Guitar Box (Marshall Slash 4x12) for Bass

[kombi]

Hi folks,

i played a Marshall Slash 4x12 guitar box from the 90's yesterday and was suprisingly pleased by it's mid-orientated sound (wich I like). It sounded much better and bassier than I first thought and I could get it relatively cheap (500$).

Pro:
- I like the sound of it
- No transportation (already sits in our rehearsal room)
- Could get it relatively cheap, maybe trying to sell again for a few bucks more

Con:
- It's f*ing HUGE
- Looks very used - but was actually standing around for ages, waiting to be played

So, now I'm thinking if I should go for it or rather spend the 500$ for a bass cab (I was thinking about a 4x10 Hartke but propably an 4x10 Ampeg). Or take the risk of buying and trying to sell again for a couple of bucks more?

I would appreciate some of your opinions

PIC:

[Oobly]

From what I can gather, it's not a very high power cabinet. Most of the Marshal 4x12s were 75 or 100W. Won't go very loud, especially with a bass signal and you could be in danger of overpowering it pretty easily with almost any bass amp. Certainly not worth the money IMHO if you plan to use it for bass. You can get a louder, smaller, good sounding BASS cab for that $500.

[alec]

My guitarist has a Marshall M412A which is the cheap Vietnamese made one, and that's 300W.
I haven't used it for bass.

[kombi]

Originally Posted by Oobly

From what I can gather, it's not a very high power cabinet. Most of the Marshal 4x12s were 75 or 100W. Won't go very loud, especially with a bass signal and you could be in danger of overpowering it pretty easily with almost any bass amp. Certainly not worth the money IMHO if you plan to use it for bass. You can get a louder, smaller, good sounding BASS cab for that $500.

Well, from what I know, this box (at least the one in our rehearsal room) has ~300 Watt. I pushed it up to ~85% volume and it cracks walls - but I have no idea if this would be a good idea on the long term, even running it with 50-60% of volume...

[nysbob]

Those guitar celestions are fairly light and responsive and sound great if you don't ask them to do what they can't.

If you're playing a 5 string I wouldn't recommend it, though. They'll really struggle down there.

[T-Bird]

Hi.

Originally Posted by Oobly

Most of the Marshal 4x12s were 75 or 100W.

Per speaker.
300/400W cabs respectively. The vintage ones were 100W, but those are few and far between. Reissue Greenback equipped cabs are quite a bit pricier.

Even though I liked the Marshall 412 215 stack I had back in the day, those were bass speakers, not guitar ones. I wouldn't buy a guitar cab for bass if it was to be my only cab.

Since it's a slanted top cab, I'd guess it's the combination of relatively large speaker area and actually hearing the mids and highs is what You like about it. A good 110 at ear level will probably sound the same, and 410 at ear level will sound the same and also have the same (or more) oomph.

Regards
Sam

[will33]

Forget the watts thing, it's excursion capability in the lows where guitar drivers run out of room quick. They're made to break up and if you like those grindy mids and highs, cool. Look into biamping with a real bass cab playing the low end or look into a custom made bass cab using a long excursion woofer(s) playing the very lowend cleanly crossed to a guitar driver for the mids/highs. Your output potential then goes way up because the guitar driver isn't struggling with lows. You can have the tone and fill a room with bass.

FWIW, the old 100watt marshalls would be loaded with 25w greenbacks. Sweet for guitar indeed.

[Zalt]

had fun with a 4x12 Marshall b bottom the other night at pratice. it made a nice growling sound. i'm afraid it was on the verge of major speaker dammage. any thoughts?

[basscooker]

great idea-- on paper. maybe overkill, but for lower volume to mic for recording, go for it if you like. i wouldn't trust any cab voiced for guitar, or containing guitar speakers, for real rehearsal or gig use. like said already don't get fooled by watts ratings. that's an electrical/signal related spec- not a physical/mechanical rating. you'll turn those cones into confetti putting 300 watts of bass thru it.

[johnk_10]

alot of them have four 75w celestion 12's for a 300W cab. i actually think they sound good (and loud) for bass, but have a very distinctive voice (lots 'o' mids), and if that's what you're going for tone-wise, there's nothing else like 'em. i personally like a bit more low end 90% of the time.

