cabs on stands. I'd also like our keyboard player to get hip to a 15/6/ for his rig.

[cableguy]

Originally Posted by Holliwood

KK

Amp is 400W@4ohm.

This amp will sound good to a point...... I was pushing 450W into my 12/6 and the amp was distorting. And not the good distortion BTW. I thought my mid driver was having issues but it was just the amp clipping. Now I have a 12/sub with it so I'm putting 600W into a 12/6-12/sub and although it is really loud I can still drive the amp to clipping. So while the 12/12/6 will sound good with 400W it will sound better with around 1000W on tap. This will give you more headroom and alow you to go to 11!

[jeff7bass]

Originally Posted by makohund

I have one, and BurningSkies and rpsands are on the money.
.

Hey I said it first buddy.

Regardless, I just don't see anybody needing more stage volume than a cab that "can match an 810" except for concert and festival giggers. Even in big clubs, the sound guys are going to limit your stage volume for a very good reason, too much of it affects the quality of sound the audience will hear.

I also agree with cableguy, upgrade the head to one with more power and a quaility pre-amp/EQ section.

[Holliwood]

Originally Posted by jeff7bass

Hey I said it first buddy.

Regardless, I just don't see anybody needing more stage volume than a cab that "can match an 810" except for concert and festival giggers. Even in big clubs, the sound guys are going to limit your stage volume for a very good reason, too much of it affects the quality of sound the audience will hear.

I also agree with cableguy, upgrade the head to one with more power and a quaility pre-amp/EQ section.

Quality pre amp/eq????

I'm using Traynor and although I might benefit from a few more hp I'm certainly not lacking in the quality end.

My Canadian made Traynor(with no ICs in the signal path I might add) is much better than any of the outsourced chinese rigs I've seen of late.

The amp techs at Traynor ACTUALLY care about the gear they build unlike what's his face in china who will be working at a different factory making rubber dog **** next week.

[makohund]

Originally Posted by jeff7bass

Hey I said it first buddy.

Yeah, you did. Sorry. But you also put heavy emphasis on "you don't need as much volume as you think". You may be right on that, or might not.

He might play some decent sized spaces with no PA support. Or even outdoors, which can render an otherwise good indoor rig into a useless toy.