Impact on the success of the Fearful?

[Calaverasgrande]

AKA DEATH OF THE FEARFUL.

So I guess by now most of us know that the ship has kind of sailed on the neodymium driver thing. This is due to trade decisions in China which restrict the sale of, and increase the price of the rare earths used for neo magnets. The neo drivers used in the Fearful boxes have pretty much doubled in price and for no good reason.
I was seriously considering building (or having someone build for me) a fearful cabinet. I have been reading about them for a while on TB and have been very skeptical. I figured I should put my mone¥ where my mouth is and try it out.
Of course as soon as I start looking up parts kits, that very same week the price shoots up!
The price of all the parts and materials for a fearful is no longer a cheap weekend project. It is now firmly in, "well I could just buy an Aggie or a Mesa" land.
So here is my question;
Does anyone have any plans to come up with a similar design based on a different driver?
For what they are asking for Eminence neo drivers now ($300), well thats JBL prices son! I just can't stomach spending that much on what I consider to be a 2nd tier driver manufacturer. Neo or not.
it seems to me that the design hinges more on the crossover and the mid driver. Surely there is another, possibly heavier woofer that can be substituted with some minor changes to the box and/or crossover?

Greenboy? Bill?

[bongomania]

The design is a complete interactive system, not just about the xover or mid driver. There are lots of DIY cab designs out there that were meant for older-style speakers.

[joelb79]

There is a driver set for a fearful listed in the accessories for sale forum on here for $225.

fEARful 12/6 Hardware and Driver Kit - $225 Sold yesterday 8am..

[kesslari]

I don't recall the fEarful being designed abound cost, but around capability.
If you want to buy a different cab, or a different design that uses non-neo speakers, go for it!
If you are hoping someone will design a new cab for you because you don't want to spend the money on a 3015L -

[::::BASSIST::::]

Originally Posted by Calaverasgrande

So I guess by now most of us know that the ship has kind of sailed on the neodymium driver thing. This is due to trade decisions in China which restrict the sale of, and increase the price of the rare earths used for neo magnets. The neo drivers used in the Fearful boxes have pretty much doubled in price and for no good reason.
I was seriously considering building (or having someone build for me) a fearful cabinet. I have been reading about them for a while on TB and have been very skeptical. I figured I should put my mone¥ where my mouth is and try it out.
Of course as soon as I start looking up parts kits, that very same week the price shoots up!
The price of all the parts and materials for a fearful is no longer a cheap weekend project. It is now firmly in, "well I could just buy an Aggie or a Mesa" land.
So here is my question;
Does anyone have any plans to come up with a similar design based on a different driver?
For what they are asking for Eminence neo drivers now ($300), well thats JBL prices son! I just can't stomach spending that much on what I consider to be a 2nd tier driver manufacturer. Neo or not.
it seems to me that the design hinges more on the crossover and the mid driver. Surely there is another, possibly heavier woofer that can be substituted with some minor changes to the box and/or crossover?

Greenboy? Bill?

Seems to me there is no substitute for the 3015LF... neo or not.

I am no expert but my understanding is that if you are going to use a different driver, you need a different cab design.

I think its unlikely you will find someone spending countless hours designing yet another 115 + mid style cab. I say just suck it up and pay the extra $100 + for the 3015LF and do it right.

So the fEarful is not dead. The driver price increase just will mean you have to pay a bit more for the cab. Some will do that, some will not. The sky is not falling. The world is not ending. Move along.

[lomo]

I'd rather have a fEarful or nEarful than an Aggie, Mesa or any standard design cab, even at twice the price. YMMV.

[burk48237]

I suspect the Fearful designs will probably be the least effected by the Neodym issue. Paying extra for one driver is a lot different than paying a premium for four drivers. Like a few posters have already said, sucking it up and paying $100=150 more is really not a huge deal breaker.

BUT, a better question might be, Death of the 4 X 10 ultralight? The good UL four by tens are facing 50-75% increases in finished cost. Sucking it up for a 100-$150 is nothing like sucking up for $600-1000. We've already seen what is perhaps the best 4 X 10 (the AE410) pulled from the market.

[Nightlyraider]

My cab's aren't planning on calling it quits any time soon.

Unless Emminence completely kills the line or prices get truly outrageous, the cab you are getting out of the deal is leaps and bounds ahead of those publicly available on the market.

We will probably see things like budget neo cabs go away, but I would think professional demand for the latest generation of speakers will keep them around.

[rpsands]

The 3015LF would be not extremely unreasonable at twice its current price as long as recone kits were reasonably available.

[4Mal]

Originally Posted by Calaverasgrande

. It is now firmly in, "well I could just buy an Aggie or a Mesa" land.

With those cab's you can pay just as much for inferior designs ... If you want a more valid comparison, the AccuGroove Tri115L would be closer and that is awhole lot more dinero...

For what they are asking for Eminence neo drivers now ($300), well thats JBL prices son! I just can't stomach spending that much on what I consider to be a 2nd tier driver manufacturer. Neo or not.