[Seans]

The Slash has celestion vintage 30's, 60w 75hz and 100 db, these are modern increased power versions of the original Greenbacks. Greenbacks came originally with two models, bass and guitar 55 and 75 hz ( Page, Kossof and Hendrix all used the Bass versions), then they offered Heavy or Medium magnets, making the normal G12M 25 (medium mag) into a G12H 30 heavier magnet and 5 more watts.
I have an original greenback Bass cab and the sound is just amazing, very alive and punchy, but a studio and small gig cab only. The Slash being 240w should be fine, although it does have the 75 hz guitar freq speakers.

[kombi]

Originally Posted by johnk_10

alot of them have four 75w celestion 12's for a 300W cab. i actually think they sound good (and loud) for bass, but have a very distinctive voice (lots 'o' mids), and if that's what you're going for tone-wise, there's nothing else like 'em. i personally like a bit more low end 90% of the time.

Yeah, I'm a mid-type and totally like the mid-powered sound when I plug my bass in it. When I play Ska/Reggae through it, it can really punch out some good deeps. Even though I cant hear some damaging on the speakers when I pull up the lows, I'm still careful here because in the end, it's designed for guitars.

Originally Posted by Zalt

had fun with a 4x12 Marshall b bottom the other night at pratice. it made a nice growling sound. i'm afraid it was on the verge of major speaker dammage. any thoughts?

I think you should read BogeyBass' post here: How far can i push my combo amp?
The starting question was another, but I think this could answer your question.

[Bassmec]

Originally Posted by kombi

Yeah, I'm a mid-type and totally like the mid-powered sound when I plug my bass in it. When I play Ska/Reggae through it, it can really punch out some good deeps. Even though I cant hear some damaging on the speakers when I pull up the lows, I'm still careful here because in the end, it's designed for guitars.



I think you should read BogeyBass' post here: How far can i push my combo amp?
The starting question was another, but I think this could answer your question.

As an ex celestion test engineer here in ipswich. I cant say that I would recommend those drivers for long life in bass use, we did have quite good results with the sidewinder driver in these very limited internal volume 4 X 12 cabs.

The best marshall 4 X 12 cab for bass was the old TV model that was taller than standard 1960 types, it was great with sidewinders, a driver we developed in response to the high efficiency of the Altec/JBL edge wound designs.
S150's where a very rugged premium driver and sadly marshall didn't want many of them in comparison to the run of the mill pressed basket economy models like Vintage 30's and g12-75's.

Here is a Harmony Central review of the sidewinder.
Celestion S-150 - 150 Watt Speaker, solid cast frame. Not many features needed. Read about these in a book about Marshall amps written in the 90's. They recommended these for a combo amp so I put one in my Marshall 2554 and it made the factory Vintage 30 eat dirt. Speaker was probably made in late 80's but I'm not sure about Celestion's date codes. I play Rock and Metal and this covers all the bases. Would probably work great for other types of music if you want your amp to control the sound instead the speaker being pushed to it's limits.

[AdamR]

Thats a V30 cab. 60 watts each speaker so it will only handle 240 watts @ a 16ohm load. Buy a bass cabinet.

Most Marshalls have 75 watters that are very mid scooped, The V30s are very high mid heavy.

[Zalt]

kombi, were you going for some crazy distorted tone out of the 4X12? Guess i wouldn’t recommend it as a primary cab for bass.

the 1960 4x12 is more like a twisted tangent for me. i've got a thunder funk 800 running into a couple 15" at the moment for gigs.
the growl i got out of the marshal is still haunting me, i loved the sound.

Bassmec ? is the growl im hearing the event horizon of turning my speakers to dust or will it tolerate the abuse?

[Bassmec]

Originally Posted by Zalt

kombi, were you going for some crazy distorted tone out of the 4X12? Guess i wouldn’t recommend it as a primary cab for bass.

the 1960 4x12 is more like a twisted tangent for me. i've got a thunder funk 800 running into a couple 15" at the moment for gigs.
the growl i got out of the marshal is still haunting me, i loved the sound.

Bassmec ? is the growl im hearing the event horizon of turning my speakers to dust or will it tolerate the abuse?

I think it will depend on the EQ you send it. if you try to make
frequencies its incapable of IE lower than 75hz it will probably
suffer from mechanical damage before it starts burning the voice coils.
If you drove a 1960 lead cab with a 100 watt tube guitar amp with a limited amount of bass boost like a JCM 800 for a passive bass 4 string eadg tuning with the standard g12-75's would last quite well in fact far better than a cab full of V 30's.
Speaking of bright upper midrange.
Randy Rhodes used to fill marshall 4 X 12's up with Altec 417h alnico drivers weighing about 16 lbs each!? poor road crew!. Sounded awesome though!.