last night's gig preamp comparison

johnk_10 · #1 04-25-2010, 09:53 PM

played a gig last night at one of the clubs that we've been playing at twice a month for the last 8 months. last night, i took my Avalon VT737SP and my Demeter HBP1-J/EL-8 distressor (comp) racked preamps thru my crown xti2000 and Accugroove EW Jr. cab. for the first set, i used the HPB1-J/EL-8 with my jazz bass. it was really good, but it lacked a little mid thumb/punch that i was used to getting. it was very clean, clear and hi-fi sounding, but no matter what, i couldn't get it to pack a real lo-mid bass punch. on the second set, i switched over to the Avalon. it had a much fatter/thicker sound, and was super punchy. on the third set, i switched basses, and used a brand new Rick 4003 (that arrived yesterday morning) thru the Avalon/xti2000 setup.

it completely floored me. prior to this, i never dreamed that i could ever substitute using a rick for one of my fenders, for an entire gig, since my fender P's and J's are like using my favorite baseball mit, or wearing my favorite broken-in sneakers, but that rick really changed my mind about that. the 4003 thru the avalon just sounded amazing, having a much livelier, fuller mid-bass tone to it, yet still had the punch of the jazz bass that i almost always use. so it looks like i'll be using it as my main bass for the foreseeable future and using the j bass as the backup.

JimmyM · #2 04-25-2010, 11:43 PM

wish i could get into the 4001/4003, but that pointy upper horn always digs into my ribs and bothers me. not surprised you got the results you got with the pres, though. demeter's good stuff but it just ain't my thang.

johnk_10 · #3 04-26-2010, 12:14 AM

yeah, in this case, with the EW Jr., the demeter was just too clean. it sounds great with my 1212/6 cab though, which has a bit more mid bass growl and 'vintage' vibe to it.

as far as the ricky goes, i guess that i wear it pretty low so it doesn't dig into my ribs. but man, to me, they just have so much more depth, fullness and tone than most basses, i can see why John Lennon preffered that his bassists use them on his solo albums. and besides being really great bands with great songs, it's also one of the reasons why i loved the sound of the old Deep Purple and Steppenwolf records.

jokerjkny · #4 04-26-2010, 12:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by johnk_10

(...) i used the HPB1-J/EL-8 with my jazz bass. it was really good, but it lacked a little mid thumb/punch that i was used to getting. it was very clean, clear and hi-fi sounding, but no matter what, i couldn't get it to pack a real lo-mid bass punch. (...)

so even w/ the fully parametric EQ section of the hbp-1j, you couldnt get a solid lower mid punch? quite strange.

johnk_10 · #5 04-26-2010, 01:58 AM

you'd think that i could (and i certainly did), but i couldn't, no matter what eq i tried. as a matter of fact, it got punchier when i bypassed the parametric. and i was running it thru an empirical labs distressor (with the 2nd order harmonics button) and 1176LN settings, which fattened it up a bit, but not anywhere near as much as the Avalon. the demeter was really round, smooth & clear, but it was just too 'hifi' thru the EW Jr. but like i said, on one of my previous gigs at the same club, thru my 1212/6 cab, it was awesome and very punchy, so obviously, what cab you run it thru has ALOT to do with how the Demeter (or any amp for that matter) sounds/responds.

JimmyM · #6 04-26-2010, 04:41 AM

hey john, what do the guys in your band say when you show up to a gig with not only a different rig each gig but a couple different rigs each gig? the guys in my band would kill me. i did that once with the svt and lmii and the guitarist was not very happy.

johnk_10 · #7 04-26-2010, 10:32 AM

they really don't care what i bring since they know whatever i show up with will sound good. and i think that my bass/bass rig sounds pretty close to the same (especially to them) no matter what i'm using. our main keyboardist mentioned that he likes it when i use an SVT head, the GK 1001RBII with the super beatle cab (2x15 K140's) or the Avalon setup, with the EW Jr. the best.

our guitarist often brings different guitars and amps too, and i like it best when he uses a tele or a strat, but he pretty much dials in his tone to be pretty consistent no matter what he's using. (lately its been a strat thru a bogner head & 1x12 cab, or a Mesa 1x12 combo).

