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  #441  
Old 11-30-2012, 06:42 PM
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No, I have not tried that one.
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  #442  
Old 11-30-2012, 07:14 PM
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I find that it helps to go through the basics with a new amp, checking all the little things to ensure that everything is in order. Make sure that you have a good set of matched power tubes. It helps to break down big sections into subsections that can be examined one by one. Don't take shortcuts. Sweat the small things first.

Make sure that the amp is unplugged and the caps are discharged and the amp is safe to work on. Search for "discharge sticks" or "discharging an amp". When the voltage of each power supply electrolytic cap reads zero volts to the chassis, the amp is safe to work on.

Clean the amp, apply deoxit to the tube sockets, tube pins, jacks, and pots. Make sure that the tube sockets are clean, sometimes it takes more than one application and some scrubbing. I use interdental brushes that you can get at a drug store. Pipe cleaners also do a good job but the brushes are best.

Remove all the tubes. Check out the hum pot with an ohm meter. Read between the center terminal and each side terminal. Move the pot and see if the resistance changes. The resistance across the outer two terminals should be around 100 ohms. Set it in the center with center to each outer balanced, around 50 ohms. A bad hum pot can cause all sorts of problems.

Power up the amp, turn off the standby (playing mode). Using a voltmeter, measure and record the AC wall voltage. Then read the 6.3VAC heater circuit, the 5VAC tube rectifier voltage, then each leg of the high voltage secondary to the center tap. The heater circuits should read 6.3VAC and 5VAC, the high voltage will vary. Some schematic have what the voltages should be. The earlier models were 375-0-375. These voltages will be higher if your wall voltage is above 117VAC. Taking these reading will tell you if your transformer is blown.

You can take resistance readings on the power transformer. The AC primary side should read about 2.5 ohms. The HV secondary should read around 55 ohms from the center tap to each of the two legs.

Let's assume that your transformers are working properly and your power supply caps are good.

When the amp is first turned on and the capacitors are not charged, there is big surge of current until the caps are charged. If the surge is too high, it is going to blow the fuse. Resistors can be used to limit the inrush. There are also devices called inrush current limiters that can be installed. This would help with the diode rectifier blowing the fuse. Some rectifier tubes, like the 5AR4, also limit the current inrush. I suspect that if you installed a 5AR4, the fuse will not blow.

The first 30uF cap that you mentioned might be bad (shorted) or the value might be too high. 40uF shouldn't cause a problem. If it is much larger, your initial inrush current might be too high for the fuse. A large capacitor can also cause what is called flashover in the tube. If you turn on the amp and see a flash i the rectifier tube you have a problem. It can cause the tube to blow. It can be fixed by adding a couple of diodes. I add them on my amps and they do a good job

The charing on the solid state module might be a sign of a problem. You can find a schematic for one here on Weber's site. Diodes conduct in only one direction. Connect an ohm meter common (black wire) to pin-8. Connect the red wire on the meter to pin-6, and then pin-4. They should read almost zero. Reverse the leads and they should read infinity. Some diode rectifiers are more sophisticated. They have resistors and current limiter built into them. This type produces slightly different results when you test them. They can be found on the Weber site. They are called Copper Cap Rectifiers.

You can also plug the solid state rectifier in and read pin-8 to ground (the chassis). You should see something like 470VDC. Again this will vary depending on your wall voltage.
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  #443  
Old 11-30-2012, 07:16 PM
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I gotta learn to type faster. I missed all of Rich's posts while I was typing. Got to run for tonight.
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  #444  
Old 11-30-2012, 07:19 PM
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Rich, the module that you mentioned is the basic one with just the four diodes in it like the first one that I referenced. My 59 Bassman came with one. Fender cut costs by not providing the rectifier tube. Not sure if they still do that.
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  #445  
Old 11-30-2012, 08:24 PM
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Thanks guys. Good stuff, beans. I think we're on the right track, I appreciate the detailed help. I think I will try a Weber WZ34 or a new 5AR4. Leaning toward the Weber.
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  #446  
Old 11-30-2012, 09:15 PM
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I have a WZ34 and a WS1. The amps sound good but a reacts a little differently with them in place. A little tighter. They take some load off the power transformer allowing it to run a bit cooler. A tube requires the heater, a rectifier doesn't. Nice to have one on hand in case the rectifier tube develops a problem. I probably run the 5AR4 the most though.

