I know I want a tube amp. Now what?

Eskimo Spy · #1 12-13-2010, 09:02 PM

I am currently playing an Ashdown ABM EVO II 500 C410T combo. It's a great amp, but after playing an Ampeg, I really want an all-tube amp. I've searched this site, found good information, and read a lot of reviews here as well, but I wanted to try and get some direct information as it relates to my specific wants and needs.

I really like the sound of the Ampeg SVT-CL, but after hearing horror stories about the changes since Loud bought Ampeg, and the cost of a new CL, I'm a little concerned about dropping $1,700 for a new head (plus the cost of a cab. I've played an Ampeg 410HLF, which I thought sounded good, but I'm open to suggestions on a 4x10 as well. No 8x10, I would look ridiculous hauling that into the places I play).

To give you something to work with, what I really like about the Ampeg is the simplicity of the controls and the warmth. My current amp is a hybrid, solid state with a tube for drive, subharmonics and a more involved EQ setup. I play a US Lakland Glaub, and I want my amp to mirror my bass; simple. Tone and volume. I mainly play music that doesn't need to vary drastically, mostly indie stuff with some old school R&B thrown in to keep 'em guessing.

So, is the current version of the CL worth it? I know, this can be subjective, but let's talk in terms of value for the money, reliability, and the "Ampeg" tone. Does it deliver? Or would I have to step up to the Heritage series? (Which seems ridiculously overpriced to me).

If not, what other all-tube amps are out there that have that Ampeg sound, are not ridiculously complicated in terms of controls, and is reliable?

Tim1 · #2 12-13-2010, 09:05 PM

I can only tell you that I have had no issues with my SVT-VR and am very happy with it, having gigged it every week for the past 18 months.

Eskimo Spy · #3 12-13-2010, 09:10 PM

Whoops, nevermind, I just noticed you wrote VR.

theory028 · #4 12-13-2010, 09:18 PM

If you're concerned about the overseas Ampegs, you should definitely just scope out the classifieds and your local Craigs List. Finding an American one may take some patience but if it gives you peace of mind, it'll be worth it. Buying used will also make the price much more reasonable.

For what it's worth, I bought an SVT-VR off of eBay (overseas and B-stock, even) and I've had no trouble at all. I paid just over $1200 shipped, which, in my opinion, is a killer deal. My first year anniversary with the head is coming up in a couple of months. It's an awesome head, no doubt about that.

I don't have any recommendations for 410s but I do really like the SVT410HLF. You've tried that and enjoyed it, it sounds. I played an SVT-CL through an SVT410HLF at a Guitar Center and it sounded incredible. I wasn't sure what to expect from a ported cab (it sounds like a lot of people recommend sealed cabs) but it was thunderous! I plan on adding one to my arsenal when I have the money and find a used one at a good price.

Good luck with your search. I hope that you can find a good deal, and fast!

Eskimo Spy · #5 12-13-2010, 09:22 PM

Theory, can you comment on the 1.2.3 and the bass-cutoff-ultra lo controls on the VR? The ultra hi and lo I'm familiar with from the CL, but what do the aforementioned controls do?

Did you play a CL? Is the tone of the VR that much better?

GLEN18INCHSPICA · #6 12-13-2010, 09:27 PM

I just bought a used but new condition Bugera 1960 (150 watt?) tube guitar amp for $356 to my door. I like it alot, plenty of bass for me. Paired with a diy sealed ampeg 610hlf cabinet it sounds great. Both items together cost me $706. I had an SVTCL in the early 90's it sounded nice, weighed a ton, was unreliable & I couldn't touch one today with a family to support. If you want an all tube head & aren't afraid of the Behringer Bugera bashing this head is a steal & a bass friendly sleeper.

TheDialog · #7 12-13-2010, 09:28 PM

Hey Eskimo...I just sent you a PM.

I've owned an American CL, AV and I currently use a '78 SVT right now. In the studio I often use an American VR and my '78.

I would stay away from the newer stuff, save yourself some money and just buy a minty gently used piece.

ninerfan · #8 12-13-2010, 09:31 PM

SVT-II non-pro. Best bang for the buck Ampeg head IMO. I sold my CL to get it and never looked back. They can be found for under $1000 in great condition, especially in this economy.
As far as cabs go, I would say go sealed. I was looking at the Sadowsky SA410 for a bit, because it was made to pair with a tube head, but couldn't find one in my price range. I had the exact opposite reaction to the HLF. I thought it was all boom and mud when I used my CL through it. I now have a Bergantino NV610 and couldn't be happier. I was really suprised at how small the NV610 was when I first saw it. It is not much taller than the HLF and much shallower.
SVT-II ----->NV610

msquared · #9 12-13-2010, 09:36 PM

It seems like simplicity of controls is sort of a hallmark of tube amps. I can't think of any offhand other than the Trace Elliot Quadra/Hexavalve and maybe the Mesa 400+ that even have EQs that are close to the Ashdown stuff.

I have owned two tube heads and liked them both a lot, but for different reasons. The Aguilar DB359 was like the best of both the SS and tube worlds - plenty of fatness and dynamic control without straying into the breakup territory. The Traynor YBA200 was the opposite, a total rock machine that broke up a lot earlier in the game. I wish I could have kept both, they were fantastic.

