Getting the best out of an SVT/810 rig

[WhiteNinja]

Hey all,

Since this summer I'm a proud owner of a new SVT-VR and an 810E cab. Absolutely amazing amp, even though it's heavy as hell, lol.

Now, I really don't get much chance to play it, once a week minimum, so I really haven't had much time to play around with it and experimenting with it. Because of that, I'm still kinda struggling with it. Mind you, not really much, but there's still a lot for me to learn from this amp, and trying to get that "Holy Grail" sound out of it. It's already the best amp I've ever heard with everything set to flat.

I play in a Stoner Rock-ish band (Kyuss, QOTSA, Fu Manchu, Unida etc), and I really love the bass sound in those bands: that heavy bassy growl with lots of distortion, lots of midrange push. I want something similar as my sound. The best way to do it is by cranking the amp, is what most people say, but that would be crazy loud in the end. I tend to have the volume around 9-10 o'clock, and the others already complain, lol.

My current setup is as follows: P-Bass with 1/4 pounders > Phat Phuk B> Tall Font Russian Fuzz > EB Volume Pedal > Morley ABY switch > (output A) Channel 1 of SVT and (output B) > Fulltone OCD > Channel 2 of SVT.

I have the tone knob almost turned completely anti-clockwise for a very bassy sound. I find that having it around in the middle of full up is too clanky for my tastes, but that might be just the bass or these particular pickups. The result though isn't exactly to my liking, it's almost too boomy and bassy, and the overdrive in Channel 2 is gone as soon as one of the guitarists plays. I'm thinking about swapping the pickups again, the 1/4 are kinda "scooped" for my taste... Also, I play with a pick, usually close to the neck, around the pickup area and higher. I want to get a better sound that sits well in the mix with 1-2 guitars, without loosing too much definition.

So my questions to you good TB folks:
If you have an SVT, how do you set it up?
How do you play around with the channels and EQ?
What frequencies do you pay most attention too?
What works best for you?
Do you have any tips regarding my setup?
How do I use the Midrange effectively, which setting?

I know, the SVT-VR is as simple as it gets, plug and play as most people say. But I just want to get the best out of it.

Thanks in advance!

[pablomigraine]

Originally Posted by WhiteNinja

My current setup is as follows: P-Bass with 1/4 pounders > Phat Phuk B> Tall Font Russian Fuzz > EB Volume Pedal > Morley ABY switch > (output A) Channel 1 of SVT and (output B) > Fulltone OCD > Channel 2 of SVT.

I have the tone knob almost turned completely anti-clockwise for a very bassy sound. I find that having it around in the middle of full up is too clanky for my tastes, but that might be just the bass or these particular pickups. The result though isn't exactly to my liking, it's almost too boomy and bassy, and the overdrive in Channel 2 is gone as soon as one of the guitarists plays. I'm thinking about swapping the pickups again, the 1/4 are kinda "scooped" for my taste... Also, I play with a pick, usually close to the neck, around the pickup area and higher. I want to get a better sound that sits well in the mix with 1-2 guitars, without loosing too much definition.

This is your problem.... if you could take any of those bands and isolate the bass track, you would hear that they have TONS of high-midrange and and treble.... which actually contributes to the mix when everything is played together, but what you mainly hear as the bass is everything below 400hz. For example.... go to you tube and listen to Pantera's "Im Broken"... then listen to the isolated bass and drum track you'll see in the related videos list.... in the full song you dont even hear anything but thick clear low-bass. In the isolated track you hear lots of grindy SVT overdrive and a huge amount of treble. Turn your tone knob on full. Also understand that your overall "real" non-pedal overdrive and distortion will be DRAMATICALLY altered in flavor and intensity based on the type and level of the signal going into the input stage of the preamp.... if you're cutting out all the signal above 600Hz..... you wont even really hear any overdrive or distortion... just bloomy, boomy mess. Understand that Overdrive and distortion begin as harmonic distortion.... and if you're cutting out the even-order harmonics higher up in the frequency range..... the amp wont distort them!!

