LDS 15/6/tweet & 12/6/tweet vs.Acugroove Tri 112L & Tri 115 L

[foderaman]

Has anyone had the opportunity to compare these two lines of cabinets to each other and wondering what there opinions are.Im am looking for lightweight stand alone and use together as a larger rig also.To the best of my knowledge they both use Emminence drivers for the woofers but mids and tweets are different.

[Plstrns]

I can only tell you the 15/6/1 is light years over the 12/6/1 unless portability is your biggest concern.

I own handmade fEarful versions as 1515/66/0. They are awesome IMO.

[KJung]

Originally Posted by foderaman

Has anyone had the opportunity to compare these two lines of cabinets to each other and wondering what there opinions are.Im am looking for lightweight stand alone and use together as a larger rig also.To the best of my knowledge they both use Emminence drivers for the woofers but mids and tweets are different.

Played many of both, but not direct A/B. Since there is no specific spec for the LDS 12/6 and 15/6, it is hard to compare. The 'top spec'd' LDS 15/6 with 3015LF, the 18sound mid driver, a custom Patterson crossover and Eminence tweeter will pretty much smoke a Tri115 in low end, high end, mid clarity, and SPL, and be about 2/3's the cost.

The LDS 12/6, again with what Don feels are the top of the line components (3012LF, Faital mid driver and Patterson crossover with Eminence tweeter) will sound quite different from the Tri112, but wouldn't go so far as to say it is better or worse. The LDS would be brighter up top, deeper in the lows, but not as warm and mid punchy in the mid mids. So, that's kind of a 'different but not better or worse'.

Both of these Accugroove executions sound, to me, like they use the a non-LF type driver... more mid punchy than deep. I guess this allows the use of that smaller, lower SPL and less powerful mid driver and those very subtle soft dome tweeters. Much more 'mid warm' and 'organic', than 'wide and even and deep' to my ear.

For the 1212, I actually prefer the Whappo Jr. to the LDS 1212/6/1 (similar spec'd to the 15/6 above). The Whappo Jr. is not as low end extended and more punchy (I think one 12 is an LF type and one is a more standard mid driver), and quite a bit lighter (and a LOT more expensive).

So, IMO! and IME!....

- 15 loaded cab... LDS, forget about it!
- 12 loaded cab... both very nice... LDS...wide and smooth, Accugroove... mid warm and more punchy, more polite up top
- 1212..... Whappo Jr. for me... still plenty of low end, but more going on in the all important mid mids.

All these cabs sound pretty darn good to me.

Hope that helps.

K

[foderaman]

Hey KJung where do you think the new AE212 may fit in there?It may be worth waiting for it but i am sold on maybe a 15/6/tweet so far.

[KJung]

Originally Posted by foderaman

Hey KJung where do you think the new AE212 may fit in there?It may be worth waiting for it but i am sold on maybe a 15/6/tweet so far.

Totally different thing IMO (of course, I haven't heard it yet, but have played the AE112's and own the AE410). The AE's are classic Neo sounding cabs (as we use that term on TB)... tight down low, VERY present in the upper mids, and bright up top. Very classic 'two way cab' design.

I again prefer that tight low end and a bit of that upper mid coming from the top of the woofer tone versus the very wide, smooth sound of the LDS 'LF' three way type cabs, or the more polite, organic top end of the Accugrooves... just depends what you want. Pure IMO.

One thing for sure, the AE212 will have a very different vibe from the 15/6/1... not as deep, grindier in the upper mids, punchier. IMO!

Probably not many bassists have played the Accugroove stuff and the 15/6 type cabs, so you might not get many responses here.

[KJung]

Looking at your influences/favorites in your profile, my guess is the more aggressive AE cabs would fit you more than the Accugrooves or 15/6 cabs... just guessing there.

I think you have your IP112 rig for sale in the classifieds. Is that correct? If I have that right, I put that IP rig more in the 15/6/1 or 12/6/1 territory.... relatively deep, smooth and creamy in the mids through the upper mids, hi fi up top, if that helps at all. The Accugrooves are a bit like the Acme cabs without the deep bass extension. The AE cabs grind and grunt

IMO.. hard to put this stuff into words sometimes. I do have a bunch of clips of my AE410 and also some 12/6/1's on my Youtube channel... might give you some idea... not really apples to apples though.. different amps, different basses in some cases.

[Passinwind]

Originally Posted by KJung

Probably not many bassists have played the Accugroove stuff and the 15/6 type cabs, so you might not get many responses here.

