Fender Twin for bass?

[ULTRAGHOST]

Hello all,

I'm new to the forum, been lurking for about a week, and have been seeking your expertise with a question of mine. Recent (within the last year) convert from guitar to bass, and I've been on a eye-ball bleeding, ear-tiring, and wallet scaring quest to find myself a decent bass rig. Things I've considered:

Acoustic b200h with matching 4x10 (price is the most attractive here [but I know some of you guys love this amp and that is why I've been checking it out. Certainly great tone for a stupid value])

Sovtek MIG 100b with matching 2x15 (a buddy of mine's)

Orange Bass Terror (500 watt) with matching cab or something of the Avatar variety

Ampeg V4/SVT/life-mortage


And I started thinking about what of my guitar arsenal would make the most sense parting with to help fund my purchase: Fender Twin Reissue.

After trying a bunch of amps, reading about solid state versus tube and the ever raging argument that tube driven amps don't really benefit bass tone, yadda, yadda, YADDA ... I began thinking, "hey! what if I turn my Twin into a head and snag some solid 4x10 to pair it with?" And this is where I am now, absolutely loving the tone of my Twin driving my buddy's Sovtek 2x15 cabinet (other than the general flub of 15's), and wondering two things:

1. I've read that using a Twin with a bass cab is a wonderful way to practice at home, and really nice sounding in the studio, how is it for live applications? (I gig small - medium sized clubs with PA systems, but would it hold up and cut through when played against a drummer?)

2. When I was using the Twin as my main guitar rig, anything past 5, if my shoulders were not yet soaked in the blood from my ears, seemed to "fatten" the tone rather than increase it's volume. If I really drive, say a 400 watt 4x10, will this amp thump and bump, or grind and fizzle?

Also, seeing as how I know little to nothing of bass rigs, what would you guys suggest? My budget hovers around $700 dollars, and this is what is mostly driving me to want to convert my Fender into a sweet little bass rig.

P.S. - I currently play a G&L L-2000 active/passive bass.

P.P.S. - I own an Avatar open back loaded with Hellatone 30's and am very impressed with the quality and sound of the cab (no rattle, solid as a rock), are the bass cabs also something to write home about?

If you've made it this far, you may very well be a saint.

Thanks in advance,
ULTRAGHOST

[snowblinder]

If you are playing in a loud rock band, I sincerely doubt that a Twin through any cab would be sufficient. Then again, plenty of people have excellent results with 100 watt tube amps for bass, so....it's just something you'd have to try out for yourself and see if it suits your needs. Personally, I could never get by with a 100 watt bass amp, but I've known guys who have used and loved them. Opinions vary.

At the very least, it'll probably still sound excellent, and may serve you well for studio use. The bass tone on Nirvana's Bleach is a Fender Twin through some sort of bass cabinet, and I think that sounds pretty good.

[FletcherML]

I think as long as you can run through a pa you should be fine for live sound. I've heard plenty of good about avatar guitar cabs, but like you, not much on their bass gear. I'm addicted to Ampeg, I can't picture anything being ok for me other than maybe an Orange cab. Honestly I'd suggest getting a tube amp (in my opinion, solid state doesn't cut it. There is definitely a difference in tone and power) but I know how it is not wanting to drop the cash. But if you can convince yourself to spend in the future, you'll never look back (probably)

[RTL]

If I were you, I wouldn't butcher the Twin. Leave it alone and hit up the used market for a rig. $700 will get you something louder and more practical for bass.

I'd suggest hitting the TB classifieds for a head, and buy a nice cab locally (you don't wanna pay shipping on a cab - trust me). I'm not sure where you're located, but on my local Craig's List, 4X10" cabs regularly pop up in the $200 - $250 range. Avatar cabs are always a good choice, as well. While they may not have that magical balance and sparkle that a Bergantino delivers, you're gonna have to look really hard to find something better for the money.

[nicoli]

While I think it would probably sound really good, I don't see that Twin being loud enough for too many gig applications. I occasionally run a 50 watt Marshall head and while it sounds incredible, it runs out of volume pretty fast. If you're playing with a loud drummer or guitarist(s) with a reasonably loud rig, I don't think it would cut it. I think your best bet is to sell it and use the money to buy something with some more power.

[nysbob]

The "general flub" of 15"s is exactly why you're loving the sound of the twin - those 15"s are going to deliver the most meat per watt. Through that type of box, you probably will have adequate volume to do the gigs you describe. A less efficient 410 probably won't do it with that amp.

That's my story and I'm stickin' to it.

[billfitzmaurice]

The Twin is the same amp as the Bassman 100, save the reverb, tremolo and deep switch. It's OK as a bass amp, but only OK, and literally eight times the size and weight of a lot of recent offerings that work a whole lot better.

[nysbob]

Originally Posted by billfitzmaurice

...literally eight times the size and weight of a lot of recent offerings that work a whole lot better.

For a second I thought my wife was posting on Talkbass.