First, I would turn everything else in your signal chain off....pedals etc all off. Bear in mind that "THE SVT TONE" only arrives once you have reached incredibly loud sound levels... where both the input section tubes AND the output tubes are breaking up. The main reason the Sansamp BDDI boxes are so popular in the studio is because they give a very fair representation of a mic'd up SVT at the max without all the difficulties attendant to mic'ing up a huge cabinet playing at insanely loud volumes. Get yourself into a large room or even outdoors if possible and get your new "Basic" tone, tone knob all the way up, input gain anywhere past noon, Ultra-Lo engaged, some midrange boost at #4 or #5, some treble, and Master anywhere past noon. It may sound trebly and clanky to you but understand that this will ADD TO and ENHANCE the entire mix, and will NOT come thru as bass clank in a mix..... you will also hear a lot more fuzz and overdrive coming from the amp naturally... without the pedals as a result of the preamp being overdriven across the full frequency spectrum, and the output being high enough to break up the power tubes. Once you have the rig really pumping.... then decide how much fuzz or whatever else you want to add....

my $0.02 from six years or so of using this type of rig...

[coreyfyfe]

Originally Posted by pablomigraine

Get yourself into a large room or even outdoors if possible and get your new "Basic" tone, tone knob all the way up, input gain anywhere past noon, Ultra-Lo engaged, some midrange boost at #4 or #5, some treble, and Master anywhere past noon. It may sound trebly and clanky to you but understand that this will ADD TO and ENHANCE the entire mix, and will NOT come thru as bass clank in a mix..... you will also hear a lot more fuzz and overdrive coming from the amp naturally... without the pedals as a result of the preamp being overdriven across the full frequency spectrum, and the output being high enough to break up the power tubes. Once you have the rig really pumping.... then decide how much fuzz or whatever else you want to add....

The SVT-VR doesn't have gain/master. Also, I tend to avoid the ultra-high/low switches as they act by cutting your high and low mids, respectively.

OP, if you're playing a P-bass near the neck and have the tone knob rolled off you're going to get a ton of thump so no surprise you're missing the drive sound. For my P-bass I run it with the volume and tone wide open most of the time, tone rolled back when necessary, played finger style 99% of the time so I can control my tone with my playing. For the settings on my SVT I usually run the bass around 2-2:30, mids around 2:30-3 on 800Hz, and treble at noon ultra high and low switches off. This is through a flatback cab, so it sounds a fair bit different from the modern cabs, but you can adjust a little of the low/mid balance to get a similar sound. I use a variety of pedals for my drive sound, but if you're trying to run dirty all the time, I'd suggest just running the pedals in front instead of setting up clean and dirty channels. It will simplify things and make eqing a fair bit easier instead of having to balance the two channels.

[JimmyM]

Ya, too much low end and no highs or mids will do that to you, especially if you you use distortion, as distortion is heard in the highs and mids way more than the lows.

[anderbass]

Originally Posted by WhiteNinja

I have the tone knob almost turned completely anti-clockwise for a very bassy sound. I find that having it around in the middle of full up is too clanky for my tastes,

What frequencies do you pay most attention too?

Sounds like you should try some flatwound strings, and then give them a couple weeks of playing to break in. You'll end up with much less clank even with your amps mid-knob boosted.

Then once your comfortable boosting the amps mid knob up past the center point, you'll only then be able to hear/experiment with your amps Frequency-switch settings and find the sound you want. (the amps frequency switch doesn't do anything until your amps mid-knob is boosted)

[pablomigraine]

Originally Posted by anderbass

Sounds like you should try some flatwound strings, and then give them a couple weeks of playing to break in. You'll end up with much less clank even with your amps mid-knob boosted.

Then once your comfortable boosting the amps mid knob up past the center point, you'll only then be able to hear/experiment with your amps Frequency-switch settings and find the sound you want. (the amps frequency switch doesn't do anything until your amps mid-knob is boosted)

None of the bands he's listening to use flats..... just sayin....

[Gearhead17]

1/4 Pounders - I suggest getting rid of these right away. You are missing a huge amount of midrange presence that you need to be heard in a band situation with distortion.

Using the Ultra Low switch with those pickups is the EASIEST way to disappear from a band mix.....

Tone knob all the way up too. A distorted bass tone should sound UGLY when soloed. Ugly tones are heard in the mix and tones that sound really good by yourself generally do not work well. Keep in mind that your pedals (especially the fuzz pedals) can quickly eat up your midrange frequencies and coupled with the scooped 1/4 Pounders, your chances of being heard are around 0.

Listen to the other posts. But DO NOT TOUCH the ULTRA LOW switch on channel 1. Unless you do not want to hear your notes.... It cuts the 600hz range 20db's.

[anderbass]

Originally Posted by pablomigraine

None of the bands he's listening to use flats..... just sayin....

Yeah but the bassist in those other bands might have better playing technique and end up with less clank...

[blastjv]

I like the ultra lo switch. It's actually a very important part of my sound. I have a very mid-focused sound overall and I like the scoop in that range. I still cut very well in a very dense mix because I have lots of mids and harmonics in other ranges. If you care to listen, Lie Down with Wolves at the link in my sig is a good example. That's my standard sound. Probably a bit more clang than you're after, but it works for me...