I have, but only the Tri112L, not the Tri115L, which I've heard on shows I mixed a few times though. And not the LDS versions, just my fEarful 12/6 and nEarful 15/6/1 and 1515/6/1. Ken's descriptions are pretty much right on IMO, although to me the 3-way cabs are way more "natural" sounding than classic 2-ways. But bear in mind that I don't play rock much and I don't use fretted basses.

I like 'em all...

[foderaman]

Ken I have and use a Berg AE410 that i like very much and use it with a Mesa Fathom most of the time.Will I like the idea of the IP,s I seem to notice like a compression to the speakers which are berg HT 112 and sometimes use the IP 112 with a AG Tri 112L cab.I just sent off the power section to Jim to check it out.I think in my case Jim may have programmed a little more compression to the DSP than what I am used to.What I am looking for is basicly the same as you.A very tight articulate low end not boomy with good mids and top end but not overly bright top end.I guess you could say some what like I get from a WWU and Berg HT210s and 122s stack.Very articulate but with a little more lowend extention?

[KJung]

Originally Posted by foderaman

Ken I have and use a Berg AE410 that i like very much and use it with a Mesa Fathom most of the time.Will I like the idea of the IP,s I seem to notice like a compression to the speakers which are berg HT 112 and sometimes use the IP 112 with a AG Tri 112L cab.I just sent off the power section to Jim to check it out.I think in my case Jim may have programmed a little more compression to the DSP than what I am used to.What I am looking for is basicly the same as you.A very tight articulate low end not boomy with good mids and top end but not overly bright top end.I guess you could say some what like I get from a WWU and Berg HT210s and 122s stack.Very articulate but with a little more lowend extention?

Yeah, the compression in the IP's was one of a variety of reasons those never spoke to me (especially the 112 version). We hear things similarly.

I also gigged the Walter Woods Ultra and the 's' stack for about a year (HT122s on top, HT210s below). I actually ended up finding that a bit too wide, pure and airy. Deep, pure, full, airy, hi fi... no punch with the Walter (EDIT: I might have felt differently if I had still been playing my Fodera. However, with my J Basses, it just didn't work). I switched to the Markbass F1, and that was KILLER... more low mid punch than the Walter (which IMO that stack needed), and just more girth down low, and a bit more 'lower treble brightness and character' than the very airy upper treble pureness of the Walter. It didn't get quite as loud as the Walter, but it just sounded more fat and warm and punchy. However, that wasn't quite enough for me (still not enough mid hammer for my needs), and when I got the AE410... that was that.

I'm thinking the AE212 should be just a touch less 'in your face' than the AE410, with a bit more absolute low end and a touch less upper mid aggression. So, if I'm right, you should totally dig it! Mine is ordered and paid for, so I should get it relatively soon. I'll put up a clip versus the AE410!

[foderaman]

I would like to try one of the New AE212 myself also wouldn,t mind picking up a used AG Whappo Jr. at sometime?

[foderaman]

My only problem I would have to consider with a Whappo Jr is the transporting of it?I have a Beemer 330i Sedan and while I can fit a Berg AE410 in it with very little problems the Jr is a tad bigger and may be a little tight getting into door way in rear seat?The new ones are listed at 62 pounds.That is one reason I was wondering about a Tri 115L and use my Tri 112L as a portable El Whappo?Anyone have any more input.KJung I know you had or Have a Schroeder 115L how do you think it may pair up with a AG Tri112L ?

[Dan Knowlton]

Originally Posted by foderaman

My only problem I would have to consider with a Whappo Jr is the transporting of it?I have a Beemer 330i Sedan and while I can fit a Berg AE410 in it with very little problems the Jr is a tad bigger and may be a little tight getting into door way in rear seat?The new ones are listed at 62 pounds.That is one reason I was wondering about a Tri 115L and use my Tri 112L as a portable El Whappo?Anyone have any more input.KJung I know you had or Have a Schroeder 115L how do you think it may pair up with a AG Tri112L ?

I had a 328 and could not fit the Tri-115. I've since traded in the 328 for a new 4Runner and am much happier with the space (go figure...). Miss the 328, though!

FWIW, I used a TecAmp S-212 while I had the car.

Dan K.

[Dan Knowlton]

Originally Posted by foderaman

I would like to try one of the New AE212 myself also wouldn,t mind picking up a used AG Whappo Jr. at sometime?

Forgot to add...the Whappo Jr. is my FAVORITE cab ever. Pairing it with my Glockenklang HeartCore was almost a religious experience, except for the weight. But I sure like my Shuttle 6.0/Tri-115 rig.

Dan K.

[foderaman]

I had a Tri210L a few years back and was able to fit it in the back seat and according to the specs the Tri115L is the same size as the 210Lbut was thinking of the Whappo Jr as a one cab solution?I know the Berg AE212 will fit with no problem.