[toobalicious]

meh... 100 watts of tube amp can be plenty of juice in the right application, especially if you can stand a little hair on your sound.

just last week, i played a lowly 55-ish watt ampeg B25B through a single trace 1x15 with a loud-ish rock band (each guitard has a peavey 5150 100 watt head and 4x12 cab). sure, it was overdriven, and it certainly wasnt deafening, but damned if it didnt fill that space up (perhaps 30x50 warehouse type space). we were loud enough, in fact, that i wore my fancy earplugs all night. it really did sound just awesome. i tried to no avail to buy that cabinet on the spot... it blew the socks off of the little 1x15 cab i have been using it with.

i also regularly use, with *great* results a 100 watt bassman head, or a 100 watt peavey windsor that i turned into a bass amp. laugh all you want... it is actually pretty aggressive sounding--- killer for all of that grindy prog-rock stuff. blah blah blah.

cant you just borrow a bass cab and try it?

[Jim Carr]

Originally Posted by RTL

If I were you, I wouldn't butcher the Twin. Leave it alone and hit up the used market for a rig..

+1

On the buy used advice. About butchering the Twin, IIRC, the Twin has a pair of main outs, neither of which is hard-wired.

A simple speaker wire of appropriate gauge and length with 1/4" jacks should be all you need to drive a bass cab with the Twin.


BTW, I recently picked up a 600 watt GB Shuttle 6.0 for under $500. You may find one for less.

[johnk_10]

there's no need to 'butcher' a twin head. you could just buy or build a head box for it, and slide the chassis into it. personally, i think that they make a great bass amp when coupled with a very efficient 2x15 bass cab.

[MIJ-VI]

Originally Posted by johnk_10

there's no need to 'butcher' a twin head. you could just buy or build a head box for it, and slide the chassis into it. personally, i think that they make a great bass amp when coupled with a very efficient 2x15 bass cab.

A Dual Showman Reverb (essentially a Twin Reverb minus built-in speakers which was paired with a 2 X 15" JBL-loaded cab suitable for guitar or bass) head box would do it.

Here's one source...

http://www.newellamps.com/catalog.html

...and there's likely others.

A Google search may turn up the plans for one as well.

[RJC1811]

Step #1 - Get a good bass cab. Something you can see yourself keeping for a while.

Step #2 - Unplug the twin's speakers and plug in the bass cab. If it sounds good with plenty of volume then gig with it and see how it does.

Step #3 - If it sounds great and is the sound you're loking for then convert it to a head. Great suggestions above about mounting the chassis in a new box.

If it doesn't thrill you, move on to step #4 - Shop for a used head. I found a GK 1001RBII for 325 and just love it.

[bassman10096]

Step #1 - Get a good bass cab. Something you can see yourself keeping for a while.

Agree

Step #2 - Unplug the twin's speakers and plug in the bass cab. If it sounds good with plenty of volume then gig with it and see how it does.

Agree

Step #3 - If it sounds great and is the sound you're loking for then convert it to a head. Great suggestions above about mounting the chassis in a new box.

Don't butcher, dismantle or mess with a perfectly good Twin. Even the effort required to build a separate housing for the Twin's chassis (during which time, you can't use or sell the Twin) is unneccesary, considering the other options available at reasonable prices (Bassman 100, Dual Showman, etc). If you are done with the Twin and believe your experiment found you what you want, sell the twin and use the money to buy a Bassman 100 head.

The Twin has been used in unusual ways before, to capture that excellent Fender tube sound. Motown and other studios recorded bass sometimes (using the native 12's) by mic'ing and then boosting the gain and volume on the recording side. The Twin and Dual Showman front preamp sections were copied by Alembic to build their FB-2 preamps (for use with a power amp).

[Wes Whitmore]

You will need a speaker level DI if you plan on putting that head through the PA, or micing the bass cab...

[coreyfyfe]

Originally Posted by johnk_10

there's no need to 'butcher' a twin head. you could just buy or build a head box for it, and slide the chassis into it. personally, i think that they make a great bass amp when coupled with a very efficient 2x15 bass cab.

+1 to this. Played through an efficient cab you should be fine. If you have the room to move them both you could keep the twin in it's own box assuming it has castors on the bottom. That way instead of carrying it you can roll in the twin, plug it into the bass cab, and away you go.

As far as bedroom practice/recording, listen to your speakers and make sure you don't blow them. I used to use my twin all the time as my dorm amp for both guitar and bass, and I've done some recording with a bassman through a 2x12 when no other amp was available. It will work out fine as long as you don't push things to their limits.

[Wes Whitmore]

The Twin is some 26" wide, so it will be wider than most commercial 24" wide cabs available today. That might not be a huge issue for you, but something to consider.

[billfitzmaurice]

Originally Posted by Wes Whitmore

You will need a speaker level DI if you plan on putting that head through the PA, or micing the bass cab...

As is the case with all push-pull tube amps you can get a balanced output by tapping the input and output of the inverter tube, isolating the send output with caps, padding it with resistors for a fixed level or a stereo pot for a variable level. It's a simple job for any good tube amp tech.

[username1]

I used a fender twin once for a job with a single 15" bass bottom as an extension speaker along with the twins speakers and it worked great. I even got compliments on my sound that night.

[faceinbass]

Use what you want but I would have skipped the thread and hit that Sovtek with a quickness. Is it still available? ;-)