I know very little about Ampegs other than that they sound fantastic. There's a reason that they're used so widely for recording, after all. But the good ones are damned expensive and there are other fish in the sea. IMO it's worth your time to buy used and try it out and sell it if you're not absolutely thrilled. Even if you're afraid of CL, you shouldn't fear the TB classifieds.

Eskimo Spy · #10 12-13-2010, 09:36 PM

Since it's been brought up, what about the reliability? I haven't heard bad things about the US made stuff, but tell me about any problems that are considered common.

GLEN18INCHSPICA · #11 12-13-2010, 09:37 PM

The SVT2 non pro is the one I would second. I had an SVT2p preamp and an SVT3 non pro same preamp as the svt2, & it's the best bass preamp tone I've had. Paired with 300 tube watts it should slay. There not as sought after as old SVT's and have a similiar sound according to many.

Eskimo Spy · #12 12-13-2010, 09:38 PM

I've found a couple of SVT2's in my area, but they're beat to hell.

Regarding the CL's, I'm not overly concerned about them, but I do want to avoid any heads that are always in the shop or aren't worth the money. I play a pretty bassy sound anyway, not a lot of highs or mids, just enough for clarity of sound.

theory028 · #13 12-13-2010, 09:47 PM

The rocker above the mid control is to select the frequency zone for the knob, as far as I know. I like the way it sounds with it in the center position. The bass cut/off/ultra lo is probably similar to what is on the CL but with the added option of having a bass cut. I just leave it off because I don't really need any more boost or cut.

I could see how some people would use them but I don't really have a need. I'd happily use an SVT-CL. In fact, having a gain/master control would be quite handy.

I apologize for not being more informed on the subject. I love the head but I don't have the greatest understanding of all of its features.

Eskimo Spy · #14 12-13-2010, 09:49 PM

lol, that's cool. That's exactly why I want to get a CL or its equivalent, the less knobs the better. I just want to plug in and get a warm, fat tone without playing my amp more than my bass.

Buster Brown · #15 12-13-2010, 10:12 PM

Well, FWIW, I grabbed a HSVT-CL several months ago when they first came out....I can NOT recommend them enough!!

Now, I understand that there is a price difference. However, if you enjoy the "regular" CL....prepare for pure unadulterated joy!!

Of course, as in everything, YMMV, IMO, et al......

Eskimo Spy · #16 12-13-2010, 10:16 PM

Man, that $2300 price tag is pretty butt-puckering though, and I'm not hurting for money. I guess I'm having trouble justifying that cost for playing 2-3 cover gigs a month. Damn it, why does this have to be so hard!

okcrum · #17 12-13-2010, 11:53 PM

Save up. Buy used. Stay away from the units made in China and Vietnam; they seem to have had most of the problems from what I've been able to determine - I've gotten a crash course in the Ampeg timeline the last few days. US or Korean units seem to be the ones to go for, save for some bad runs for the US units. The new ones built since mid-2008 (non-Heritage) are made in Korea. If you have deep pockets, go vintage.

I have one of the early Korean made SVT-CLs, and the build quality is as good as anything I've seen. I say this having examined every solder joint in mine with a magnifier (story posted elsewhere here). It's in essentially new condition so I can't yet comment on long term reliability. The amp is, as you probably know, built like a tank.

Even MF used SVT-CLs are like $1300, and you can find them on the classifieds here as low as $925 shipped.

CostaBass · #18 12-14-2010, 12:27 AM

Old Ampegs are great. The tone you get from the 4841454398 tubes that are inside those things cannot be compared. They are a bit on the heavy side but it's worth it.

Just be sure to take care of it. I have heard horror stories where people turn there amp on and they burst into flames. I guess it just adds to the tone.
:]

JimmyM · #19 12-14-2010, 12:52 AM

listen, i play all over the world and have to rent svt's, and i get all kinds from old ones to new ones. the foreign heads are every bit as good as any of them. the foreign cabs are as good or better than any that were made by slm. the early slm cabs were great. the ones made from around 2000-2005 were not as bright and weren't made with real wood.

there were problems with qc on the earlier heads that loud produced, but that was under the former head dolt who ran loud into bankruptcy, and the folks who took it over are doing a much better job. but even with the qc problems, the heads that worked back when the former head dolt ran it were excellent. i don't see nearly as many complaints about qc on here now as i did a couple years ago, either. nobody has 100% perfection, especially with a complicated tube amp like the svt. but imho ampeg quality is a lot better than it was a couple years ago and i wouldn't have a problem buying a new one.

JimmyM · #20 12-14-2010, 12:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by CostaBass

Old Ampegs are great. The tone you get from the 4841454398 tubes that are inside those things cannot be compared. They are a bit on the heavy side but it's worth it.

Just be sure to take care of it. I have heard horror stories where people turn there amp on and they burst into flames. I guess it just adds to the tone.
:]

seriously now...burst into flames? i suppose anything's possible but i think your odds of getting eaten by a shark at the beach are much greater.