Inside cab wire gauge?

bnotegoboom · #1 03-16-2011, 04:49 PM

Hey all, I'm going to be getting in and slapping a couple Eminence Legend CB158's into my 215 cab. What gauge wire would be best? 16? I'm replacing the speakers, the wire, and the 1/4" female socket.

mech · #2 03-16-2011, 06:10 PM

16 is fine. Most I've seen are wired with 18ga. Good connections are more critical than the difference between 16 and 18.

mech

darkstorm · #3 03-18-2011, 07:28 PM

16 would be good choice but Id go with 12 or 14 if I had it available. 18 is too thin imo. Doubling up 16 gauge would give you equivalent of 13 gauge btw. A lot of higher price speaker cable does that, combines wires of chosen size to create a higher gauge composite. The reason I suggest thicker is due to it being bass signals. Btw I use 12 gauge speaker cable for home stereo. Diff performs better then any 16 or thinner gauge Ive tried.

GrowlerBox · #4 03-18-2011, 07:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by darkstorm

The reason I suggest thicker is due to it being bass signals.

Yeah, man. Bass electrons are waaay bigger than gat 'trons.

darkstorm · #5 03-18-2011, 07:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GrowlerBox

Yeah, man. Bass electrons are waaay bigger than gat 'trons.

I geauss you never learned the truth about bass signals taking more watts and current. All treble based music uses very few watts compared to bass music. And its the easiest to hear and least expensive way to improve a systems sound bass wise, useing heavy gauge cable.

billfitzmaurice · #6 03-18-2011, 08:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by darkstorm

16 would be good choice but Id go with 12 or 14 if I had it available. 18 is too thin imo. Doubling up 16 gauge would give you equivalent of 13 gauge btw. A lot of higher price speaker cable does that, combines wires of chosen size to create a higher gauge composite. The reason I suggest thicker is due to it being bass signals. Btw I use 12 gauge speaker cable for home stereo. Diff performs better then any 16 or thinner gauge Ive tried.

Use this to determine the gauge necessary:
http://www.bcae1.com/images/swfs/spe...rassistant.swf
Even with 50 feet of cable you cannot hear the difference between 12 and 16 gauge. That difference would be no more than 0.5dB, which is not audible. With shorter lengths there would be even less differential.

Quote:

And its the easiest to hear and least expensive way to improve a systems sound bass wise, useing heavy gauge cable.

Sorry, but that's simply not true.

GrowlerBox · #7 03-18-2011, 09:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by darkstorm

I geauss you never learned the truth about bass signals taking more watts and current. All treble based music uses very few watts compared to bass music. And its the easiest to hear and least expensive way to improve a systems sound bass wise, useing heavy gauge cable.

The first truth you cite is certainly true most of the time. It's undoubtedly true that a low frequency tone requires a greater amplitude to be perceived at the same volume as a higher frequency tone. Once you start applying this to the realm of "music" as some kind of abstract generalisation, however, there are far too many caveats that need to be applied to make it a useful statement. And the the last "truth" is just false.

BassmanPaul · #8 03-19-2011, 11:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bnotegoboom

Hey all, I'm going to be getting in and slapping a couple Eminence Legend CB158's into my 215 cab. What gauge wire would be best? 16? I'm replacing the speakers, the wire, and the 1/4" female socket.

And have you done the science to ensure that the CB158s will actually work well in your cabinet???? Read the FAQs atop page one for more information. Not doing so will just end in a crapshoot.

gnjpowell · #9 03-19-2011, 11:40 AM

Use the largest and best cable that is practical and affordable for you and with high-quality connections. It really does matter because large current and voltage swings are required for bass speaker damping. Damping is how the amp controls any potential over-travel of the driver. Pro and higher-quality amps will often list an additional parameter: damping factor, this is a measure of the amp's ability to control the driver, higher is better. If you use small and/or low-quality cable you reduce the damping factor of the amp-speaker system, and they are a system and must work well together. This is one of the advantages of powered-speakers, they can be designed and implemented as a system when done well.

billfitzmaurice · #10 03-19-2011, 12:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gnjpowell

Use the largest and best cable that is practical and affordable for you and with high-quality connections. It really does matter because large current and voltage swings are required for bass speaker damping. .

Myth, explained here:
http://www.diyspeakers.net/Articles/...G%20FACTOR.pdf

Worst case, using 100 foot cables and tube power amps, the effects of damping might be barely audible. With the cables used with electric bass cabs it's a total non-issue.

ddhm · #11 03-19-2011, 12:13 PM

I suggest 12 or 14 gauge... especially if you are getting full range or low (sub) frequencies to the drivers. In the live audio world, we run 12g to subs.

Bob Lee (QSC) · #12 03-19-2011, 07:03 PM

The wires are short and need to be flexible for assembly and disassembly. Therefore, 16 or 18 AWG is fine. They certainly don't have to be the "largest and best cable," or 12 or 14 gauge. Larger wire could actually be detrimental in this application if its stiffness puts too much stress on the connections.

SurferJoe46 · #13 03-19-2011, 07:34 PM

...and then you get to the flex-wires at the speaker motors and they are - what? 28AWG?

BurningSkies · #14 03-19-2011, 07:39 PM

There you go. Bob wants you to have short flaccid wires.

ulrich · #15 03-19-2011, 08:47 PM

Length of wire affects impedance more than gauge. If 12 AWG is needed for the two feet of wire inside a cab, then 0 AWG is required for a 50 foot PA run. OMG what if that's not enough? I'd better jack some four aught off a poorly guarded movie set.

If you wanna obsess about best practices, loose that 1/4" jack, and install Nuetrik Speakon.

KramerBassFan · #16 03-19-2011, 10:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SurferJoe46

...and then you get to the flex-wires at the speaker motors and they are - what? 28AWG?

Sounds like people putting gold plated wall sockets in houses with super crappy wiring

Or gold plated wall sockets in houses with super nice wiring.....

Electricblue · #17 03-29-2011, 07:02 AM

IMO, you should use the thickest mains cable you could get your hands on. I dont think interference gets into cabs, and at large wattages, it probably wouldnt make a difference when it did get in there.

That may not be fact, but it seems correct to my knowledge

mmbongo · #18 03-29-2011, 07:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SurferJoe46

...and then you get to the flex-wires at the speaker motors and they are - what? 28AWG?

Yes but they are maybe 3" long at best. Credence used to double up on the tensile wire, not sure if they still do.

billfitzmaurice · #19 03-29-2011, 07:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Electricblue

IMO, you should use the thickest mains cable you could get your hands on. I dont think interference gets into cabs, and at large wattages, it probably wouldnt make a difference when it did get in there.

That may not be fact, but it seems correct to my knowledge

Using anything of a heavier gauge than that required for the current load over the distance involved is wasted copper and cash.

Electricblue · #20 03-29-2011, 08:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by billfitzmaurice

Using anything of a heavier gauge than that required for the current load over the distance involved is wasted copper and cash.

A meter of cable can probably sort 3 cabs. Its only pennies difference

I got 2 meters of massive gauge cable for £1.50 at my local DIY shop.

Im sure ~20p difference per meter shouldnt matter too much.

I suppose it depends how many cabs you are making.