FWIW, I jump both channels on my SVT-VR. I can't recall my settings right now, but I can post them later...

-JV

[WhiteNinja]

Thanks all for the very helpful advice!

I forgot to tell you guys my settings on the SVT, lol. I usually have the treble around 11-12, the midrange at 2 @ 800hz, and the Bass at around 1, all on channel 1. The only switch I have engaged is the Bass Cut one (having it off will set off our drummer's car alarm, lol). Channel two has a bit more treble around 1, and bass around 11. No switches engaged. As you can see, I don't cut any mid frequencies. The Morley switch is set to A+B, so I have both a clean and OD channel going on. Could this be a problem, too?

I should really try getting some different pickups in my bass. The 1/4 pounders sound good when soloed, but I just don't like the sound in the band mix. I was also toying with the idea of using flatwounds. I had the pots on the bass changed from 500k to CTS 250k's, so they have a less brighter sound.

I dunno really how to describe my sound at the moment. It's a bit like this, but much boomier and undefined:

35007 - Voyage Automatique - YouTube
35007 - Crystalline - YouTube

It's not as nice as that though. It's just too undefined. That type of sounds probably works best for that type of music though, with no distorted guitars.

[ducknturtle]

Picking closer to the bridge will give you more attack and presence. That could answer part of your problem.

[RickenBoogie]

The Morley switcher wouldn't be my first choice, if you want to continue running 2 signals. Since it's a passive device, you won't get balanced outputs from both A and B together. An active or buffered switcher will work much better. (Radial, Lehle, etc.)

[Dustin Teel]

I would cut more treble and give it more mid. Also roll back some on the tone knob if you're using a passive bass.

(based on the tracks you provided)

[will33]

Your amp settings look to me like they should be giving you the harmonics, etc. First thing I'd try is a fresh new set of strings on the bass, nickel roundwounds. If that doesn't do it, you may want to change your pickup to a spb-1 or other more regular p-bass type pickup instead of that bottom heavy, scooped 1/4 pounder.

[LiquidMidnight]

Originally Posted by pablomigraine

This is your problem.... if you could take any of those bands and isolate the bass track, you would hear that they have TONS of high-midrange and and treble.... which actually contributes to the mix when everything is played together, but what you mainly hear as the bass is everything below 400hz. For example.... go to you tube and listen to Pantera's "Im Broken"... then listen to the isolated bass and drum track you'll see in the related videos list.... in the full song you dont even hear anything but thick clear low-bass. In the isolated track you hear lots of grindy SVT overdrive and a huge amount of treble. Turn your tone knob on full. Also understand that your overall "real" non-pedal overdrive and distortion will be DRAMATICALLY altered in flavor and intensity based on the type and level of the signal going into the input stage of the preamp.... if you're cutting out all the signal above 600Hz..... you wont even really hear any overdrive or distortion... just bloomy, boomy mess. Understand that Overdrive and distortion begin as harmonic distortion.... and if you're cutting out the even-order harmonics higher up in the frequency range..... the amp wont distort them!!

+10,000

You don't really "hear" the mids and highs of the bass when it's in the mix, but those frequencies are what's giving the bass its presence.

[will33]

Also the VR is a non-master volume amp, you're gonna have to turn it up to 11:00-12:00 to get some grit going.

[Alex1984]

I'd turn up the tone knob on your bass, and maybe use Fender Original 62 pickups. You need to put the mids and highs back into your tone.

[WhiteNinja]

Well, I'll try to get the pups changed then. It's a P-J bass, with both being 1/4 pounders, but I have the J pup always turned off. Don't really like it, tbh.

Which ones would you guys suggest? What about the DiMarzio Model-P and Model-J? I hear they are quite close to original ones, but with more output:
DIMARZIO DP126 BK - Thomann UK Cyberstore

Any other ones that might be interesting?

Also, I'll try to get a sound-file and post it here so you guys can get an idea of my sound, but it's probably not really representative of the actual sound in the room, since it's recorded via DI from the amp, pre.

[will33]

Duncan SPB-1's are a pretty good representation of what a P should be and they're not real expensive either but there are tons of these things out there, all slightly different. Maybe post about that in the pickups section. I like playing a straight Pbass but it wouldn't hurt to put a good J pickup by the bridge and dial a little bit of it in for a little bite if you need to.

[Alex1984]

Yeah, dialing in the jazz a bit could be great for you!