Both options are nice to have. They don't cost that much. Given that the WZ34 has both the dropping resistor and the inrush limiter, it is close in what it does but not quite the same as a real tube.
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  #447  
Old 12-01-2012, 11:42 AM
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Thanks once again for all the great info David!
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  #448  
Old 12-02-2012, 01:50 PM
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I went looking for my chassis schematic to no avail...

Sloppy gut shot!
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  #449  
Old 12-05-2012, 03:17 PM
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B15n Before and After

I hope I'm posting correctly...it feels like I'm breaking in line but couldn't see another way to post this under Jess Oliver's Legacy.

The photos are before and after I took my '61/'62 B15n to the repair facility here in Tampa. The amp had blown 3 tubes in the same socket but otherwise sounded fine. They replaced the capacitors (I went for the upgrade to Sprague caps), resoldered any less than satisfactory joints, inspected and tested all components, and I took them two SED 6L6GC power tubes to install. The electronics shop is highly reputed here in the bay area so I expect the work to endure for many years to come.

When I got home with it I powered it up and it sounds great! Please chime in with comments.
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  #450  
Old 12-05-2012, 03:39 PM
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Good to hear that it sounds great. Hope that you enjoy it!

There are two cement resistors on the right hand side marked 250 ohm 10W and 1W ohm 10W. Both these resistors can get hot, especially the 250 ohm one. Try not to let the blue 20uF capacitor come in contact with the resistors. It might just be the camera angle, but I would raise the blue cap up a little if it is.

Those original red Astron capacitors are worth their weight in gold. People pay a lot of money for them if they test good. It is always a good idea to get back your old parts.
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  #451  
Old 12-05-2012, 03:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by christw View Post
I went looking for my chassis schematic to no avail...
Thanks for looking Chris.
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  #452  
Old 12-05-2012, 04:50 PM
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B12N?

I am looking at a 1964/65 B12N for sale and think its a good deal...interested in what eveyone thinks. It looks good, altough I haven't had the chance to play through it yet. The (inside) plywood on the left baffle was replaced. The handle and one latch has been replaced. It has had an extra canon jack installed in the cabinet side for the speaker hookup (I think that's pretty common as the original cables were always getting lost). No dolly. I'm looking at 750 for it...
  #453  
Old 12-05-2012, 05:11 PM
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I paid $700 (of $800 asking) for my all original '67 B-15 in good physical but non working condition. The guy was totally convinced I could fix it for under $100

If it hasn't been plugged in in years, power it up on a variac slowly. If it isn't functioning, I'd try to talk them down a little into the $600 ballpark but that's me.
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Last edited by christw : 12-05-2012 at 05:14 PM.
  #454  
Old 12-05-2012, 05:34 PM
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Originally Posted by somdbass View Post
I am looking at a 1964/65 B12N for sale and think its a good deal..
The B12N is the same amp as the B15N, just with a smaller cabinet. A lot of players love the B12 for recording.

Check out the condition of the chrome chassis. Often they clean up nicely. A lot of rust will affect the value. Everything else can be fixed or replaced on these amps. They might have had a rattle in the cab and wound up replacing some of the wood to fix it. Find out if the speaker is original or if it has been re-coned.


David
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  #455  
Old 12-05-2012, 10:42 PM
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Originally Posted by xoir View Post
Some pics Jimmy:







Looks great!!
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  #456  
Old 12-05-2012, 10:48 PM
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Hi guys - found a few bits on the subject in an old 2011 thread, but just to make sure I don't scew up: would it be safe to plug a '67 B-15NF head into any single 4 ohm cab? Or even a '71 Straightback 810...?
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  #457  
Old 12-05-2012, 11:06 PM
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According to Jess Oliver, yep.
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  #458  
Old 12-05-2012, 11:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JimmyM
According to Jess Oliver, yep.
Thanx Jimmy. Boy - am I going to have fun today ;- D ...!

(Oh and please relay to Birddog that he did an excellent job on that '71 Blueline SVT when you talk to him. First USA amp to arrive here in perfect working order!)

Good night!
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Last edited by JvN : 12-05-2012 at 11:37 PM.
  #459  
Old 12-05-2012, 11:26 PM
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Ya man, Birddog rocks. He doesn't look forward to lifting them but he sure does a great job with them.
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  #460  
Old 12-06-2012, 04:42 AM
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Hmmm... Not a single sound. Amp's External speaker out is 8 ohms, cab is 4. Should I use the fixed speaker out; is that 8 ohms as well? Mine doesn't have an XLR plug, so I'll have to find a adapter for the 1/4" jack first.
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