Which high-power micro can best replace a lead-sled?

[Pat C.]

Well, maybe the high-power, lightweight amps can't truly be called micros, but you know what I mean. My current rig is a Demeter/Crown MA2402...~1500watts into my full rig of four 1x12's. I don't want to have to drag my ~90lb rack (with the Crown's loud-ass fan) out to low-volume rehearsal situations, or even loud ones, so...

...I'm looking for head with at least 600 watts output at 4 ohms and 1,000 watts output at 2 ohms (or 2 x 500+ watts at 4 ohms). I'd like the option of running one cab, or two, or four...all with the same small amp. Under 20lbs is preferable, under 10lbs and fitting into the pocket of my bass gig bag is even better. I would settle for a 2u rackmount size.

Desired features - basic EQ would be fine, I'm not a knob fiddler. No compression needed. An integrated high pass filter would be a huge plus. If it's got a fan, it needs to be quiet. I would also like it to sound "good" and similar to my Demeter - clean, clear, fast response with an open top end.


Some possibilities:

Acoustic Image Clarus+
Genz Benz Shuttlemax 12.0
Carvin BX1500 and B2000
Tecamp Puma 1000

Oh yeah, I'd like to do this as cheaply as possible.

The AI and Genz are at or just above the $1K mark new. The Carvins are several hundred less. I've got no clue about the street price of the the Tecamp.

I know there are more options out there. But some (like Eden and SWR) are a little too big and/or not quite powerful enough, and/or too expensive. And others (like the EA Pro) only load down to 4 ohms. Walter Woods is an option, except for the price and the wait, and the high re-sale price of used Woods amps.

I'd definitely consider purchasing used. First I've got to narrow down which models will suit my needs.

I'm just getting back into playing again after a long hiatus so I'm not as familiar with the current amp market. What are my other options? And I'd love to get some feedback on how any of the above amps would compare to my lead-sled rack rig.

Another (less desirable) possibility is to get a lightweight power amp to use instead of my crown. I could also replace my 8 space ATA rack case with something a little smaller and lighter. How would a newer switching amp (like a QCS PLX or Crown XTi or XLS Drivecore) compare to my heavy Crown?

[JimmyM]

that's a topic of much debate, with some saying no micro amp will sound as robust as a lead sled, and some saying the difference is all in our heads. personally, i tend to side with the latter, although i have no evidence to present you with why i feel that way. i just know that with the good micro amps i've played, they sounded and felt as robust as any other solid state amps i've played, and some have actually sounded better to me than the bigger amps. maybe if you push them to their limits you might expose some weaknesses, but i never even get close to doing that.

one thing has not changed over the years, though...99% of sounding good through any gear is in your playing.

[johnk_10]

you could either get a micro amp or you could get a preamp (i.e SVP-CL, RPM, BBE, PB1 etc) and a Stewart World 1.2 poweramp. its not a micro, but would only be a 2U rack amp and weigh about 20lbs. no fans and plenty of power on hand for almost any gig.
................just another option.

[Pete]

500w x2 @ 4ohms? How about the new Peavey IPR1600? 7 lbs, 2u. I'm not one for that much power, I use a GK backline 350 (175 @ 4 mono) into an Eden 210XLT and gig about 100 shows a year. Basically it is for stage volume and might need to carry the room from time to time.

When I ran a Yamaha BP-1 I used a QSC RMX 1450 (1 ch) into either the 410XLT or 210XLT. Frankly the Eden XLT line is sooo much more effecient than most boxes out there. I used an EV 2.0kW (900 @ 4), ART SLA2 (1u 280 @ 4) and found it really doesn't take that much with the right cab. Right now the newer generation of lightwieght amps are really great and easy on AC too. Also check out the QSC PLX1804 (600 @ 8, 900 @ 4 not rated for 2 ohm). Yamaha P3500 (350w @ 8, 500w @ 4) or P5000 (500w @ 8, 750 @ 4) or even P7000 (700 @ 8, 1100 @ 4) and all will do 2ohm p/c.

hope that helps

[KJung]

Given your budget, and the fact that you are running four 8ohm cabs, the Genz Shuttle Max 12 would probably be your best bet. Lot's of knobs, but you can ignore most of them, and as long as you get that head running 4ohms per side, it slams pretty hard.

The Puma1000 would get you closer to the pure, big tone of the Demeter and your crown, but it will cost you literally twice as much as the Shuttle Max 12.

You might want to also check out the Epifani PS1000... smoother, fatter, creamier than the Shuttle Max 12... same design in that it puts out its full power at 4ohms per side. It's a touch less expensive than the Shuttle Max... more simple EQ, single channel... fatter and creamy versus the Shuttle Max's more 'bright and a touch grindy'.


Of course, the Carvin B2000 running at 2ohms should be killer also, and cost less than either of the above, but I have not heard that head yet.

IMO!

[Pat C.]

Thanks for the replies. I'll do some research on some of those other suggestions (Peavey IPR, Epifani, etc.)

Originally Posted by johnk_10

you could either get a micro amp or you could get a preamp (i.e SVP-CL, RPM, BBE, PB1 etc) and a Stewart World 1.2 poweramp. its not a micro, but would only be a 2U rack amp and weigh about 20lbs. no fans and plenty of power on hand for almost any gig...just another option.

You don't happen to know where I could pick up a nice, used World 1.2...do you?

This is definitely an option. I've actually got an old BBE 383 bass preamp sitting in my rack next to the Demeter as a "backup". I used it as a rehearsal amp (along with a different power amp) for a while, but I never actually had to call it into action. The BBE's sound is a HUGE step down from the Demeter, comparatively it sounds like someone placed a wet blanket over the rig. Glassy, open high end - gone. Of course, if I pop on the sonic maximizer the high end comes back, but it's a processed, unnatural presence that I do not really care for.

I could get a light power amp on the cheap and make this a separate little rig, but I feel like I'd be settling for a sound I do not like.

Originally Posted by KJung

The Puma1000 would get you closer to the pure, big tone of the Demeter and your crown, but it will cost you literally twice as much as the Shuttle Max 12.

My biggest issue may be that I've got champagne taste on a beer budget.

Originally Posted by JimmyM

...the difference is all in our heads. personally, i tend to side with the latter, although i have no evidence to present you with why i feel that way.

I want to believe that, but maybe I'm just a little old school (or just stubborn) and just can't yet buy the fact that the newer tech can keep up with the old. That's, of course, without having done any actual comparisons.

Originally Posted by JimmyM

one thing has not changed over the years, though...99% of sounding good through any gear is in your playing.

Absolutely, and it's possible that I could play through five different amps of equal volume and an audience (even one full of bass players) would not be able to tell the difference. Based on my past experiences, I think I could, though.

---------------------------

I might have to resign myself to getting a big smaller amp that will only run half my rig (figure at least 600 watts into 4 ohms) - that would open up a whole world of options in terms of amp selection. And I'd just have to commit to hauling out the Crown (which I do not plan to sell) when needed. But damn is that thing heavy...I must be getting old.