Hartke 4x10 v. 4.5 4x10 comparison

tonynoriega · #1 12-29-2010, 08:53 AM

For many years my 4x10XL Hartke (no horn) has served me well but has recently developed a slight buzzing that I can't seem to find the source of. Yesterday a 4.5 Hartke 4x10 became available and I bought it thinking I'd keep the old cab as a backup. The two are now sitting side by side in my living room and when I A/B them, the new cabinet doesn't even come close to sounding as good as the old one, buzz not withstanding.

The older cab is bolder, warmer and just seems to project well. By the way, there is nothing amiss with the newer one because it's firing on all 4 and sounds OK until I do the comparison.

I use a 400rb (only amp I presently have) and I wonder if the 4.5 just requires a more powerful amp to make it sound good. Any and all advice from you guys will be gratefully appreciated. By the way - Happy New Year!!

Nev375 · #2 12-29-2010, 09:02 AM

I prefer the older 410XL over the 4.5XL also.

krafty · #3 12-29-2010, 09:06 AM

Just FYI, my 210 Transporter developed an odd buzz a few months back. I pulled the grille and snugged down all of the screws (I got 1/8 to 1/4 turn out of every one) and it hasn't buzzed since.

neptoon · #4 12-29-2010, 09:11 AM

are they both 4 or 8 ohm cabs?

tonynoriega · #5 12-29-2010, 09:14 AM

The 4.5 is marked as 8 ohm and I I just checked the Hartke site -- the older cab is also 8 ohms and both are listed as being 400 watts. As for the screws, I did go through and checked them all, and checked the grill and all other potential sources of rattling, but everything is tight.

agreatheight · #6 12-29-2010, 09:20 AM

I have an older 410XL and it kinda crushed the 4.5 I tried.

JTE · #7 12-29-2010, 09:47 AM

I had both a 4.5XL and an original Guild/Hartke 410. The original didn't "crush" the 4.5, but they're very different cabinets with different design goals. The original one was much punchier, and a bit warmer. The 4.5 was much more balanced across the entire spectrum with a bit more bottom end, and smooth highs without having to use extensive EQ. They worked pretty well together in a stack too. I liked the 4.5 better if I didn't have PA support, and the original 4x10 for a good sound on stage with PA.

Just different cabinets, "better" entirely depends on what you want.

John

mantaraya · #8 12-30-2010, 08:51 AM

Hi. Ive head something about dust cover or something in this hartke aluminium speakers/cones that makes them rattles. check that out. i read it somewhere else... who know.. Hope it helps

eastcoasteddie · #9 12-30-2010, 09:27 AM

I never tried a 4.5, but the 410XL I had was awesome! extremely punchy.

tonynoriega · #10 12-31-2010, 07:47 AM

Thanks for your input - as for the rattle, it's more of a very small "buzz" than a rattle and I've checked absolutely everything that could possibly be loose, and nothing is. I'll continue to look for it though.

As for the 4.5 compared to the 4x10xl, I understand from JTE's writing "they're very different cabinets with different design goals," that I'm not comparing apples to apples, but now I'm interested in knowing why there are different design goals.....are they for use in different configurations of a bass system, or are they meant to be used in settings with different acoustics, etc??

I have been playing for many years but this end of it all is a weak point....

Thanks!

Tony

murphy · #11 01-01-2011, 08:13 AM

If it is not the screws....could be the dust cap buzzing. Had to epoxy them down before.
Hope it is not the speaker on its' way out

tonynoriega · #12 01-01-2011, 09:40 AM

Yeah, those dust covers have come loose in the distant past but I bought some black silicone from Home Depot and re-attached the edges. The repair has held up for years now and the cones were one of the first things I checked.

Last night I played through the 4x10xl and the buzz is so slight that it got lost in the overall band mix. Thanks to all for your input.

JTE · #13 01-01-2011, 03:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tonynoriega

As for the 4.5 compared to the 4x10xl, I understand from JTE's writing "they're very different cabinets with different design goals," that I'm not comparing apples to apples, but now I'm interested in knowing why there are different design goals.....are they for use in different configurations of a bass system, or are they meant to be used in settings with different acoustics, etc??

I have been playing for many years but this end of it all is a weak point....

Thanks!

Tony

Everyone has different tastes so Hartke, like most manufacturers, designs speaker cabinets to fill different needs. Eden has their XLT and XST cabinets for different tastes too.

John

brianrost · #14 01-02-2011, 08:13 AM

If the buzz is only on certain notes it could be one of the speakers has a damaged voice coil.

Why different design goals? Trends and different tastes...the original 410XL has the classic SVT sound with strong midrange and rolled off highs and lows, the 4.5XL has the scooped mids/hi-fi sound.

lazyone2 · #15 01-02-2011, 10:33 AM

The 4.5 being a larger cab is tuned to go lower then the 4x10. It also has more top end because of the 5" mid speaker. It seemed to take EQing very well. I"m suprised you can't get the tone you like out of it. I had mine for 4 years. I just didn't want to move a 100lb cab anymore and went for light weight 1x12 cabs.

tonynoriega · #16 01-03-2011, 02:57 PM

It would be valuable information to learn if anyone on TB is using the 4.5 powered by the 400RB Gallien Krueger (I have the older version made in '88)

If so, please tell me what your settings are, like volume and boost and EQ.

Thanks!

Tony

Kael · #17 01-03-2011, 03:33 PM

The 410XL is a MAJORLY mid oriented cab. If you leave the EQ the same when a/b'ing the two and you've already set your EQ to optimize the tone from your older 410XL, I would be surprised if the 4.5 didn't sound a little anemic.

Overall the 4.5 has more low end and is a more balanced cab than the 410. The better balance is neither a good nor bad thing. I gigged a 410XL for years specifically because I wanted that mid boost to cut through. Swapped it out when I started looking for more low end.

tonynoriega · #18 01-05-2011, 07:00 AM

When comparing the output volume of the two cabinets, the mystery for me is that the output of the 4.5 is only about 60% of the output of the 4x10xl given the same exact volume, master, boost and EQ settings on my amp. They are both listed on the Hartke site as being 400w at 8ohm and the 4x10xl shows a sensitivity of 98db while the newer 4.5 reads in at 99.

The port on the older 4x10 appears to be much smaller than that of the new one.....is that why it requires so much more input from the amp to achieve the same volume?

Flogger59 · #19 01-05-2011, 07:54 AM

No, it's likely the inefficiency of the crossover.

lazyone2 · #20 01-05-2011, 10:18 AM

The 4.5XL being tuned to go lower needs some knob turning to make it sound like the 410XL. Adjust your amp.