Where did you get that idea ? JBL wishes they had drivers that would do what the LF series do... Yes Eminence makes low end stuff, they also make hi-end stuff. Just like JBL.

it seems to me that the design hinges more on the crossover and the mid driver. Surely there is another, possibly heavier woofer that can be substituted with some minor changes to the box and/or crossover?

Greenboy? Bill?

apparently not at the moment. In spite of all the angst, the prices have gone up about $100 to $125 a box. So what was $500 is now more like $650. Suck it up and get to building.Thre isn't anything near that price point that can do what a fEarful can.

[Downunderwonder]

As far as I can gather, sifting factiods and innuendo, the price rise of Eminence is but a temporary market distortion. The actual cost to Eminence for the imported neo magnet is a few dollars but the availability is unreliable, so they jack the price skyhigh in the meantime.

[Passinwind]

Originally Posted by Calaverasgrande

Does anyone have any plans to come up with a similar design based on a different driver?

Been there, done that. It cost more than the 3015LF back then, and likely will be upward of 400 bucks now. Worth it too, to me. You buy expensive amps, suck it up.

[kesslari]

Originally Posted by Passinwind

Been there, done that. It cost more than the 3015LF back then, and likely will be upward of 400 bucks now. Worth it too, to me. You buy expensive amps, suck it up.

I believe the proper phrase is
"Suck it up, buttercup!"

[rpsands]

Originally Posted by Passinwind

Been there, done that. It cost more than the 3015LF back then, and likely will be upward of 400 bucks now. Worth it too, to me. You buy expensive amps, suck it up.

The BMS 15 630N looks like it will cost <600 bucks to get here in the states from what I can tell (if that's the one, I can only find it one place).

[Calaverasgrande]

Originally Posted by burk48237

I suspect the Fearful designs will probably be the least effected by the Neodym issue. Paying extra for one driver is a lot different than paying a premium for four drivers. Like a few posters have already said, sucking it up and paying $100=150 more is really not a huge deal breaker.

BUT, a better question might be, Death of the 4 X 10 ultralight? The good UL four by tens are facing 50-75% increases in finished cost. Sucking it up for a 100-$150 is nothing like sucking up for $600-1000. We've already seen what is perhaps the best 4 X 10 (the AE410) pulled from the market.

Truth there. I suppose though, that if neo prices are gonna stay up maybe I should be buying a neo 6x10 right now?

Like I said, I have a hard time thinking of Eminence drivers as anything better than really good 2nd tier.
JBL and EV are my preferred brands. I am having a hard time stomaching paying as much for a 3015 as I would for a similar EV driver.

[Passinwind]

Originally Posted by Calaverasgrande

Like I said, I have a hard time thinking of Eminence drivers as anything better than really good 2nd tier.
JBL and EV are my preferred brands. I am having a hard time stomaching paying as much for a 3015 as I would for a similar EV driver.

What similar driver (to 3015LF, not 3015 BTW) is E-V currently producing? How much does it cost?

Anyhow, don't like it, don't do it. There's no free lunch, same as it ever was.

[Queg]

First of all. you're exaggerating.
I bought a 3015LF a year ago for $179 + shipping.
Check speakerhardware.com for their current price.. (add to cart).

Given its specs and weight, the 3015LF was simply an incredible deal at its previous prices. And even if there were an exact non-neo replacement for say, $100 less (there isn't); I might still choose the 3015LF for the weight savings alone.

[JTE]

Originally Posted by Calaverasgrande

Like I said, I have a hard time thinking of Eminence drivers as anything better than really good 2nd tier. JBL and EV are my preferred brands. I am having a hard time stomaching paying as much for a 3015 as I would for a similar EV driver.

That's sort of like saying "I have a hard time thinking of Toyota as anything better than a really good 2nd tier. Cadillac and Lincoln are my preferred brands." Because Caddy and Lincoln aren't (at least in critical things like trannies and engines) any different than a Chevy and a Ford now.

At one time the names "Electro-Voice" and "JBL" did mean something like that. But i's been a long time since that really meant anything in particular. Now you've got to look at specific drivers. EV and JBL have cheap stuff now that they didn't have when the names were indicative of premium stuff. And Emminence has higher-end stuff than what most companies used from them in the old days. The lower end Emminence (CTS, etc.) were used because they were inexpensive. They were inexpensive because that's what Fender, Ampeg, Gibson, etc. wanted. Not because those companies couldn't make a better speaker, but because they were fitting into a different market.

I'd suggest getting over the name aversion and look at the drivers individually.

John

[billfitzmaurice]

Originally Posted by Passinwind

What similar driver (to 3015LF, not 3015 BTW) is E-V currently producing?

None that you can buy. The EVX155 at $349 has half the displacement limited power handling at over twice the weight. The $450 JBL 2265 comes close.

[burk48237]

Originally Posted by billfitzmaurice

None that you can buy. The EVX155 at $349 has half the displacement limited power handling at over twice the weight. The $450 JBL 2265 comes close.

Yep, JBL and EV do not have the instrument speaker cache they had in the 70's by any means. And Eminence has certainly stepped it up in the last couple of years in the Bass driver category. Personally I still prefer B & C, and Beyma is doing some nice stuff too. In 10" Bass Drivers, I consider the B & C's the best I've heard.