JimmyM · #8 04-26-2010, 11:45 AM

that's cool you guys are so open to experimentation. my guys have started to leave me alone since realizing the same thing, but they do give me stick sometimes. babies

SpamBot · #9 04-26-2010, 11:52 AM

Sounds like you're done with that 6176, I'll be glad to take it off your hands

johnk_10 · #10 04-26-2010, 01:16 PM

that's a good one.

its still my personal favorite preamp, but i did sell the LA610 Mark II since it was kinda like a duplicate of the 6176 and i bought the new ricky 4003 with the money that i got from it.

johnk_10 · #11 04-26-2010, 01:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JimmyM

that's cool you guys are so open to experimentation. my guys have started to leave me alone since realizing the same thing, but they do give me stick sometimes. babies

yeah, well i've found that most veteran players are pretty competent at getting their sound thru just about any rig, and as far as my situation is concerned, i do it just for my own tone/response, and i doubt that most people in the audience can really tell the difference all that much anyway.

Jeff Scott · #12 04-26-2010, 07:35 PM

Now that you have a Rick you should check out the RickResource Forum. Lots of great folks over there with tons of excellent info and knowledge.

johnk_10 · #13 04-26-2010, 08:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jeff Scott

Now that you have a Rick you should check out the RickResource Forum. Lots of great folks over there with tons of excellent info and knowledge.

Hi Jeff,

actually, i've never been without having a rick for the last 36 years. i bought my first mapleglo 4001 brand new from guitar center hollywood in 1974. and yeah, i've checked out their forum. there's some pretty cool stuff on it.

Jeff Scott · #14 04-26-2010, 10:45 PM

I got my first Rick bass, a '67 4005WB, in '73; currently I have four, the 4005WB, an early '73 4001, a '98 4001V63 and a '08 4003 (which has been vintagized with a scatterwound toaster in the 1/2" position, vintage style pickguard, early '60s horseshoe pickup, vintage style knobs, and RI plexi TRC) plus a '67 330 guitar. I have owned and sold a few others over the years: a mid '70s 4001, a '04 4003FL that got the vintage treatment but with two toasters, a mid '73 4001, a '03 4004Cii, and a '98 360V64 guitar.

Foz · #15 04-27-2010, 05:33 AM

Not surprised the Avalon won the beauty contest... that pre is the schizzle for bass IMO, and I am dying to try the UA 6176 since you like it even more. I have two of the 737's and no 6176 but would rather have one of each. That's a pretty thin market I reckon... need to find a guy with two 6176's and no 737.

Jim C · #16 04-27-2010, 05:49 AM

I hate it when a highly respected poster throws a giant curve ball
Was totaly with you rgarding pre amps but have never owned a Ric and always associate Yes or Highway Star (pick style growl) with them

Anybody else find the tone of a 4001 anywhere near a Jbass tone in that one could find former Fender happiness with one?

You're killing me JK

smcgov · #17 04-27-2010, 08:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by johnk_10

my favorite broken-in sneakers.

wth are sneakers? do you mean tennis shoes?

you're freaking me out because I have a demeter and have been thinking about changing but have been scared to

I've had a clean hifi tone for years now and am wanting something a little fatter as I get older..like me....

tombowlus · #18 04-27-2010, 08:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JimmyM

hey john, what do the guys in your band say when you show up to a gig with not only a different rig each gig but a couple different rigs each gig? the guys in my band would kill me. i did that once with the svt and lmii and the guitarist was not very happy.

Have the guys in your band call the guys in my band, sometime.

JimmyM · #19 04-27-2010, 08:51 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tombowlus

Have the guys in your band call the guys in my band, sometime.

lol! you don't want that, trust me

johnk_10 · #20 04-27-2010, 10:50 AM

the reason that i took the Avalon and the Demeter instead of the UA, was because it was the 4003's maiden gig, and i wanted to make sure that i had plenty of eq, should it be necessary to shape its sound, as a substitue for my usual Fenders. as it turned out, the UA would've done the job perfectly, since the 4003 didn't require very much tone shaping at all.

surprisingly, i actually used the 4003's bridge pickup only, and added some low end and it worked perfectly. using, the neck or both pickups was a little too boomy (neck only) and both pickups created a little phasing that made it lack punch as compared to just using the bridge pickup, which tracked every note with plenty of 'thump'. IMO, the new 4003 bridge pickups have some real output now, and don't have the nasal type sound, compared to using only the bridge pickup on a j bass.